The final touch is needed...

tonti

Member
Good Evening!
Ones again I seek your advice on getting me a step closer to a fully wife-accepted-solution.
 
I have the all security sensors on Elk-M1 and lighting is all on ISY994i but I have not made the connection between the two through the ISY module. I have not seen the need yet. 
In addition I have security cameras (all are Dahua and Hivision IP cams) through a NVR from Nelly Security which I like. This system is also separate but tied into the TV and some standalone cheap android tablets that are always on. 
 
The wife starts appreciating all the little gadgets but only uses the key pad (no display) for the Elk (M1KPAS) to arm/disarm and the 8 button switch from Insteon that I have programmed with various scenes for her. The audio is all through the Yamaha web interface which is sufficient and working well, no need to tie this in but nice to have. She is quite happy so far. She asked me if she can have all of this on her iPad in one convenient app. 
 
I found the Iggyhead remote program but it does ISY and TV well but no Elk security. I have the INTELLIhome app which does a good job for her to show what is on/off but no ELK inputs at this point and no cameras. I am thinking that I can solve these via Elk/ISY interface and variables but I am not sure. I would need some pointers here before I purchase the module and start messing with it.
 
I looked at some of the "touchscreen" interfaces that you guys posted here and I think this is where I need to go. 
 
The desired outcome is that she can pick up her iPad and instantly sees the status of all sensors & lights and can choose a camera that points in the area of interest. 
 
Must have:
  • Works on iPad
  • has the lighting and Elk in one interface with nice backdrop picture that shows color changes based on condition/status
  • multiple screen (house, workshop, barn)
  • camera view and selection
Not really needed but if it works I take it....
  • Audio tie in directly via Web interface of Yamaha or GlobalCache infrared 
  • TV Remote
 
I keep seeing eKeypad praised but I am not sure yet as these posts are generally older. 
 
What is out there right now? Do I need to get the Elk/ISY interface module?
 
This would be the icing on the cake if I can pull this off!
"Hey honey, look, I build you this app for Valentines...."
 
 
 
 
Are you looking for a full blown solution?
 
CQC supports the ISY, Elk M1, Yamaha Receivers via IP, GlobalCache, Harmony Hub (for TV Remote), and IP Cams if they have a stream locally available.
 
You have to custom create your interface screens, but you can make them look and feel however you want.  I think there is an Android app and know there is one for iOS, as well as the Interface Viewer which runs under Windows.
 
It might be a little much for what you're asking, but it provides an excellent automation platform as well as the interface designer and viewer.
 
I know the ISY can interface with the Elk, and is compatible with the MobiLinc app, but that's as much as I know.  :)
 
JK - I like what I see except for two things. I do not like to run an extra computer, especially not a Windows server and $199 for a bronze license seems steep.  If I go with a an extra computer I would prefer a classical LAMP setup. I will investigate this further and place this on the back burner for now. 
 
then i think you're only option would be to use the ISY and Elk module.  just about every recommendation that will come from here would be a software solution that requires a dedicated machine. 
 
but why not try out the Elk integration?  im sure you've explored their apps, but everyone else can see them here: http://mobilinc.com
 
and UD has really started to extend the platform with the addition of their polyglot node.  it's definitely worth checking that out, too.
 
Homeseer 3 might work for you.
 
Here running Homeseer 3 on Ubuntu 14.04 64 bit.  (also a LAMP server).
 
Currently testing 15 Homeseer touch consoles running embedded XP and they are doing fine.
 
Just looking the Elk M1 plugin is available for the Linux version of Homeseer 3.
 
Have you looked at eKeypad Pro?
 
http://blog.ekeypad.net/applications/
 
Pretty sure this can do everything you want out of the box except maybe the Yamaha...
 
EDIT: I see you mentioned it, so Ill note that Ive been an eKeypad Pro user since 3.5yrs and have received MANY updates and great support from the developer. No issues to report. Sure, the $100 cost is pricey, but it's a fully featured app that does a LOT of integration work with all sorts of devices. I paid the $100 fee once - share the iTunes account with my wife and have it installed on all 4 of our devices - 2 iPhones and 2 iPads.
 
tonti said:
JK - I like what I see except for two things. I do not like to run an extra computer, especially not a Windows server and $199 for a bronze license seems steep.  If I go with a an extra computer I would prefer a classical LAMP setup. I will investigate this further and place this on the back burner for now. 
 
Well 'server' in this case can mean a very small box. It's not like we are talking about a huge, heat generating, power sucking box. Most very small systems these days are quite capable of handling CQC back end support. The exceptions would be if you are wanting to stream media from it, run RDP sessions against it, etc... i.e. stuff beyond CQC.
 
If you already have a server running for other purposes, run it in a VM on that server if it has the horsepower to carry the extra load.
 
drvnbysound --
I read up more on the eKeypad and it seems it represents everything that I want. Just a few question as you seem to be happy with it.

1) the website says that eKeypad Pro includes everything, even the blue print model. But on the App Store I get confused as I see eKeypad Pro for $99 and next to it the eKeypad Pro Upgrade Bundle for $109. Can you confirm that eKeypad Pro includes everything that I need including the blue print modeling?
2) How flexible is the set up of these screen? It appears that this is completely free based on user design? Are there any short comings that you see in this software?
3) I like the blue print modeling part. Somewhere it sounded like you can send in files and they convert it. Not sure if this included and/or how difficult it is to create them yourself. Are the embedded objects fixed or can any object be animated (I.e. Light bulbs) Any advice here?
4) How does it share changes (I.e. Screen modifications) amongst all devices? Is this a cloud service?
5) How good is the documentation and online support for this?

Thanks in advance.
 
Unless I'm misunderstanding what this guy does, keep in mind that this is not automation. It's just control, i.e. a smart remote control in the form of a phone. For real automation, you need something that's there and running all the time, to watch for changes in the devices under control and to do things in response, to do things at specific times, to tell you if certain things happen, etc... 
 
Also I consider it important that you have coordination of control over devices which a set of separate clients doesn't provide while a real automation system with a back end does. Otherwise, though it's not going to be common, strange things can happen if two clients send overlapping sets of commands. And of course you may end up wanting control non-IP based devices, which requires a box for serial ports, USB, etc.. You can use some devices like GC-100s, but having uncoordinated clients speak to serial devices simultaneously can cause failures because they aren't designed for that.
 
Anyway, I think these things are often lost on folks who are getting into this thing of ours, and who might not consider them or their importance.
 
Ahh, the big bugbear of mine - Automation.  Everyone thinks that because it has an app its a smart device and it is automation.
 
Apps are a virtual remote on a virtual coffee table and nothing more.
 
Automation is something that can do things automatically.
 
Integration is the key, where everything works together to automate tasks.
 
Back to the original question.  Do you really needs to see the status of the sensors and lights.  What does that give you.  You can see a light on in an area that you are in very easily.  rooms at the other end of the house, yeah you can;t, but do you typically leave lights on?  Changing habit is better looked at in this case.  Also think about LED for reduced power consumption.
 
Sensors, what do you need out of this.  There may be times where you need to know somethings left open, such as bed time, but an audible or visual indicator may be better (flash lights when you go to bed, or an annunciation on the M1).
 
Just trying to get you to think about it.  I don't ever look at my sensor status.  I let the house tell me something is not right at key times (when leaving or going to bed).  The house will also do things itself like close the garage door if its left open, turn lights off if there is no movement.  I run a fixed touchscreen in the kitchen and everyone in the house has an iPad.  The portable interface rarely gets used at all.  In bed is probably the time I use it the most, for setting the fans or A/C of just checking on the status of the water tanks and electric fences etc. on the farm.
 
Mick
 
Personally here have gotten myself lost in endless circular (blind loops) status references that have just constipated the software automation server.  
 
Here I have set up:
 
OmniPro 2 which talks to
 
==> Omnitouch consoles basic stuff
==> smart phone HAI apps basic stuff
 
plus
 
==> software (could be CQC or Homeseer) that uses the OmniPro 2 as a multiple protocol controller of sorts
==========> software is connected to multiple hardware devices (OPII being one of them), direct connects or network hardware connects.
====================> embedded Wintel tabletop touch tablets, smartphone (iOS or Android), IFTTT, et al
 
I do not need this stuff; just like to tinker with it.  I have also over the years switched over to using one VPN tunnel for all of my stuff.  It is easier than configuring autonomous UPD/TCP ports per device on the firewall which becomes a bit of a hassle if you want access to multiple devices. 
 
I think some might have missed the question between the lines which I bolded below:
 
tonti said:
She is quite happy so far. She asked me if she can have all of this on her iPad in one convenient app. 


 
This would be the icing on the cake if I can pull this off!
"Hey honey, look, I build you this app for Valentines...."
 
Yeah, the automation stuff is key for sure and why many of us are here in the first place, but you still need user acceptance and use :) If your system has no users, it's not serving much of a purpose.
 
tonti said:
drvnbysound --
I read up more on the eKeypad and it seems it represents everything that I want. Just a few question as you seem to be happy with it.

1) the website says that eKeypad Pro includes everything, even the blue print model. But on the App Store I get confused as I see eKeypad Pro for $99 and next to it the eKeypad Pro Upgrade Bundle for $109. Can you confirm that eKeypad Pro includes everything that I need including the blue print modeling?
2) How flexible is the set up of these screen? It appears that this is completely free based on user design? Are there any short comings that you see in this software?
3) I like the blue print modeling part. Somewhere it sounded like you can send in files and they convert it. Not sure if this included and/or how difficult it is to create them yourself. Are the embedded objects fixed or can any object be animated (I.e. Light bulbs) Any advice here?
4) How does it share changes (I.e. Screen modifications) amongst all devices? Is this a cloud service?
5) How good is the documentation and online support for this?

Thanks in advance.
 
Don't quote me on these...
 
1) eKeypad Pro includes everything. The Bundle for $109 includes multiple apps (eKeypad Alarm, eKeypad ISY, eKeypad M1 Utilities, and eKeypad Pro Utilities). You don't need all of those individual apps unless you want apps for specific devices and to have more a desparate system. eKeypad Pro a the singular app that interfaces with all of these systems.
 
2) I wouldn't say the screens are customizable. By that, the keypad screens, zone screen, lighting screen, etc are all per-defined templates that list zones or lights with their respective status etc. What is customizable is the Favorites screen. Anything you want to see or control within eKeypad can be added to your favorites screen.
 
3) While the Blueprint module is [supposedly] not included, I've never bothered to look or find it since that was added as a free feature. It used to be a separate add-on purchase. Simply never felt the need/benefit for my use - other than a "wow" factor if I were to show friends.
 
4) Share changes amongst all devices?  I'm not really sure what you mean here. As above, the only screen that's really custom is the Favorites screen - and I suppose the Blueprint. All I can tell you is that you can export your configuration and import that to another device - this keeps from having to configure your system(s) on multiple devices. What's neat is that you simply turn on "Sharing" of that configuration file within the app, and import it into the new device. I wasn't able to tell if this "sharing" was done via Bluetooth, WiFi, or what... that is transparent to the end user. It's VERY simple to do once you realize you don't need to email/upload a file to yourself to reach on another device.
 
5) Honestly, I've never needed to look into any documentation or support. Everything has been intuitive and easy to use and I haven't had any issues.
 
This is the only app that I've ever bought for more than $5, so $100 was a leap. I don't think I've ever felt a better return of that $100 spent on a IT type purchase. I've used it for 3.5yrs and have received numerous updates and added features at no additional cost. They continue to add support for new devices. And I have it on 4 devices right now. Very hard to beat in my mind. Let me know if you have any further questions! I'll do what I can to help.
 
Thank you all for your replies. The thread started to stray off into a philosophical question for a moment but was not intended by me. drvnbysound caught this and got it back to where I wanted to go. Thanks! 
 
I full hearty agree that automation is more than just an app. But this is not "yet" my goal. I kept it very clean so far by separating Home Security from Light Control and Video Surveillance. The Security piece has only a few aspects of automation that I need and I use a few rules on that. If the security system needs to turn on lights I have this captured via a single trigger point - one way. The lighting system does not need to talk to security in my mind. I have a lot of lighting scenes that control various aspects of lighting, fans and heating. This is small automation as well. Video is recorded all the time and there is no need to switch things here from the two systems.
 
So I agree - automation for y'all probably means tying it all together and I agree in that case I would go with a LINUX server and probably Homeseer (looks like a great system) or run CQC in a virtualbox. 
 
I am comfortable working in multiple systems to check status but my wife is not. We have three buildings tied together and they are not close to the house. The workshop has three roll up doors, two door and four windows and we keep some open during the day. All our cameras are facing 'outward' as I do not want to monitor myself so I can not check all doors via cameras. When I go to bed I get a brief check through the Elk keypad but my wife does not invest time in understanding this. She wants a status report and want to see if she left the door in the tack room open, are the fans on in the horse barn, are the roll up doors down in the workshop (we keep them open a bit for the dogs during the day) and so forth. 
 
So back to the original intent - eKeypad seems the right solution for a wife-friendly-all-in-app. 
 
Is there anything similar or equally out there?
 
BTW: If the Blueprint module stuff is a deal breaker for you, let me know if you have an image(s) that you want me to try and load into the Blueprint module and I'll give it a shot.
 
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