Lutron Caseta or Radio RA

So, trying to get back to this project. I was wondering if anyone had done the research comparing the Lutron Radio RA vs Caseta systems. I would like to do some basic home automation like switching a few lights off and on when we are away and system is armed. Nothing too crazy.
 
If i went with Radio RA, i was a little confused as to how it would connect to M1g panel. My RS232 connector is already being used by M1xsp for my uplink. I assume I need a new M1XSP for the M1XSLU? Would it connect to the existing M1XSP?
 
Also, the M1XSP seems to have instructions for Radio RA but not RA2.
 
 

How big the house?  How many rooms?  How many devices.  Bear in mind that "devices" includes not just lights but also shades, remotes, keypads and motion sensors.
 
Caseta is limited to 50 devices on an account and doesn't include the same range of hardware that comes with RA2.  

3000 sf house. Detached garage. I was not planning on doing motorized shades. Though I like idea of using shades on south side to take advantage of south sun to heat home in winter (now we manually open all the shades. Seems like both systems allow for programming through RP2.

Push both the Elk and the RA2/Caseta systems down a notch and put an automation system over the top. Then there's no need for them to talk to each other, at least not directly. The automation system can talk to both of them and coordinate them as required.

we have a home of that size.  we are just over 50 devices, and have no automated shades.  use radio ra2.

I have over 50 devices with RadioRa2 in a house half that size.

3 beds two baths. Every light switch, 5 lamp dimmers, occupancy sensors in most rooms, several Pico remotes, etc. My wife loves the homelink visor controller as her hands are full with our toddler leaving the house. She can just press a button in her rear view mirror to arm the system or turn on/off the lights.

I also use several phantom devices. A pico will turn a phantom device on and the Elk will see that and turn the alarm, music, etc. on. Homeseer or Charmed Quark or on my short list and would make this a lot easier.


If you want to connect directly to your Elk, you need a M1XSLU connected via the included serial cable to the RadioRa2 repeater. You do not need a M1XSP. The M1XSLU is connected to the Elk databus.

http://www.elkproducts.com/product-catalog/elk-m1xslu-m1-to-lutron-radiora2-serial-interface

Elk has a YouTube on RadioRa2 integration.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vL8V9AXfkjQ

RadioRa2 you need to take the online course and pas an exam to get access to the software. You can then design your system and print out a component list to send to integrators and get quotes.

I am guessing the house is already constructed but for anyone else reading I highly recommend the extra deep electrical boxes. Some of the RadioRa2 switches are pretty big and it can be a challenge to get all the wires into the box and still have everything flush.

johngalt said:

I also use several phantom devices. A pico will turn a phantom device on and the Elk will see that and turn the alarm, music, etc. on. Homeseer or Charmed Quark or on my short list and would make this a lot easier.
 

Click to expand...

How do you make the Elk m1 "see" the phantom device. I have programmed my RA2 system and purchased the M1 security system (over the honeywell vista because lack of integration) and really want to be able to arm the system via the lutron keypads rather than using the m1 keypad or app etc. Could you please give me some pointers on this? Thank you

dvpvic said:

How do you make the Elk m1 "see" the phantom device. I have programmed my RA2 system and purchased the M1 security system (over the honeywell vista because lack of integration) and really want to be able to arm the system via the lutron keypads rather than using the m1 keypad or app etc. Could you please give me some pointers on this? Thank you

Click to expand...

 There are a whole bunch of lightning rules you can use.  Elk can monitor light sources based on their percent, if they are off, or all the way on.
 
For example I use:
 
WHENEVER [Phantom Output] IS TURNED ON BY SOME EXTERNAL SOURCE ...
 
I then use a Pico to turn the phantom output on.  Elk will then trigger this rule.  I need to have one rule for on and another for off.  I would love to use the light percentage in a rule.  
 
For example if light is set to 72% then set the volume of my Nuvo to 72%.  So far I haven't come up with a good way to do that.  I assume Homeseer or CharmedQuark would make this easy.

johngalt said:

I also use several phantom devices. A pico will turn a phantom device on and the Elk will see that and turn the alarm, music, etc. on. Homeseer or Charmed Quark or on my short list and would make this a lot easier.


If you want to connect directly to your Elk, you need a M1XSLU connected via the included serial cable to the RadioRa2 repeater. You do not need a M1XSP. The M1XSLU is connected to the Elk databus.

http://www.elkproducts.com/product-catalog/elk-m1xslu-m1-to-lutron-radiora2-serial-interface

 

Click to expand...

 
Not sure if using a Pico for security system control is a good idea.
 
I've finally found time to  take a look at the RF protocol Lutron employs in their RR/Caseta devices.  As I suspected, exchange happens in clear text. So, for a Pico, one can see its serial number and what button was pressed.
 
Perhaps, due to that fact, Lutron will never use ClearConnect for security devices such as locks.  On the other hand they may, nevertheless.

So the phantom has to be set with a pico? It can't be say, the "Away" scene/button on my Lutron keypad by the door?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

vc1234 said:

Not sure if using a Pico for security system control is a good idea.
 
I've finally found time to  take a look at the RF protocol Lutron employs in their RR/Caseta devices.  As I suspected, exchange happens in clear text. So, for a Pico, one can see its serial number and what button was pressed.
 
Perhaps, due to that fact, Lutron will never use ClearConnect for security devices such as locks.  On the other hand they may, nevertheless.

Click to expand...

Great point.  I use the Lutron Visor control to arm my system away from my car.  However, I don't use any Lutron devices (or other devices) to disarm the system, bypass zones, etc.
 
I do use the pico and some rules in Elk to control my kids sound machine, volume, lights, etc.  But I try to keep the security and lock side separate.

dvpvic said:

So the phantom has to be set with a pico? It can't be say, the "Away" scene/button on my Lutron keypad by the door? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

 
Anything that can turn a light on and off can turn the Phantom output on and off.  It doesn't need to be a Pico.  An scene/button  should work.

johngalt said:

Great point.  I use the Lutron Visor control to arm my system away from my car.  However, I don't use any Lutron devices (or other devices) to disarm the system, bypass zones, etc.
 
I do use the pico and some rules in Elk to control my kids sound machine, volume, lights, etc.  But I try to keep the security and lock side separate.

Click to expand...

What do you use to disarm the system when say you pull up to your house and would like to park in the garage? Whip out the phone, punch the code and then roll open the door? Or you a key fob? (which seems no better than visor control buttons)

Sorry to dig up the dead but this is exactly the question I'm facing now.
 
Currently I have a Nest thermostat and a MyQ Garage door opener. I did a job for a guy a year or so back in exchange for a Lutron RadioRa2 installation kit (RR-FDN-INC-WH). I'm debating between installing that kit, going with Caseta, or just buying generic Zwave switches. I currently have no Home Automation server but have been looking at the Vera, Wink, and HomeSeer.
 
The RR-FDN-INC-WH kit includes the following:
 
1 x RR-MAIN-REP-WH - This is the main repeater box for the whole system.
1 x RRD-H6BRL-WH - Programmable central control switch.
1 x RD-RD-WH - Remote dimmer.
3 x RRD-6D-WH - Dimmer
1 x T120-9DC-3-BL - Power Adapter
 
 
A quick count up gives me the need for 27 switches, which using the RadioRa2 setup seems to be EXTREMELY expensive. I've attached a list of the switches I would need.
 
Am I better off selling off the RadioRa2 kit to someone who can use it and going with something else or should I just bite the bullet and go with the Ra2? My budget for this isn't nearly as large as some peoples so keeping it reasonably priced is of high concern, second only to reliability. 
 

Considering that your 2 most important parameters  are reliability and cost, and the fact that you are new to home automation and own cloud-based devices, I would suggest getting Lutron Caseta for your lighting. RadioRA is one of the most expensive tech available for DIY (and will also require taking a special course before you can obtain their software), and the reason is that it is not only reliable, but allows for greater interfacing with other HA systems, such as HAI Omni and Elk. Caseta is Lutron's cheaper version that is still quite reliable and has a phone app, but has limited number of devices (no fan controller, for example) and will max out at 50 total devices, won't integrate easily with other systems without the cloud but will fit your bill.