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Elk M1 shopping list for new system


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#1 etc6849

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 12:34 PM

I've never installed an ELK M1, but plan to in the next month or so. Just have a few questions on what and where to buy...

1. Below is my parts list, am I missing anything?
2. Is there a zoned audio output option that would allow me to send a mesage to speaker 1 but not speaker 2?
3. Is it cheaper to buy the complete M1GSYS4S eventhough I'm buying the larger enclosure?
4. Also, where's the cheapest place to buy Elk Products?
5. I found a place on google found here that appears to be much cheaper than asihome... Anyone bought from them? Obviously I plan to give asihome a chance to come close to their price though...
http://www.surveille...nd=ELK-M1GSYS4S
There's also this site:
http://www.securitys...ELK-s/12579.htm

Description Model Qty
Elk M1KP2 LCD Keypad, 4 Function Keys ELK-M1KP2 2
Flush-Mount Kit for M1 LCD Keypad ELK-M1BBK2 3
M1 Databus Hub ELK-M1DBH 1
M1 16 Zone Input Expander ELK-M1XIN 1
Elk 28-Inch Universal Structured Wiring Panel SWB-28 ELK-SWB28 1
Flush Mount Speaker, 12W, 32 Ohm ELK-SP12F 3
Battery Shelf for Structured Wiring Panel - Elk SWS ELK-SWS 1
Nylon Standoffs for 1288 10-Pack ELK-SWNS1 1
Elk M1GSYS4S Gold Security System with Semi-Flush-Mount Keypad ELK-M1GSYS 1

#2 Digger

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 01:46 PM

I would stick with ASI as you mentioned or Automated Outlet etc over the two distributors you linked. Look a their return policies etc closely. Also I think you would get much better support at ASI or AO.

Hard to tell if you are missing anything but consider things like water sensors, CO detectors etc.

#3 etc6849

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 01:57 PM

Digger, thanks for the feedback. If Asihome comes down some I may very well pay more and order from them. Asihome usually gives a discount if your order is large; I ordered a large vizia rf+ lighting system from them and they ended up beating every price I found online (when I called and got a quote from them).

What would be your recommendation for a water sensor? How about PIR sensors for the purpose below...

I'm thinking about installing PIR near each door way for the sole purpose of occupancy tracking and lighting control. The home I just bought aleardy had some PIRs in the general areas so these PIRs wouldn't need to be used for security. The plan is to wire each PIR to its own zone and then interface the zones in Premise via a free driver 123 made that supports the M1G (http://www.cocoontech.com/wiki/Premise). Premise is my rules will be programmed so that the Elk can work well with everything else I have. I want a PIR that gives a fast response as it will trigger lights, but also one that doesn't have many false activations (I have a small dog too). Any thoughts?

#4 johnboy

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:01 PM

If you have the space I would recommend a 42" panel - the extra space can never hurt

#5 Digger

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:01 PM

I have always used GRI Water Sensors. They are reasonably priced and seem to have a good reputation for quality. For PIR Sensors I only use a few for lighting automation in my house (simple GE PI600) and we have two cats and a dog and have never noticed them turning a light on for one of the pets. Then again when we are not home the pets probably have a party.

The same PIR's are used for security and we dont get false alarms. Years ago I ran the system with no Central station for a few months to work out the bugs and I did have one detector false alarming from light entering a window and reflecting off a mirror and fooling the PIR. I moved it and its fine.

One suggestion...... if you have a washing machine that empties into a laundry sink you may want to put a sensor about 4 inches from the top of the sink so it alerts you before you have an overflow. I got around to that to late :horse:. Live an learn.

#6 jwilson56

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:09 PM

Actually for the laundry tub I use this as well as a water sensor as it reacts quickly to prevent overflow.


http://www.washerwat...her_watcher.htm

#7 etc6849

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:21 PM

Good tip as I was thinking about sticking more stuff in there as time goes by. I thought 28" would be enough room, but if I'm going through the trouble, why not buy a 48" panel...

I didn't see a 48" panel on elks site. Is the hole spacing standardized between structured wiring panels? What panel did you have in mind?

If you have the space I would recommend a 42" panel - the extra space can never hurt



#8 etc6849

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:25 PM

Neat little device. I guess the only situation it doesn't remedy is if you have a hose burst (which happens) and you're out of town. I looked at the Elk water main shutoff valve and it's pretty expensive.

Actually for the laundry tub I use this as well as a water sensor as it reacts quickly to prevent overflow.


http://www.washerwat...her_watcher.htm



#9 jwilson56

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 05:50 PM

Neat little device. I guess the only situation it doesn't remedy is if you have a hose burst (which happens) and you're out of town. I looked at the Elk water main shutoff valve and it's pretty expensive.

Actually for the laundry tub I use this as well as a water sensor as it reacts quickly to prevent overflow.


http://www.washerwat...her_watcher.htm



Well my EZ8 will detect the water on the floor and then text page my cellphone through Girder warning me. There is a drain nearby so it will be somewhat ok till I get home to shut off the water. What this beats is not to have soap suds all over the place when you can prevent it.

#10 Digger

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 10:06 PM

Actually for the laundry tub I use this as well as a water sensor as it reacts quickly to prevent overflow.


http://www.washerwat...her_watcher.htm


Thats what I do with UPB. Same price in the end for me, however, I also have it that in a fire condition I shut down a lot of things in the house including washers and dryers (well not the electric dryer yet just the gas dryer)

#11 johnboy

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 08:00 AM

Good tip as I was thinking about sticking more stuff in there as time goes by. I thought 28" would be enough room, but if I'm going through the trouble, why not buy a 48" panel...

I didn't see a 48" panel on elks site. Is the hole spacing standardized between structured wiring panels? What panel did you have in mind?

If you have the space I would recommend a 42" panel - the extra space can never hurt



I have a 42" leviton can - only downside is the one I have does not lock, but I have the panel in a locked basement room so I thought that would be enough. I assume that a lock can be bought for it if needed.

The elk main board fits in with no problem, for the expansion models you can buy these which add a little bit of cost but IMO were well worth it to make a clean installation.

The extra space allowed be to snap in a couple of Leviton telephone and ethernet distribution modules which of course did not need adaptor plates.

#12 wuench

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 09:35 AM

No M1XEP? The Ethernet interface is almost a must have...

#13 etc6849

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 11:44 AM

Good point. I'm kind of surprised the M1G doesn't have ethernet built in?!? I just re-read the manual and you're right no ethernet!

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what will ethernet give me that RS232 won't? Obviously I will lose the email capability and won't be able to operate the M1G over the internet, but is there anything else I should be aware of? I don't plan on using these functions through the M1G since my Premise server can do that for me (and for free).

If it functions the same programming wise, I had planned on using the RS232 port for programming and firmware updates.

No M1XEP? The Ethernet interface is almost a must have...


Edited by etc6849, 24 October 2010 - 11:48 AM.


#14 johnboy

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 12:00 PM

Good point. I'm kind of surprised the M1G doesn't have ethernet built in?!? I just re-read the manual and you're right no ethernet!

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what will ethernet give me that RS232 won't? Obviously I will lose the email capability and won't be able to operate the M1G over the internet, but is there anything else I should be aware of? I don't plan on using these functions through the M1G since my Premise server can do that for me (and for free).

If it functions the same programming wise, I had planned on using the RS232 port for programming and firmware updates.

No M1XEP? The Ethernet interface is almost a must have...


I have installed both the RS-232 and the M1XEP.

I installed RS-232 at my sister's house (Although I thought something needed to be bought for that anyway, it was cheaper, but I can't remember) because she wanted to save some $$ and was not a "power user" like myself. She has homeseer and it works just fine over the RS-232 although I can't comment on response latency, I think it is OK but I haven't really noticed one way or the other.

I installed the M1EXP in my own house, I also use it with homeseer so i don't need email functionality, etc. The one major difference I know of in this case is I can leave homeseer connected and connect with the elkRP software at the same time from programming over ethernet. This has been a great convenience during initial setup, although I realize that once everything is up and running I won't need to do that very often.

I am also very happy with the speed of the communications. I have F4 on my bedroom keypad set up to trigger my "go to bed" homeseer script, which in turn sends a command back to the ELK to arm. This happens so fast when I hit the button that it does not feel like there is a round trip to homeseer even involved.

#15 etc6849

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 02:57 PM

Thanks John and Wuench you've convinced me on adding an M1XEP to my list! Anyone know if the Elk M1G supports socket communications, i.e. will I be able to use ethernet to telent in and test using the ascii RS232 protocol? Basically if I can send the commmands over telnet, I can trick Premise into using the network to communicate with the M1 and not the RS232 port.

Thanks in advance... Sorry I don't have access to the technical documentation until I gain dealer site access...




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