Basic Security System

I have been lurking around this forum and AVS forum for a while as we are in the process of building a new house.
I am a newbie, and a lot of the technology that is discussed on this forum is above me.
I am looking for some advice on selecting security system components for the house under construction.
I will have access to open walls, basement, attic etc, so I would like to go hardwired and pre wire while I am doing structured wiring pre-wire for CAT6 and RG6.
I am looking for a fairly flexible system, but am not particularly concerned with home automation.
I will use either IP or VOIP monitoring (not sure with who yet)
I need about 6 PIRS, 6 doors, 16 windows, 3 smoke detectors and 2 keypads.
I like the ELK system, but am wondering whether I need the features (and expense) of that system. Other than that I have looked at DSC and Honeywell setups, but am unsure what the flexibility of these systems is.
I would like to be able to customize arming zones etc, (if we wanted to leave an upstairs window open overnight for cool air etc, or turn off some of the PIR zones, but not all etc. that is what I mean by flexibility, as well as availability of quality accessories such as ROKONET or Bosch Blue Line PIRs. I will also be installing it myself.
I know this is a basic request and probably sparks more questions than answers, but I appreciate any insight that anyone can give me.
Thanks!

Run your four conductor cables for MS to a few room corners watching the windows plus windows if wanted. Of course one to a few door frames for door closed and also keypad panels. Run at least double CAT6 to each room. Possibly quad to your entertainment system areas. Run 3-4 RG6 to your home entertainment area. 2 sat TV (for HD) lines and one out to other areas take 3 minimum. You may want PoE or power and CAT6 line to your porch soffits for an IP camera. RG6 to an high area for your modem/router ntenna and CAT6 back to central spot.
 
Don't worry about HA as most systems use powerline wiring and/or RF as in Insteon dual band mess networks systems etc... That can all be accommodated later.
 
Oh yeah.. tend to run your light switch power to switch boxes first so you have a neutral there and not to the octagon boxes first. You will have to use deeper switch boxes to accommodate all the wires there as well as dimmers/HA switches. Don't short change any regular wiring due to HA plans. You'll appreciate that when you try to sell the home with the HA stripped.
 
The ISY HA system integrates with the ELK system quite well as experienced by many on the UDI forum. I have no experience with the Elk so cannot comment but a lot of high-tech guys swear by it.

Thanks for the info. Very Useful!
I am not really anticipating doing any home automation, but really more looking for a good reliable DIY wired security system.
Biggest thing is good compatibility with 3rd party PIRs, components etc and the ability to customize the setup of it in terms of arming zones.
Have done some looking at Ademco/Honeywell as well as DSC. Just not sure of their flexibility.

Have you looked at DSC Powerseries Neo?   Its what I am considering but it does not support the EnvisaLink 3

geordieboy said:

Thanks for the info. Very Useful!
I am not really anticipating doing any home automation, but really more looking for a good reliable DIY wired security system.
Biggest thing is good compatibility with 3rd party PIRs, components etc and the ability to customize the setup of it in terms of arming zones.
Have done some looking at Ademco/Honeywell as well as DSC. Just not sure of their flexibility.

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PIRs, 4-wire smoke detectors, etc are pretty standard in terms of their ability to work with any panel, although if you are going to use 2-wire smoke detectors, you need to get a brand/model that is compatible with the panel you are using it with.
 
For basic security, a Honeywell or DSC panel will do what you say you need.  You can bypass zones if you want to leave a window open, etc, but you will have to bypass the open window zones each time you arm the system. Once the system is armed, if you want to open a window, you will have to disarm the system, open the window, and then re-arm the system and bypass the window zone.
 
Most alarm panels support both armed-away mode, which arms everything, and armed-stay mode that allow you to disable some/all of the PIRs and other interior protection, while leaving the doors and windows armed.

Thanks!
Any real difference between DSC vs ademco/Honeywell?

geordieboy said:

Any real difference between DSC vs ademco/Honeywell?

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I looked at DSC, Honeywell and Elk before settling on the Elk.  To me, the DSC and Honeywell seemed pretty equivalent.  I suspect some of the pros here who have experience with both can answer the question better than I can.   If you were interested in using the panel with wireless devices, I'd probably go with a Honeywell panel, as there are more options available in terms of the sensors it will work with.

From having installed all of the panels listed and more in my years....the build quality of DSC is behind others. While many may disagree, DSC has always been a budget line panel and offers bullet point features as a "me too" to flesh out the cut sheets. Engineering and reliability are always an afterthought. I've RMA'd semis worth of DSC equipment before.
 
As far as the 2/4 wire arguement, there's only a small handful of manufacturers that aren't "current" on their listings and compatibilities, but given the right intermediate hardware, you can install a 2 wire fire loop of an "incompatible" manufacturer on any panel and be compliant.

Thanks. I am leaning towards a honeywell vista 20p or 21ip as it seems to have the expansion capabilities plus the wireless and IP connectivity for monitoring. Any other suggestions or experience with this setup? Is it relatively easy to setup and program?

geordieboy said:

Is it relatively easy to setup and program?

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It all depends on what you mean by easy!     There are lots of details to learn about for any alarm panel. Like almost everyone starting out, you are bound to make a few mistakes the first time through, or be stumped by something that just doesn't seem to make sense until someone explains it.  Fortunately, there are lots of people here who can help.
 
[Edit]:  You'll find some videos on Youtube about installing and setting up Vista and DSC panels.  That's a good place to start, in addition to reading the manuals.
 
One thing to consider about using IP or VoIP for monitoring... some folks here feel that it just isn't reliable enough for use as a primary communications method.  If you don't have a hardwired landline, seriously consider using a cellular system as the primary communications link.  Part of the reliability issue depends on your local ISP, and how well they handle power failures and such.  But another part is the reliability of the internet itself, which is something your ISP cannot control, no matter how good they are.

One that I didn't plan was an RG6, CAT5/6 and a power receptacle on the wall at the end of the wife's relax tub for the flat-screen TV.

thanks for the note on the VOIP and IP monitoring.
I am thinking about starting with the Honeywell Vista base kit V20P-TOTAL that includes the GSMV4G Honeywell 4G Cellular Communicator w/ Transformer.
What is a little confusing is that it talks about total connect and alarmnet.
Is this a Honeywell monitoring service that you have to subscribe to (for a cost) if you have this device in your system for GSM monitoring?
Can  you use someone like Alarm Relay and only pay their $9 per month?
I was also planning on getting a cheap AT&T sim and using GOphone prepaid for the service (maybe alarmsim.com)
 
Thanks for the insight!!

It depends on if you're looking at having integration as part of a service, which Alarmnet and TC are necessary or use a generic bolt on that runs off basic closures and status to enable remote arm/diasarm or other generic items.
 
How the cell connects to the panel is the main difference. Honeywell devices can use the ECP bus which is going to simplify almost everything and facilitate supervision a lot easier. Bolt on units are only going to be dialer capture, which require additional considerations.
 
These units and services are not intended for a BYO SIM or similar. I can't comment on how alarmsim works...no desire or need to go that route. Generally the devices have considerations for the particular carriers and networks.