3G/4G modem or router for backup?
- Thread starter linuxha
- Start date
pete_c
Guru
I want my main existing router to do the routing.
Opinion/comments here ==>
I see the failover WAN now on many firmware (over the counter Best Buy stuff) or modded firmware routers (IE: with DD-WRT or OpenWRT stuff).
I am currently playing with the newest fastest chipsets that most of the vendors are using these days. They are now better at running with CPUs powered at 500Mhz- 1Ghz with 32/64Mb of flash and 128-256Mb of play space. You can do a lot of number crutching / bean counting these days with these mini chip sets. I am automating stuff today with one of these chipsets sitting on a 2" X 2" board. (next testing a 1" X 2" board). It is smaller than a RPi2 and chipset is built for wireless AP's, routers, firewall etc. OpenWRT OS is based on C (LUA) and web stuff (LuCI) and is very modular and efficiently built.
That said the processing these days relating to a combination firewall router is way faster and better with a regular PC and using software like PFSense (well too it does run in memory if you want).
<===== End of opinion/comments
I use a refurbished Ericsson W25 purchased for some $25 from an Australian telco a few years back and a refurbished Nexus Hawk and a little T-Mobile ZTE device. Favorite is the Ericsson cuz it will do voice, data, fax, sms, routing, wireless and your basic home office switch with a built in battery backup. Using PFSense these days with 8 Intel Gb NICs; works fine.
Opinion/comments here ==>
I see the failover WAN now on many firmware (over the counter Best Buy stuff) or modded firmware routers (IE: with DD-WRT or OpenWRT stuff).
I am currently playing with the newest fastest chipsets that most of the vendors are using these days. They are now better at running with CPUs powered at 500Mhz- 1Ghz with 32/64Mb of flash and 128-256Mb of play space. You can do a lot of number crutching / bean counting these days with these mini chip sets. I am automating stuff today with one of these chipsets sitting on a 2" X 2" board. (next testing a 1" X 2" board). It is smaller than a RPi2 and chipset is built for wireless AP's, routers, firewall etc. OpenWRT OS is based on C (LUA) and web stuff (LuCI) and is very modular and efficiently built.
That said the processing these days relating to a combination firewall router is way faster and better with a regular PC and using software like PFSense (well too it does run in memory if you want).
<===== End of opinion/comments
I use a refurbished Ericsson W25 purchased for some $25 from an Australian telco a few years back and a refurbished Nexus Hawk and a little T-Mobile ZTE device. Favorite is the Ericsson cuz it will do voice, data, fax, sms, routing, wireless and your basic home office switch with a built in battery backup. Using PFSense these days with 8 Intel Gb NICs; works fine.
linuxha
Active Member
Pete, thanks. It looks like I won't be getting my hands on a W25. Also I'd like to avoid devices with Just 3G. While 5G is just now being mentioned, I can easily see the 3G being phased out in favor of 4G/5G (just like when they got rid of the 2G when LTE arrived). While I don't think we'll see 5G arriving sooner than 5 years I'd like my investment last a bit longer (yes I'm cheap ;-)).
I did start looking at various solutions and most of the routers I found have a dependency on a USB modem. And then I found the limitations of the carrier/frequency/channel(?). Wow, I'll need an engineering degree in RF by the time I'm done.
I also now see the issue with my router sitting in the middle of the backup. I'm going to have to rethink this. I might go with a TP-Link router with the appropriate USB modem. Easy to add OpenWRT and I think I can add some dynamic routing between the wired router and the LTE router then. I've done this in the commercial space. Of course I can't afford those solutions Though I can get my hands on a used 6500, not sure my wife would like that jet plane noise in the living room. ;-)
I did start looking at various solutions and most of the routers I found have a dependency on a USB modem. And then I found the limitations of the carrier/frequency/channel(?). Wow, I'll need an engineering degree in RF by the time I'm done.
I also now see the issue with my router sitting in the middle of the backup. I'm going to have to rethink this. I might go with a TP-Link router with the appropriate USB modem. Easy to add OpenWRT and I think I can add some dynamic routing between the wired router and the LTE router then. I've done this in the commercial space. Of course I can't afford those solutions
Though I can get my hands on a used 6500, not sure my wife would like that jet plane noise in the living room. ;-)
pete_c
Guru
The Ericsson offers the most features for the money and it still can be purchased used on Ebay.
The Nexus Hawk would provide two cell connections and it does LTE/4G. It has a built in GPS/AP/Switch.
The rest are basically offerings from the telcos.
The ZTE that I purchased is unlocked and works fine with my T-Mobile account and while it does LTE fine it is only wireless.
The Nexus Hawk would provide two cell connections and it does LTE/4G. It has a built in GPS/AP/Switch.
The rest are basically offerings from the telcos.
The ZTE that I purchased is unlocked and works fine with my T-Mobile account and while it does LTE fine it is only wireless.
pete_c
Guru
Tested the PFSense firewall today with a wireless usb stick as a failover to primary. Worked fine with LTE speeds.
Checking wireless modems that work with PFSense and this list is posted as of January, 2016.
Personally here tried a few unlocked Huawei usb stick and none would work with my T-Mobile sim cards.
Checking wireless modems that work with PFSense and this list is posted as of January, 2016.
Personally here tried a few unlocked Huawei usb stick and none would work with my T-Mobile sim cards.
- 4G Systems XS Stick P14
- Alcatel Onetouch 4G L850V
- Anydata ADU-635 WA
- Verizon/Pantech UM175
- Verizon/Pantech UML290 and UML295 (see here for config info)
- Verizon USB727
- HP hs2340 HSPA+ Mini Card AMO Ericsson
- Huawei B970/B970B
- Huawei E122
- Huawei E153
- Huawei E156G
- Huawei E160
- Huawei E161
- Huawei E160E
- Huawei E169
- Huawei E172
- Huawei E173
- Huawei E173U-1
- Huawei E180
- Huawei E220
- Huawei E226
- Huawei E272
- Huawei E352
- Huawei E353U-2
- Huawei E367
- Huawei E372
- Huawei E392
- Huawei E398 (E398u-1)
- Huawei E960
- Huawei E1550
- Huawei E1552
- Huawei E1556
- Huawei E1692
- Huawei E1750
- Huawei E1756
- Huawei E1762
- Huawei E1820
- Huawei E5372
- Huawei E5776
- Huawei K3563
- Huawei VIK K3715 HSU by Vodafone
- Nokia Phone E72-1 connected via USB cable
- Sierra Wireless U305
- Sierra Wireless U330
- HP2300 (Sierra Wireless MC8775 3G) Mini-PCIe
- USB Connect Mercury (Sierra Wireless Compass 885 or C885)
- Sierra Wireless Compass 889
- Ovation U727 by Novatel on Sprint CDMA
- Nokia CS-17
- Turkey-TTNET Usb Stick 3G Modem. Label says Huawei E173 but its actually Huawei E1800.
- Telstra maxon bp3-usb (Benchmarked: 2500/350)
- ZTE MF656A
- Vodafone Mobile Connect K3565
- Huawei K4505 (Vodafone Mobile Broadband)
- LTE Yota LiTE LU 156 4G - NOTE: May need nudged in some way out of storage mode. (e.g. boot delay, unplug/replug)
- Novatel EU850D (Mini PCIe)
- ZTE MF683 (May need CD-ROM disabled using AT+ZCDRUN=8 on another system first)
- ZTE MF622
- Ericsson H5321G / Lenovo FRU 60Y3297
- ZTE MF915 LTE modem (T-Mobile)
- ZTE MF190 USB (1&1) using /dev/cuaU0.2
- D-Link DWM-157 (3.75HSPA+)
linuxha
Active Member
Pete, thanks for all the information. I don't have any old 4G phones so I can't go that route, I've been checking out all the devices and I haven't settled on one yet. I did find out that I can add the LTE modem directly to my FW/Router (Ubiquiti Edge Lite). So I'll check out that route. One less thing to add and all the config in one place.. I'll need to now sit down and figure out a few other things (such as battery backup on parts of the network).
pete_c
Guru
Here utilize Ubiquti AP's. Didn't even know that Ubiquiti made routers.
How do you connect a USB modem to the Ubiquiti Edge Lite router?
Here just tested an Asus, TP-Link and no name combo router, microrouter with OpenWRT.
The cheapest no name router and OpenWRT microrouter connected to everything I tried.
The issues here were relating to the firmware on the devices and seeing the USB modems and having an OS that would do WAN failover.
They all did fine though tethering older 3G phones.
How do you connect a USB modem to the Ubiquiti Edge Lite router?
Here just tested an Asus, TP-Link and no name combo router, microrouter with OpenWRT.
The cheapest no name router and OpenWRT microrouter connected to everything I tried.
The issues here were relating to the firmware on the devices and seeing the USB modems and having an OS that would do WAN failover.
They all did fine though tethering older 3G phones.
Also running Ubiqiuti AP here. I have a Ubiquiti Edge Router Pro that I just got on a flash sale on Amazon (got tired of replacing my consumer grade router every few years.) I'll be hooking up a 4G modem to it via a Windows PC (probably virtual) running Connectify Hotspot MAX. Connectify has been running a 75% off today only sale for the last few weeks. Router will handle failover if primary is lost.
linuxha
Active Member
pete_c said:
There are 2 USB ports on the front of my router. I need to have firmware 1.6 or later (I'll load 1.7 this weekend). Then load the cdc_ether and utilize the rdnis with the USB LTE modem (no example provided so i'll have to go fishing). Not sure if it will work with any rdnis modem or a limited subset.
pete_c said:
I actually thought I was going to go that route/router (TP-Link router with the USB LTE modem). I have to only use the 4G, if I use 3G I'll be charged. I'd like to avoid that.
pete_c said:
I haven't seen a config for the modem yet so I'm a bit leery about anything working. If I can config it and get IP working I can config the routing. Weighting defaults and a few other tricks. I've done that on Windows also.
pete_c
Guru
@batwater
You do not need to use a windows and software like hotspot max to share the 3G/4G connection.
Here tested my Openpeak tabletop running Ubuntu 14.04 32 bit as a modem combo (wireless and wired) device.
You can similiar with a microrouter with OpenWRT on it or RPi2 with router software on it.
It is cheaper than using a PC in Windows to do this or if you use a pc I would go with PFSense (it'll even work on an old computer).
@linuxha
So the Ubiquti edge router lets you do load balancing and fail over stuff?
Here left the TP-Link TL-MR3420 on line with DD-WRT on it.
Reading stuff on it the fail over sort of works with the stock OS but author recommends using OpenWRT for it.
Played a bit with the T-Mobile ZTE wireless hub and learned today that I can tether it. Never paid attention and thought that the micro USB port was only for charging. Will see how it works connected to the PFSense firewall.
You do not need to use a windows and software like hotspot max to share the 3G/4G connection.
Here tested my Openpeak tabletop running Ubuntu 14.04 32 bit as a modem combo (wireless and wired) device.
You can similiar with a microrouter with OpenWRT on it or RPi2 with router software on it.
It is cheaper than using a PC in Windows to do this or if you use a pc I would go with PFSense (it'll even work on an old computer).
@linuxha
So the Ubiquti edge router lets you do load balancing and fail over stuff?
Here left the TP-Link TL-MR3420 on line with DD-WRT on it.
Reading stuff on it the fail over sort of works with the stock OS but author recommends using OpenWRT for it.
Played a bit with the T-Mobile ZTE wireless hub and learned today that I can tether it. Never paid attention and thought that the micro USB port was only for charging. Will see how it works connected to the PFSense firewall.
linuxha
Active Member
pete_c said:
I have no intention of load balancing at this time (Comcast & Verizon, way too expensive). Just do backup with certain routes hard coded to test the backup. LTE is solely for backup and I expect that in emergencies that bandwidth will be abused. As for fail over, probably started off with weighted routes (somewhat static). I do know that the 1.7 supports load balancing, QoS (I'll need that for my VoIP traffic I intend to add) and several other new features. I'll need to sit down and do a lot of analysis of IPv6. That FW has been very difficult to properly understand. Perhaps Summertime for the QoS/VoIP and later for the IPv6.
The Ubiquiti router is basically Linux like so I'm pretty sure I can mange the IP routes to behave. I'd prefer something more maintainable like the config. Worse comes to worse I could get the TP-Link with OpenWRT or I could build my own box (your mention of the x86 with the multi-NICs reminded me that is the least expensive, most flexible method of taking control of the router).
pete_c said:
I have AT&T and they want some ridiculous amount for wireless hotspot, tethering. I did set it up on my Linux box (rndis) with my Samsung S3 before they shutdown the tethering. That was just as LTE was starting.
I have used DD-WRT but I've spent most of my time with OpenWRT. I can make it all work with Quagga. I could use RIPv2' I'd rather not use OSPF, I did that for the HA book also with BGP (I lost that argument with the Editor).
tmbrown97
Senior Member
I'll just throw this out there - take a look at the Cradlepoint product line - they're literally designed for this. They have adapted a bit over the years but I did some pretty significant projects with them in years past. They can handle multiple-failover options with different modem options (used to be they could support PCMCIA, Cardbus, USB, etc) - and still do VPN, remote management, etc.
no, not as "tinker" friendly as some - but rock solid.
I'm quite familiar with Ubiquiti's product - it's an underdeveloped OS but if you don't mind getting your hands dirty you can do just about anything via SSH... but I do like having a purpose-built product that does exactly what you're looking for and that's built in partnership with the cell carriers to maximize all the available features and options the cell cards offer.
no, not as "tinker" friendly as some - but rock solid.
I'm quite familiar with Ubiquiti's product - it's an underdeveloped OS but if you don't mind getting your hands dirty you can do just about anything via SSH... but I do like having a purpose-built product that does exactly what you're looking for and that's built in partnership with the cell carriers to maximize all the available features and options the cell cards offer.
pete_c
Guru
I agree with Work2Play relating to the purchase of a solid device like a Cradlepoint. It just works out of the box because you pay for it and selling a product that doesn't work is not a good thing.
Too with firmware on a box is that it has to play with whatever and that is typically an update. Many times today that involves a monthly support contract which adds a bit to the original price.
It is the same with PFSense or the OpenWRT stuff. PFSense though is a regular computer with software. OpenWRT is opensource software with a multitude of global users that want everything.
Honestly here though do not have dependencies on the internet here where I really need it 24/7. I just want it 24/7. In the old house I had DSL and cable broadband. Here I only have the choice of using cable (which really is old infrastructure never updated) and wireless. I have tinkered with LTE and 3G. Both work fine for me as I do not really have dependencies on streaming video stuff. That said VOIP works fine from the 3G/LTE connection but it is still secondary to copper anyways.
Yesterday received a newer generation of the "microrouter" or "travel router" with openWRT on it. It is using an MT series CPU that runs at around 600Mhz with a bit more flash and rom on it and now is have the size of the 2" X 2" microrouter I was playing with earlier. The USB stick here would be larger than the microrouter.
Here is a picture of it. Tiny $20 combination OpenWRT Firewall, AP, Wireless repeater, router and has failover WAN to Cellular WAN and a faster CPU than the TP-Link.
BusyBox v1.23.2 (2015-09-16 20:39:07 CEST) built-in shell (ash)
_______ ________ __
| |.-----.-----.-----.| | | |.----.| |_
| - || _ | -__| || | | || _|| _|
|_______|| __|_____|__|__||________||__| |____|
|__| W I R E L E S S F R E E D O M
----------------------------------------------------------------
| |
| OpenWrt Chaos Calmer 15.05 (r47466) |
| Build time: 2015-11-13 19:55 CET |
| |
| Cezary Jackiewicz (obsy), http://eko.one.pl |
| |
----------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the T-Mobile LTE ZTE device.
The cellular telco's like the large ISP's are still trying to bucket charge (byte by byte) the internet and it is a win win for them and those users tethered to the internet.
BTW by law there are low budget ISP rates that are not advertised (IE: like $20 per month) wherever you are located and with whatever internet ISP.
The ISPs do not advertise these rates but are required by law to offer them. You have to ask. They might ask a bunch of questions making it seem difficult to get but it really isn't and they would prefer not to sell it.
This was/is very popular with retired folks in Florida.
Too with firmware on a box is that it has to play with whatever and that is typically an update. Many times today that involves a monthly support contract which adds a bit to the original price.
It is the same with PFSense or the OpenWRT stuff. PFSense though is a regular computer with software. OpenWRT is opensource software with a multitude of global users that want everything.
Honestly here though do not have dependencies on the internet here where I really need it 24/7. I just want it 24/7. In the old house I had DSL and cable broadband. Here I only have the choice of using cable (which really is old infrastructure never updated) and wireless. I have tinkered with LTE and 3G. Both work fine for me as I do not really have dependencies on streaming video stuff. That said VOIP works fine from the 3G/LTE connection but it is still secondary to copper anyways.
Yesterday received a newer generation of the "microrouter" or "travel router" with openWRT on it. It is using an MT series CPU that runs at around 600Mhz with a bit more flash and rom on it and now is have the size of the 2" X 2" microrouter I was playing with earlier. The USB stick here would be larger than the microrouter.
Here is a picture of it. Tiny $20 combination OpenWRT Firewall, AP, Wireless repeater, router and has failover WAN to Cellular WAN and a faster CPU than the TP-Link.
BusyBox v1.23.2 (2015-09-16 20:39:07 CEST) built-in shell (ash)
_______ ________ __
| |.-----.-----.-----.| | | |.----.| |_
| - || _ | -__| || | | || _|| _|
|_______|| __|_____|__|__||________||__| |____|
|__| W I R E L E S S F R E E D O M
----------------------------------------------------------------
| |
| OpenWrt Chaos Calmer 15.05 (r47466) |
| Build time: 2015-11-13 19:55 CET |
| |
| Cezary Jackiewicz (obsy), http://eko.one.pl |
| |
----------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the T-Mobile LTE ZTE device.
The cellular telco's like the large ISP's are still trying to bucket charge (byte by byte) the internet and it is a win win for them and those users tethered to the internet.
BTW by law there are low budget ISP rates that are not advertised (IE: like $20 per month) wherever you are located and with whatever internet ISP.
The ISPs do not advertise these rates but are required by law to offer them. You have to ask. They might ask a bunch of questions making it seem difficult to get but it really isn't and they would prefer not to sell it.
This was/is very popular with retired folks in Florida.
linuxha
Active Member
Work2Play said:
I'm searching right now, thanks.
Work2Play said:
There's something other than ssh to interface to the router?
I've never been able to use the web gui and I'm quite used to configuring from the CLI. I've worked with both Cisco and Juniper CLI. My favorite of the 2 has been Cisco.
In this case I wouldn't mind the USB LTE modem. A lot cheaper than Cisco's LTE wics.
And if you even need to use VRRP for 2 or more routers and want to do some real funky load balancing with explicit routes using explicit routers you need to use tunnels between the routers (gets around poison reverse issues).
linuxha
Active Member
pete_c said:
I agree with the you but a PC might be a replacement in the future.
pete_c said:
While I don't need 7x24x365 now I do see we're going that way. Just like any other utility, can't live without it. As we move more and more into the cloud I can see internet outages being more problematic. While I loath 'The Cloud' and I'm amazed at how many new things are only available on the cell phone. That annoys me to no end as much of my HA is M2M.
