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Elk M1 shopping list for new system


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#16 wuench

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 06:45 PM

Thanks John and Wuench you've convinced me on adding an M1XEP to my list! Anyone know if the Elk M1G supports socket communications, i.e. will I be able to use ethernet to telent in and test using the ascii RS232 protocol? Basically if I can send the commmands over telnet, I can trick Premise into using the network to communicate with the M1 and not the RS232 port.

Thanks in advance... Sorry I don't have access to the technical documentation until I gain dealer site access...


Yes, you can telnet to it if you enable the non-secure port, then just use the well documented serial protocol (available on elkproducts.com), there is some checksum stuff you will need to do though. The secure port is telnet through SSL with a login prompt.

Edited by wuench, 24 October 2010 - 06:48 PM.


#17 etc6849

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 10:05 PM

That's very nice. The checksum stuff is easy as the current Premise driver (called a module) that 123 wrote already works over rs232. There's a neat trick in Premise that if you add a Lantronix UDS10 device through software (you don't actually add a real Lantronix UDS10 to your system, just the software driver within Premise) you can use the UDS10's ip address and port to point to the device accepting socket communic'sations, then bind the rs232 port of the ficticious UDS-10 to the device's module (in this case the Elk M1G). This will trick the Elk M1G's module into thinking it's connected to a real RS232 connection.

At any rate, what does everyone use for wired PIR pet friendly sensors? I tried searching for the GE PIR recommended earlier, but couldn't find it ;)

#18 Digger

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Posted 24 October 2010 - 10:27 PM

That's very nice. The checksum stuff is easy as the current Premise driver (called a module) that 123 wrote already works over rs232. There's a neat trick in Premise that if you add a Lantronix UDS10 device through software (you don't actually add a real Lantronix UDS10 to your system, just the software driver within Premise) you can use the UDS10's ip address and port to point to the device accepting socket communic'sations, then bind the rs232 port of the ficticious UDS-10 to the device's module (in this case the Elk M1G). This will trick the Elk M1G's module into thinking it's connected to a real RS232 connection.

At any rate, what does everyone use for wired PIR pet friendly sensors? I tried searching for the GE PIR recommended earlier, but couldn't find it ;)



Still find them on ebay but its a popular detector so it should be everywhere

GE PIR

#19 Work2Play

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 02:10 AM

2. I've been thinking about doing this; my intended solution is to use the Elk 800 to power a second "zone" and use a relay to turn it on/off as desired (ie - status messages don't play through bedrooms during quiet time, but alarm messages would. There are of course no internal provisions for this.
3. I had the same issue- later the 14" can found a home in the garage housing the XOVR and M1RB (giving me 16 relays in the garage) - serving to control my sprinklers and garage door openers and other misc accessories. It never went to waste. **I also agree that the larger the can the better now; I have a 50" Channel Vision can waiting to be installed with the locking plexi door - looks slick! Come to think of it, I didn't use a few parts of that package; they're still on my shelf.

Parts List:
  • You don't seem to have anything for outputs - do you have anything you want to control that needs contact closure (Garage doors, sprinklers, pool fill valve, etc)? I was using 20 outputs at my last house (8 went to the voice recordable module so I could play custom sounds through the house - like doorbell, halloween sounds, etc).
  • I don't see any M1XSP's - the serial interfaces used to connect to thermostats, lighting systems, etc. Are you doing either?
  • Look into universal mounting plates for the accessories; maybe just buy one of each so you can play with them and see which one fits when. Also, I use the gel-filled connectors a bit, and even the foam double-sided stickies when I don't feel like drilling to make things work on the plates. My Elk plates do fit my ChannelVision Can; and most of my Leviton and OnQ accessories seem to fit it as well.
  • I don't see sirens? Indoors, I use the elk sirens through the keypad speakers, but those are a bit weak; I augmented with a pair of GE Screamers. Also, for exterior, I recommend a speaker and not a siren; I bought the wrong one first and found that I'd prefer to let the Elk drive the sound it makes; it makes a few other things easier.

You caught a lot of the good stuff though - like the battery tray, and the speakers that go behind the keypads; those were important for me.

#20 etc6849

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 04:20 PM

Work2Play, thank you for your comments!

I've added the Elk 16 Output Expander, 8 Voltage & 8 Relays (ELK-M1XOVR) to my list thanks :P It looked like this was the most versatile option...?

[*]You don't seem to have anything for outputs - do you have anything you want to control that needs contact closure (Garage doors, sprinklers, pool fill valve, etc)? I was using 20 outputs at my last house (8 went to the voice recordable module so I could play custom sounds through the house - like doorbell, halloween sounds, etc).


I intend to use Premise to interface with my serial modules. It would get too expensive to interface everything directly with the M1G.

[*]I don't see any M1XSP's - the serial interfaces used to connect to thermostats, lighting systems, etc. Are you doing either?


Maybe I should be looking at a ChannelVision can or are the hole spacings usually identical for cans accross brands?

[*]Look into universal mounting plates for the accessories; maybe just buy one of each so you can play with them and see which one fits when. Also, I use the gel-filled connectors a bit, and even the foam double-sided stickies when I don't feel like drilling to make things work on the plates. My Elk plates do fit my ChannelVision Can; and most of my Leviton and OnQ accessories seem to fit it as well.


As you point out, I plan to use three of these each mounted behind the KP2 keypads: Flush Mount Speaker, 12W, 32 Ohm ELK-SP12F

I like the idea of an exterior speaker for the deck area, but any suggestions on which speaker to use for outdoor use? I'm assuming one wires the speakers all in a parallel or series so that the total impedance is > 4 ohms.

[*]I don't see sirens? Indoors, I use the elk sirens through the keypad speakers, but those are a bit weak; I augmented with a pair of GE Screamers. Also, for exterior, I recommend a speaker and not a siren; I bought the wrong one first and found that I'd prefer to let the Elk drive the sound it makes; it makes a few other things easier.


PS: does everyone wire up their system using cat6 23 guage wire? This is what I had planned... What's the max current draw I might see on something like a siren? I'm thinking a siren (don't have one planned for now) is the only current draw I'll have to worry about using cat6.

Edited by etc6849, 25 October 2010 - 06:03 PM.


#21 Work2Play

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 03:24 AM

I bought a siren initially, then after discovering more about the Elk, I moved away. I'd use a speaker and let the built-in siren driver in the Elk handle the sounds. There are a few reasons but basically it works better and it's less hassle.

I'm not sure about the deck speaker unless you have it switched and only use it when desired; depending on where you live, you probably don't want your everyday messages being broadcast to anyone who can hear.

My experience with cans/accessories is limited, hence my trial/error. It'd be great if an installer could chime in who's used a bunch. I chose channel vision because it's the biggest and has the best looking door (for a price). And, it has an option where you can put a 2" spacer on the front and some accessories inside that let you double-stack the rack if desired; meaning you'd have two layers of equipment rather than one - and the top one folds out of the way to get to the bottom layer.

Cat5 should be fine; use a current calculator to double-check; many people double-up pairs for good measure. That said, personally I'd much rather work with thin stranded wires - they're just easier to work with... but, you wire with what's handy. Cat5 isn't as resilient to the twists and bends before it breaks. Regardless, people do it all the time and it works fine for them.

#22 murphy

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Posted 31 October 2010 - 11:35 PM

I suggest you to protect your equipment with the

ELK-950 Telephone and Low Voltage AC Line Surge Suppressor module.

Just because bad weather can happen nearly everywhere.

I'm living in an area with sometimes heavy thunderstorms.
Without these modules I had several damaged M1G,
since I installed these modules in the 24 VAC-line and telefone-line: no failures.

#23 etc6849

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 08:51 AM

Thanks for the suggestion :( I'll have to price out the ELk-950 and see. Sounds like a good idea.

Is there a way to give each speaker it's own zone? By this I mean I want to be able to play a notice for one zone, but not the other zones. I'm thinking there may be some small external speaker switcher I could wire the output of the M1G too, then branch the speakers out from the small switcher. Serial control would be preferred for such a device... Can the M1G alone handle the control for such a device?

UPDATE: I now have a 42" Leviton panel installed with 2-2" conduits going to the attic and 2-1.5" conduits going under the home. I think I'm finally ready to start ordering.

Edited by etc6849, 02 November 2010 - 08:53 AM.


#24 Digger

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 12:12 PM

Thanks for the suggestion :( I'll have to price out the ELk-950 and see. Sounds like a good idea.


It is great advice frm Murphy.

The ELK-950 is worth every penny. I dont remember the cost off the top of my head but I beleive retial is less than $40. The biggest risk to alarm panels are usually transients and if you are putting in anything more than a $99 special it is well worth the money.

#25 Photon

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 12:47 PM

PS: does everyone wire up their system using cat6 23 guage wire? This is what I had planned... What's the max current draw I might see on something like a siren? I'm thinking a siren (don't have one planned for now) is the only current draw I'll have to worry about using cat6.


Cat5 or 6 is fine for the devices that pass the RS485 data bus. However, it is rather bulky, so I wouldn't use it for every PIR, glass break, and door/window contact. I think you will find your enclosure will be much easier to work in if you use 22/2 and 22/4 where it is appropriate like these sensors I mentioned. Of course some devices may require even larger gauge (smaller number) wire. Examples: some sirens/bells, some strobes, irrigation valves, low-voltage yard lights.

#26 etc6849

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 01:12 PM

Bulkiness is an issue especially considering I only have a few conduits that allow passage from the attic to the first level (two story home). Where's a good place to buy 22/4? I looked in Home Depot and it was $89 for 500 feet... Much more than the 23 AWG Cat 6 1000 ft I bought from Lowes for $119. I live near Columbia, SC if that helps... I miss living near Fry's Electronics.

Most of the lower sensors were prewired with various colors of 22/4 which is a lot small than the Cat 6 stuff I have. I just took out the old Ademco alarm system and ran the wires into the back of the new 42" panel. I also put in 4 conduit runs to the new panel.

Edited by etc6849, 02 November 2010 - 01:13 PM.


#27 Bon Bon

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 06:40 PM

Have you tried monoprice.com or firefold.com? I have found them to have be the best pricing on the net. No free shipping though :(

Bulkiness is an issue especially considering I only have a few conduits that allow passage from the attic to the first level (two story home). Where's a good place to buy 22/4? I looked in Home Depot and it was $89 for 500 feet... Much more than the 23 AWG Cat 6 1000 ft I bought from Lowes for $119. I live near Columbia, SC if that helps... I miss living near Fry's Electronics.

Most of the lower sensors were prewired with various colors of 22/4 which is a lot small than the Cat 6 stuff I have. I just took out the old Ademco alarm system and ran the wires into the back of the new 42" panel. I also put in 4 conduit runs to the new panel.



#28 Bon Bon

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 06:50 PM

Have you tried monoprice.com or firefold.com? I have found them to have be the best pricing on the net. No free shipping though :(

Found skywalker wire 22/4 on Amazon 1000ft for $69.99



Have you tried monoprice.com or firefold.com? I have found them to have be the best pricing on the net. No free shipping though :(




#29 etc6849

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 05:26 PM

Thanks! That's not a bad price :)




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