How are you balancing insulating attic with constantly running new wires?

IVB

Senior Member
So I find mysellf regularly running new wires in the attic. But I'm redoing the insulation, removing the blow-in and putting in batt/rolls.
 
In NorCal I should be at least at R30. If I put in a single R38 I'd have heat loss at the joists. To "do it right" I put in faced R13 then cross lay unfaced R19, but then i'd have no idea where the joists are to walk on. (That would sit 6 inches above the joist)
 
I was thinking about doing the R13/R19 cross lay, with a line of 16" x attic length plywood to act as a sidewalk, laying R19 cleanly on top of that plywood run. But that wouldn't really be an R30 given the air gap on the plywood.
 
Y'all mostly live in colder climates than me, what do you do? There's no way i'm the only DIY'er who's always running new wire to have this issue.
 
I've re-run quite a bit in mine, but don't find myself doing it very often at all... and I really try to reserve that work for the winter months anyway. Having said that, I have a mix... blown-in above our bedrooms and kitchen and faced rolls above our living and dining rooms (vaulted). I've noticed that the blown-in has started to get compacted, and I'm planning to get some more put up there early next year before it gets hot again... but after I get a chance to get up again and finish up a few things:)
 
Mine is blown in and pretty compacted as well. I was just thinking about putting rolled bats over it, perpendicular to the joists. I don't see the point in doing more blown in unless I intend to never go up there again.

I have another issue and that is nail pops. I have trusses so the support really isn't there. I have put some plywood down in places but I think if I do a project up there it will probably involve putting down some 2x6's minimum in places to strengthen the floor and then plywood on top. I would like to go perpendicular with 2x6's to avoid rerunning electrical and that would give me the space for the bats. Not sure if that will work structurally will have to ask the civils the next time I feed them beer and find out.

I spend way too much time up there, I have put lights, ladders, outlets, and even a temp sensor up there. It's actually kind of nice for a few months out of the year :)
 
The trusses should be plenty to support the drywall and insulation but perhaps not plywood and people and whatever else. The nail pops may be due to movement between the walls and trusses as the trusses are meant to support themselves from end to end. With weather changes the truss can lift in the middle. I put sheet metal angle at the top of the walls fastened only to the walls and screwed the drywall to that and then held back the other screws (into the trusses) at least a foot. That way there is at least a little give when there is movement. I also nailed a few cross pieces between trusses over the walls and then drilled a just slightly loose hole and drove a nail into the top of the wall but not all the way so the trussed could lift slightly and not try to pull the wall up. I haven't had any trouble with cracking or nail pops.

For the insulation issue I put a cross 2 x 4 just above the top of the insulation in the center opening of each truss. Then put some osb on top of those to walk on. It runs end to end with a couple places where it goes out 90 degrees to that where I have some wiring. Hardly ever have to walk on trusses now. :)
 
I installed walkways where I need to move around.
OSB platforms, some of them raised above the joists.
I also planned out my install to run all the LV wiring I think I will need.
 
After running the wire I sealed every air leak in the walls and soffits with spray foam.
The same for the can lights, smoke detectors, etc.
When I am done running the cat5 for the cameras, I will blow in more insulation - R60 is the final goal.
 
I have considered a raised walkway, above future insulation, but can't think of an easy way to do it. Vertical 2x4s to joists?

I also put in 2x4 'steps' to get across a tray ceiling.

How does one find a good contractor for this? I'm always hesitant to use anyone without a strong rec.

Maybe the best option, IVB, is to finish running new cables first. Yeah, I know it's hard to imagine.

Raised walkways in a few key locations, with new long runs along the walkway?
 
In the midwest have a large main attic with a high peak (~8 feet +) with a couple of smaller short attics.  Before I ran LV cabling I redid the entrance drop down stair case / ceiling door and reinforcements to get to the attic.  This was a project in itself as the contractor had used a wooden type ladder attached to a piece of thin plywood that I didn't really like. 
 
telescopic ladder.jpg
 
Next I built a catwalk in the middle of the attic.  I used a combination of plastic and wood for the floor.  Next I installed lighting across the ceiling.  All the electric is in conduit and every hole is using sprayed insulation.  The lighting installed turns the attic to daylight such that it is easy to walk around up there.
 
floor.jpg
 
From this point installed a chandelier lift (like a garage door motor with a LV switch).  This did involve new electric which I fished from the fuse panel up to the attic (new circuit). I also redid the venting of the bathrooms as I was getting condensation from the non insulated ducts such that I replaced the exhaust ducts with insulated duct work.
 
lift.jpg
 
Next here built a chase from the basement to the attic for LV cabling. 
 
The LV wires are mounted high in the attic and from the center go to the periferal edges.
 
IVB said:
To "do it right" I put in faced R13 then cross lay unfaced R19, but then i'd have no idea where the joists are to walk on. (That would sit 6 inches above the joist)
 
I've just moved out of a house where the attic had blown-in insulation on top of which I had added insulation running perpendicular to the joists. The joists were not visible. To avoid stepping on drywall and crashing into a room below, I'd move the batts to reveal the joists and then moved them back when I was done. For longer jobs, I had two pieces of plywood that I moved into the positions that were helpful for the specific job I was doing, after moving the batts out of the way. When I was done with these pieces, I would lean them against those diagonal structural members that ran from the attic joists to the roof.
 
Neurorad said:
I have considered a raised walkway, above future insulation, but can't think of an easy way to do it. Vertical 2x4s to joists?
If you have joists (rather than trusses) that seems like the most straightforward way. In my case I had trusses so just attached 2x4s parallel to each truss attached at the diagonals. In the center of the truss I had a section that was about 6' wide.
 
Next I built a catwalk in the middle of the attic.  I used a combination of plastic and wood for the floor.  Next I installed lighting across the ceiling.  All the electric is in conduit and every hole is using sprayed insulation.  The lighting installed turns the attic to daylight such that it is easy to walk around up there.
 
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floor.jpg
I have installed some atticdek as well. Since the trusses are 24" on center there is a lot of give. I have also installed some 3/4" plywood in places and after calculating the difference in price I think the plywood is the way to go. It's a more flexible design to accomodate different w x l, and it seems more structurally sound once installed than the 24" atticdek. The 16"OC atticdek might be better structurally IDK. And if you don't want to rip it yourself or are worrying about hauling the plywood you can just get them to rip it in the homecenter for you.

As for the nailpops I am pretty sure it is more me than just temp fluctuations as they tend to appear only in areas I have been monkeying around over. Not saying the temp isn't at play at all there thought. I like the thought of using steel to reinforce but it seems impractical for retrofit.

I should mention too that I was finishing my garage and a neighbor stopped by and he mentioned that he had finished his attic floor and used it for storage using sistered 2x4's. He was worried he would have to rip it all out if he sold the house as trusses don't meet code for floor/storage. I am not sure if this is true or not as I haven't researched it...

I haven't sealed holes etc. I would like too but it all seems like a lot of work. Also on the insulation topic, I have incredible sneezing fits/irritation whenever I go up in the attic without a mask. I am not sure if that is just dust or the fiberglass blown insulation. So you might think about other types of insulation like the treated blue jean stuff if you experience similar issues.
 
The problem is that knowing its so easy to run new wires, when I come across a problem, my head instantly goes to "just run a new wire and toss a sensor". Am I sick of telling the kids to turn off the lights when they leave a room? Throw in a motion sensor in yet another room. Nobody turns the bathroom fan off? Humidity sensor. Wife claims the bathroom sink leak is huge when I say its tiny but she's spilling water? Throw in a water detector.
 
I'm sure I'm approaching the limit of what can be run, but i'll bet this is a whole lim f(x)= ∞ . Perhaps marginal incremental value will set in, but I haven't yet reached that point...
 
Neurorad said:
Maybe the best option, IVB, is to finish running new cables first. Yeah, I know it's hard to imagine.
 
 
Yeah, putting in more blown insulation would just be a temporary solution then. I think if you want it to be permanent you need to either plan your runs and put in walkways, or use bats. Bats seem simpler to me and will probably be what I do when I get around to it. I will still probably add a couple more walkways with plywood and a storage area, the roll out bats. To me, a layer of bats over the existing blown just seems more flexible and more DIY friendly. No machines to rent or people to hire, etc.
 
@wuench,
 
What are bats?  Is it like a stiff carpet or similar?
 
Here I have had to use a step ladder for a few things mounted up high in the attic. (antennas for one).
 
My attic is high as well. I haven't done any climbing yet :) Bats=the stuff that comes in rolls... guess it should be Batts.
 
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