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Elk M1G J16 Outputs


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#1 GadgetNerd

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 03:47 PM

Are those J16 outputs supposed to output 14v when not turned on? 



#2 RAL

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 06:28 PM

The pins on J16 for Outputs 7-16 should measure 0 volts if the corresponding output is off.   Note the top pin on J16 is +12V, so you will see voltage on that pin at all times.



#3 GadgetNerd

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 10:07 PM

Thanks for verifying that for me. I have a setup where my driveway monitor feeds and input on the elk. It then pings a X10 chime and sends outputs on 7 and 8 depending on direction of travel. I assumed since the chime has been working that the input was correct. Now i am pretty sure the driveway alarm is where I need to focus on. 



#4 RAL

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 10:33 PM

Thanks for verifying that for me. I have a setup where my driveway monitor feeds and input on the elk. It then pings a X10 chime and sends outputs on 7 and 8 depending on direction of travel. I assumed since the chime has been working that the input was correct. Now i am pretty sure the driveway alarm is where I need to focus on. 

 

I'm not sure I follow you on what you think is wrong. If the chime is sounding, that leaves me thinking that the M1 is seeing the input from he driveway monitor.

 

An easy way to verify that the outputs are ok is to write a rule to toggle the output you want to test any time you press an F key.

 

What do you have outputs 7 and 8 connected to?  The outputs have limited drive capability - enough to light up an LED, or to control a low current relay.  If you try and drive too large a load, it isn't going to work.



#5 GadgetNerd

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 11:45 PM

Outputs 7 and 8 go to inputs on a camera. The software has a rule in that's triggered by the input. It just requires a small signal to work. It's been functional for several years.  Now that I have trouble shot some, it appears the Elk sees the inputs from my driveway alarm are closed . They are typically NO going into NO inputs on the Elk. This is the only thing my Elk has been doing for the last 5 years. Before that, I had the driveway alarm tied directly into the camera inputs with a doorbell transformer powering the signal. I recently picked up Homeseer and plan to put the Elk to use a bit more.  I hope this makes sense. 


Edited by GadgetNerd, 13 May 2018 - 11:46 PM.


#6 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:49 PM

Today I did some checking. My driveway alarm controller (Shure Action 212) is Normally Open when idle. When powered off it closes the outputs. I removed the connection block for the zone input and I still show voltage on the outputs, this is with nothing connected on either inputs or outputs. . I am using pin 2 for ground and pins 7 and 8 for signal so I check voltage from pin 2 to  7 or 8.

 

 I know the Elk sees when the driveway loop is triggered as it pings the chime.  I am now left trying to figure out why there is constant voltage on my outputs.  I have attached a pic of my simple rule.  What would you suggest I do to unstick my output situation. 

 

 

  

Attached Files



#7 RAL

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 02:28 PM

Today I did some checking. My driveway alarm controller (Shure Action 212) is Normally Open when idle. When powered off it closes the outputs. I removed the connection block for the zone input and I still show voltage on the outputs, this is with nothing connected on either inputs or outputs. . I am using pin 2 for ground and pins 7 and 8 for signal so I check voltage from pin 2 to  7 or 8.

 

 I know the Elk sees when the driveway loop is triggered as it pings the chime.  I am now left trying to figure out why there is constant voltage on my outputs.  I have attached a pic of my simple rule.  What would you suggest I do to unstick my output situation. 

 

 

I would test that Outputs 7 and 8 still work properly by writing a rule to toggle them each time you press an F-key.  Temporarily remove your other rules for these outputs.  Measure the output voltage each time you press the F-key, and make sure it really changes.

 

Since it used to work, it's possible that the M1 has suffered a failure.  One of the problems with running wires outside to things like driveway sensors is that it provides an easy path into the M1 for lightning induced surges.  A surge can fry the inputs as well as doing other damage.



#8 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 02:58 PM

It is likely a surge problem. We had a lightning strike close to some outside cameras that fried ports on a few switches. Odd thing is it continued to work until a few weeks ago. It's been a quiet spring and I have put in some ground protection for the ethernet that goes outside. I will need to figure out a way to isolate the driveway alarm control and the Elk. Both are inside. That Sure Action has been through a decade of use and never missed a beat. 

 

I will test those outputs and some of the others. I could see if any others are working.

 

Thank you and I will report back once I know more. 



#9 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:51 PM

I tried the F keys and no love on 7 or 8. So I stripped back 9 and 10 and wired them to my camera and poof. All good. Guess the first two are useless, unless I need an always on voltage feed. :)

 

Thanks for the assist. 



#10 RAL

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 08:29 PM

It's hard to say why outputs 7 and 8 would have failed, but not the others.  Maybe just the fact that they were connected to something provided a path for a surge to damage them, while the unconnected outputs survived.

 

At least you've got it working again with the other outputs!



#11 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 09:19 PM

It was likely damaged when we had the network switches that lost ports. I replaced everything on the network last fall and those two outputs worked fine for quite a while. I have power cycled the Elk several times over the last week so a hard reset didn't fix it. They are definitely stuck on. I am just glad it didn't wreck all the outputs.

 

At least now I can focus on getting Homeseer and the M1G communicating and finding more things for it to monitor. 

 

Thanks again!



#12 RAL

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 09:42 PM

You might want to consider adding surge protection to the wire pairs that run outdoors. Any power and signal wires that connect to the M1 should have surge protection.  Ditek makes some good products for this.  If you install one, it's important to place it as close as possible to where the cable enters the house, and near a good earth ground (e.g. near your electrical panel's earth ground).



#13 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 10:05 PM

Thanks, I will get one for the drive alarm.   Biggest threat is my pole mounted ethernet attached cameras. I have lightning protection in-line now but am also planning to add a section of fiber as a clean break between copper networks.



#14 RAL

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 10:12 PM

Fiber is a great way to get isolation.  But you should also protect the power feed to the cameras if that is coming from inside the house.

 

Ditek also has other surge protectors for network and power interfaces.



#15 GadgetNerd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 10:58 PM

I have that part covered. Thank you! 






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