Please Review my System Design

hardatk

Member
Hey guys... I finally have a design down on paper for my new house! It's an existing home, and I'm in the process of tearing apart the walls to run wire (we were going to paint anyway)... I would love your advice on my design, perhaps I left something out?
 
My plan is to run wired motion, glassbreak and external door sensors as well as external IP video cameras. I will also wire for keypads / panels, and for general network / TV access. I will be running 22/4 and cat6 to each sensor location. 22/4, cat6 and coax to each panel / keypad, and everywhere else will get cat6 & coax. I plan to use wired Nest protect as smoke / co alarms. I have not really seen a good alternative, nor do I think the smoke / co alarms need to be integrated with the system... but maybe I'm wrong? I haven't found a thermostat aside from the Nest that I really like... but this one makes more sense to integrate... I am also debating about whether or not to use wireless window sensors, I have quite a few windows and am not looking forward to having to wire them all... I want to add liquid / water / humidity sensors, ideally wireless as well... anything else I should add?
 
I still haven't decided between the Elk M1G and the HAI Omnipro II... I might use UPB for HA, and I've heard the Omnipro is better at UPB... I am looking at using the Bosch ISC-BDL2-WP12G TriTech Motion Sensor and either the Visonic GlassTech Acoustic Glassbreak Detector or the Honeywell Intellisense FG-730 Dual Flex-Guard Audio Glass-Break Detector... but I could use other recommendations. I'm not sure what door or window sensors I should use.
 
Here are basic diagrams of the layout... not pictured is the basement, where the wires will be homerun to an unfinished storage area that is my server room:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6Kb7sqiEGKeNGYtbnk0V0tJamM&authuser=0
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6Kb7sqiEGKeRUsxbkhfZ1o3OVU&authuser=0
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6Kb7sqiEGKeWEJ5eGNkNlp4akE&authuser=0
 
(I don't have privs to embed them, sorry)
 
I'd also be interested if anyone has a recommendation for a good 2D (free) home design / cad program so that I can make a floorplan that reflects the actual options / layout of my home.
 
Thanks!
 
Update!
 
I finally decided on the main components:
 
Controller: Hai OmniProII
Lighting: SAI UPB
Motions: Bosch ISC-BDL2-WP12G TriTech Motion Sensor
GlassBreaks: Visonic GlassTech
IP Cameras: HIKVISION DS-2CD2732F-IS
Consoles: Either Ipad or Surface3 tablets wall-mounted
Wired Exterior Doors: TBD
Wireless Internal Doors: TBD
Wireless Windows: TBD
Wireless Smoke / Thermal: TBD:
Wireless Water / Humidity
 
If there are good reasons why I should use wired sensors for something (smoke, water, etc) please let me know... I didn't wire for them in the current layout, but I might be able to add it in.
 
Just a few basic comments:
 
1) If I was able to wire my house again I would definitely wire in smokes to my panel. I don't have any gas appliances so I don't think I would do CO, except for possibly in my garage (for simple automation with the garage door). Basic smokes are fine for alerting you; if it's 2am and your house is on fire you want to know. Why would I wire them into my panel? Well, I'd also like the fire dept. to know as early as possible as well. There are others here that can talk to smoke/CO a lot better than I can, but I'd definitely do them. Heck, I've been debating hoping back up into my attic next winter and doing it anyway - it would have been a lot easier had I wired for them during construction.
 
2) I think 22/4 AND Cat6 to each sensor location is overkill. Personal opinion, obviously. YMMV.
 
3) I'd definitely wire windows and we rarely even open ours. The cost of doing this is negligable, especially if you are doing this yourself. It's easy to disable any sensor, or simply not use them for alarm purposes, but it's a LOT harder and/or more expensive to do it later.
 
I did do some research on here about wiring up smokes, and I thought that it was advised against, especially if your alarms ever trigger falsely. 
 
22/4 and cat6 is probably overkill, I agree... but cat6 is dirty cheap these days so if I'm already running one cable might as well put some cat6 there... if I never use it, ah well. What I'd hate to find out though is that I at some point need 18/2 for a sensor... 
 
I do want to add window sensors, no doubt about that... just not sure if wired vs. wireless is a huge difference. For motions it makes sense because they can report status constantly and never have power issues... but with windows if I never open them then it shouldn't matter much right? 
 
Wire the windows with 22/2. If you don't home run each one, then string them in groups with the EOLR at the end. You want full perimeter wired.

sketch up is free.

For out door cameras, wire a nearby motion to each camera. Video motion is still not very reliable.
 
hardatk said:
I did do some research on here about wiring up smokes, and I thought that it was advised against, especially if your alarms ever trigger falsely. 
 
22/4 and cat6 is probably overkill, I agree... but cat6 is dirty cheap these days so if I'm already running one cable might as well put some cat6 there... if I never use it, ah well. What I'd hate to find out though is that I at some point need 18/2 for a sensor... 
 
I do want to add window sensors, no doubt about that... just not sure if wired vs. wireless is a huge difference. For motions it makes sense because they can report status constantly and never have power issues... but with windows if I never open them then it shouldn't matter much right? 
 
I'll let someone else entertain that smoke/CO info; DEL is probably the resident expert regarding smokes and CO detection.
 
I don't know that I've seen any "sensors" that require 18/2. Certainly, your transformer to power the system will use it, as well as speakers/sirens... but I can't think of any alarm sensors that would off hand. If you're more comfortable with it there, go for it.
 
You may want to check into the price difference between wired and wireless sensors. Just a VERY quick reference: wired ($6.01) vs. wireless ($15.50); over double the cost. I count 14 windows on your first floor alone, so we're talking $84.14 vs. $212.10  ... and I'd much prefer a wired device to a wireless one. Also, don't forget that with the wireless sensors you'd also need to add the compatible wireless receiver to your system as well.
 
You'll need 18-2 or 18-4 for wired smokes, if you choose to use them.  But if you do have smoke detectors connected to the alarm panel, you will probably still need conventional smoke alarms to keep the AHJ happy.   I agree with drvnbysound that smokes connected to the alarm panel are worth having.   Getting the fire department there a few minutes faster may make the difference between a containable fire and a total loss. If properly installed, you should have very few false alarms.
 
if my current detectors are all connected is it possible to wire one to the panel and have it trip when any of them go off?
 
Only use smokes designed for connecting to alarm panels. Common units connect together, but are not able to connect to alarm panels usually due to CODE reasons, and the electrical interface is not compatible with a panel. You could do it with some relays, but check your local code, it's probably not allowed.
 
 
hardatk said:
if my current detectors are all connected is it possible to wire one to the panel and have it trip when any of them go off?
 
hardatk said:
I'd also be interested if anyone has a recommendation for a good 2D (free) home design / cad program so that I can make a floorplan that reflects the actual options / layout of my home.
 
AutoCAD gives a 30 day free trial without limitations to printing.  Draftsight is free to individuals.  Sketchup is free too but 3D.  
 
Or...if you are able to provide a clean PDF for each floor and a scan of a markup that shows the plan differences and all the room dimensions...I can draft it in my free time.
 
Thanks I'll look at Draftsight / TinyCAD... I don't really like the Sketchup interface, it's great for 3D... but adds more complexity than I need if I just want a 2D plan.
 
I've used AutoCAD plenty and would totally go that route, but I'd rather have something that's completely free so that I can continue to use it and update it.
 
Any suggestions for sensors (especially window / door)? I have yet to find a good site / forum that reviews them so that would be helpful too.
 
hardatk said:
Any suggestions for sensors (especially window / door)? I have yet to find a good site / forum that reviews them so that would be helpful too.
 
For window and door sensors, there are lots of options.
 
First, you need to think about whether surface mount or concealed sensors are what you want.  The type of window you are trying to protect might influence your choice.
 
For wired contacts, there are many good choices from Interlogix/Sentrol/GE, Honeywell/Ademco,  GRI, Tane plus others.
 
If you go with wireless contacts, then your choices will be determined partly by which alarm panel you choose and which wireless contacts it supports.
 
Elk has receivers that are compatible with Honeywell and GE/Interlogix contacts, as well as their own proprietary two-way wireless contacts.
 
The Omni Pro wireless receiver is compatible with GE/Interlogix contacts.
 
nicholass817 said:
Looks like this is just geared for electrical diagrams...kind of wish I would have known about it prior to starting my security/HA install...
 
You're right.  For some reason, I had it in my head that you could also do non-schematic drawing in TinyCAD.  Not sure where I got that idea from.
 
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