KLD Water Valve Install Guide

Hello All,

This thread is a continuation from the Group Water Valve Buy and is ment to discuss different installation possibilities, home automation integration, possible sensors that may be run inconjunction with these valves, or anything else that will be revelant to the valves.

Here is the Group Buy Page:http://cocoontech.com/forums/topic/24201-water-valve-group-buy/page-9#entry203974

CharlieWayne

Thank-you Charlie.
 
Going very slow with this endeavor. 
 
I have redone my plumbing a bit where the new water meter is using brass elbows and copper pipes.
 
I am looking to mount the switch in a horizontal pipe adjacent to the new water meter.  Will take pictures of what I am playing with.

I've come up with a reversible control for the DC motor using two alarm outputs (one for each direction) of the motorized valve. 
 
Pete, can you assist in making one of your fancy drawings or sharing with me the software used? 

Here are Two Suggestions from another Member on how to have the position status of these valves reporting to a HS system.
 
Thanks again Bucko for your contribution. 
 
 

bucko said:

Now that you all will be using these valves, I'll give you a little hint on modifying them so you have dry contact I/O for a signal wire to set up a zone with. Then the Elk will report valve open/closed as a zone id.
 
I have been using this valve here in China for 1 year now. It works great, and tied into my Elk so I can use an Elk relay to operate it. If my water sensor detects a leak, Elk rules fire the relay to immediately shut off main water. The zone reporting is nice to have as I also use it with my Vera controller for all my HA needs. i.e when I arm the Elk, the water valve will close.
 
Pop off the top cover. The manual knob has a screw under knob's label.
You can now see the PCB where there is a white rotating cam that moves when you open/close the valve. Notice 2 micro switches touching this cam. They are not used, so you can solder a 4/22 wire to it and use them as a dry contact. The switch is N/O. Now simply drill a hole in the top cover to run your wire out for a zone connection. Be sure to silicon the hole to prevent water getting inside.
 
 
There you go!

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bucko said:

The cam and micro switch is located under the PCB. Just remove the 1 screw and lift up the PCB. You don't have to take off the PCB. I used the micro switch which is a 9 o'clock to your pic. The other micro switch is used to reverse the motor.

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Below are the Manuals for the valves that Dgage contributed. 
 
 

dgage said:

Also, they emailed me the manuals so here they are.
 
KLD20S
https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=61D09877E8D3D575!41748&authkey=!AABYCTp8LcmKZdE
 
KLD100
https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=61D09877E8D3D575!41749&authkey=!AKKLURapOv2aga0

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Hello Charlie,
 

Pete, can you assist in making one of your fancy drawings or sharing with me the software used? 

Click to expand...

I just use MS Visio and a very old program called Polyview.  Polyview is a sort of "baby" Adobe Photoshop.  I drop the picture into Visio; add stuff, then copy the completed drawing to Polyview.  I am not really good with colors though.
 
I have yet to take apart the switch.  It still sitting in a box.  I don't want to solder anything to the board until I take it apart and have a good look at it.
 
Are you using the 12VDC output from the Elk panel or do you take it to another solenoid? 
 
Do you have a secondary power supply on your panel?

I've come up with Two possible ways to wire this and both methods utilize a DPDT relay being we purchased the B2 wired boards. The DPDT Relay I have chosen is the ELK-924 Sensitive Relay for around 15 dollars. Two different powers are required (Trigger & Supply). 
 
Trigger ->> Requirements for this ELK-924 are very low at only 1.2 milliamp and most any alarm output can handle this.  The trigger is used to change the polarity of the water valve. When Voltage is applied to the trigger input the water valve will open (but the supply voltage must also be present).
 
Supply -->> Requirements for each Water Valve are (KLD20S is 3 watts or 250 milliamps; KLD100 is 15 watt or 1500 milliamps).. Also the Coil on the DPDT has a current draw of 60 milliamps. When you combine the load of the motorized valve and coil relay you will far exceed the potential of a regular alarm panel output, thus if you desire to have switched supply power you will have to run a SPDT relay prior to the ELK-924 Relay.
 
Personally I plan to wire mine in using method 1 because in the event of electrical loss or trigger not being applied the water valve will be in the closed position. Just my preference but time will tell. 
 
1) Failsafe method to close the valve when Trigger voltage is not applied to the relay. To achieve this, Fused DC voltage must be constantly applied to the POS & NEG Supply so that the relay will close the valve through the NC sides when trigger voltage is not present. This method will only utilize 1 alarm voltage output to trigger input on the DPDT relay which will open the water valve and a separate Fused 12 volt supply to the power and ground on the DPDT that will close the water valve. 
 
2) Second method is to apply voltage only when actions are needed. The Supply voltage to the ELK-924 Sensitive Relay will be controlled by a separate SPDT relay OR a Alarm Relay Output. That SPDT will receive its Trigger voltage from an alarm voltage output and its supply voltage from a fused power supply. The method will utilize 2 alarm voltage outputs ( 1 output per each trigger input on the relays) and 12 fused power will feed the SPDT relay.
 
It may be necessary to have a return ground for the trigger going to the DPDT coil but this will likely only be if you run a different power supply then the trigger source.
 
All the above is simply to turn the valve on and off. 
 
SO HOW TO CONTROL THE WATER VALVE WITH HA...
 
Closing the Valve: Power applied to the "Power Terminals" on DPDT only will close the water valve. This power sources must have a min amp capacity of 300 milliamp for the KLD20S or 1600 milliamp for the KLD100. Possibly sources are either a Relay Output on an Alarm Panel or Separate 12V power source. 
 
Opening the Valve: Power Applied to the "Trigger Terminals" on DPDT will trigger the DPDT to reverse to polarity of the water valve, causing it to open But at the same time power must be applied to the "Power Terminals". The Trigger power source must have a min power source of 60 milliamps and a regular alarm output or alarm relay output would work.
 
 
 

I like methodology #1 only because it is a failsafe.  #2 because its only using voltage when needed; such that I like this a bit better; if that makes any sense?
 
I edited the schematic a bit removing some of the text on it using Polyview.  I can send you the base visio stuff and edited jpgs. 
 
Have you taken the cover off the switch to have a look at the PCB?

Please excuse the multi posts but the forum will only allow so many pics loaded at a time. 
 
This photo was shot with the Valve in the Open position.  
 
The water will flow left to right or right to left in these pictures. 
 

 
 

The "W1" & "W4" seems to be valve position sensors and I will assume they work of magnets as you will see in the coming photos of the bottom side of the black wheel. 
 
Like I said above the valve is in the Open position and you can see the line with the red arrow pointing towards it will report that the valve is open. 
 

Here you can see the board and have a clear view of how the magnetic wheel straddles those two position sensors. 
 
 
 

And a shot of the bottom side of the PCB.
 

Heres the bottom side of that position wheel. With the retainer plate that goes on the top (you will see it in previous pics with the paint marker dot on it) I can pick this up with my magnetic screw driver but nothing on this round position cam is magnetic from what I can feel. So I am lost on how it can change the W1 or W4 switches. 
 
That line that I had a red arrow pointing to on the topside, well coming down the side of the round cam is a slit in the plastic. 
 
So I am lost here on how position is found to stop the motor from turning past its stop position.
 

 
 

Pete. 
 
The valve's we purchased have the B2 wiring.  

I think it would be better to draw in the wiring on the Diagram of the Elk DPDT relay.
 
Heres our wiring but it will get confusing trying to use this as a template. 
 

pete_c said:

I like methodology #1 only because it is a failsafe.  #2 because its only using voltage when needed; such that I like this a bit better; if that makes any sense?

Click to expand...

Hows does the saying go? You cant have your cake and eat it too!!  LOL> 
 
I'll cover some ideas later today or early tomorrow cause I'm running low on steam. 
 
Things I still want to write about are Fused Supply Sources, Various Possible HA Interfaces, and maybe a couple Logic ideas on events we can use to run these valves. 
 
If anyone else has anything by all means please share. 
 
Thanks
 
CharlieWayne.