Any physical mounting hardware to help re-run wiring?

IVB

Senior Member
My wiring sucks. It sucks bad. Well, it wouldn't have been so bad if I had stuck to my original plan of putting in 15-20 wires, but i'm at dozens and growing. This needs to be re-terminated so 1) i know what is what, and 2)I can call in an electrician to move some HV wires and he won't run.

Specifically, I need to rerun the last 10 feet of all my Elk wires, network, telephone, cable TV, camera, etc. The location has the Elk 2ndary cabinet, CQC/CCTV server, Sage server, telephone distro, router, D* box.

I have a patch panel (sitting in the box), a 28" Elk cabinet, a 12" leviton SMC & cabinet. I scored a spare 14" cabinet off someone, but it's damn well useless as it's so small. The location is only 5' high, so I can't put a full rack in there.

1) Is there any physical mounting hardware that you guys have found useful? I dunno what, mebbe stuff like wire guides? Anything that I should put inside the Elk cabinet to help with wire running?

2) For those of you who mounted your boards flat, how did you physically get them onto the can without resorting to that sticky foam that makes it a PITA to take the board out & back on? (or do you not worry about that)

I can only handle doing this one time; I really wish I didn't have to do this, but the organic growth of "oh, i can do this - but oh, i need more wiring!" is making the location just an unhappy place to be in. It's worse than my parents garage.

I'm willing to spend the, well, hopefully no more than dozens of dollars, to do this "right" so it's something that I could leave in place when I sell the house and not be embarassed about.

Any and all ideas appreciated.
 

IVB

Senior Member
One more question: The 15' before it enters the basement is basically a "backbone" location down the center of my crawlspace. If I decide to go loopy and re-run that bit too, the bundle will be around 4+" in diameter if I wrap it all together.

1) Should I ziptie all that together, or should I create smaller bundles?
2) Any advice on how to secure it to the joists? if I ziptie it into a giant coil, I'd have to screw in hooks to hold the whole thing. That's fine by me, but I dunno what's the "right" thing to do here.
 

BDHall

Active Member
2) For those of you who mounted your boards flat, how did you physically get them onto the can without resorting to that sticky foam that makes it a PITA to take the board out & back on? (or do you not worry about that)


I have been using the multipurpose 3" Adapter Plate (ELK-SWP3) for mounting the Elk expansion cards. This has worked out rather well and the plate quickly attaches with the plastic push-pins. I too am not a fan of the double sided tape for mounting components.

Brian
 

CollinR

Senior Member
You might look at real rack spaces, middle atlantic makes some reasonably priced. Then you can fit all of your stuff into one mega box. :D


Also I use zip ties, you can buy special ones that have an eye. Just bundle them with the tie and run a drywall screw through the eye and into a joist, I get the ones that are 12"-15" long. No need to sinch up the tie, you can run new wires later if you don't. :)


http://www.cabletiesplus.com/ties.cfm

Scroll down to "Mounted Head Cable Ties", I can get these at my local Lowes however not on their website. :(
 

pkoslow

Active Member
I prefer to use double sided velcro "tape" for securing cabling. This is especially important when trying to support large bundles of data cables as even wide zip ties can't provide the support required to not pinch Ethernet cabling. For speaker, alarm & CAT5 used for non-data purpose, this isn't as much of an issue, but even RG cable shouldn't be crushed which zip ties will often do if you're supporting a large horizontal bundle.

I've found some plastic staples that provide a good, easy way to attach the 3/4" velcro strips that you simple cut to length. Neat thing is that you can undo to add or re-dress the cables which requires a lot more work if you've used zip ties.

I'll try to add a few photos for example...

Cheers,
Paul
 

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upstatemike

Senior Member
It sounds like you need something a bit larger. I find telephone wire brackets work well for major bundles.
 

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BraveSirRobbin

Moderator
I like upstatemike's method because it would be easy to add or remove cables in the future. You will not get that flexibility using zip ties. Also, I don't like using plastic for "long term" use as (especially here in Las Vegas) it will become brittle over time.
 

pkoslow

Active Member
Is there any physical mounting hardware that you guys have found useful? I dunno what, mebbe stuff like wire guides? Anything that I should put inside the Elk cabinet to help with wire running?

I've been using "wiring duct" from Panduit for years to dress up cables in projects. I found it works perfect for dressing up cables in structured wiring too!

They make lots of different sizes and colors... you should be able to find at a local elecrtical supply or on-line. In most cases you'll need to order the duct and cover separately. The stuff in the picture is Panduit P/N F1.5X2WH.

Again... some pictures for example...

Cheers,
Paul
 

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pkoslow

Active Member
I like upstatemike's method because it would be easy to add or remove cables in the future. You will not get that flexibility using zip ties. Also, I don't like using plastic for "long term" use as (especially here in Las Vegas) it will become brittle over time.

California has such a mild climate, this isn't much of a concern here. I still don't expect you'd see problems with the plastic deteriorating even in very hot climates unless the plastic staples are exposed to direct sun light. These plastic staples are manufactured to secure Romex for high-voltage applications and meet all the requirements so I don't think there is an issue with deterioration?

An alternative may be to use the velcro tape and a metal staple if you're concerned about longevity...

The aluminum D-Rings are nice (we use them for large vertical runs & commercial jobs)... trouble is they are spendy at $2.50-$4.00ea depending on size. If you need quite a few it adds up compared to a few pennies each for the velcro/staple method.

Paul
 

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IVB

Senior Member
Very cool stuff posted so far, thank you very very very much for that! Those rings look like just the ticket, i'll definitely pick up some of those.

Honestly, I'm finding that 90% of my issues with the Elk so far can be traced directly to my wiring. Not suprising since I've never done wiring (well) before this, so I feel that I'm still a good person even though I screwed that up:)

I don't have an issue with $200-$400 in parts if it'll make this thing something I have the cajones to take pictures of and post here. Ellisr63 shook his head and muttered when he came over to check out the place (i think his exact words were "it's a good thing your screens look nice").

Thanks again for helping the wiring newbie.
 

pkoslow

Active Member
They're called "D" rings, just find a phone man around you and he'll give you a box! At least I would.

Unless the phone guy you find does lots of commercial work, he probably won't have what upstatemike is using. If he does, I'm not sure he'd give them away as the least expensive ones I've found are still a couple bucks each at wholesale pricing.

Most phone guys will have "Drive Rings" which are just a few cents each. These are basically a nail with a wire loop on the end. They work great for telco wiring, but aren't suited at all for data wiring.

In general, the large D-Rings like Mike showed are usually reserved for vertical cable management and not often used horizontally (at least not for data). Panduit makes some nice cable support stuff that's probably the best solution. We normally just use the velcro and staple method in residential work, but will use the Paduit supports to break out large cable bundles where they exit cable trays and spread to other areas. Search for "Panduit J-Pro"... they make lots of different flavors depending on what you're attaching to (wood beam, steel beam, threaded rod, etc.).

Cheers,
Paul

Pictured "Phone Guy" Drive Ring & Panduit J-Pro:
 

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BraveSirRobbin

Moderator
I like upstatemike's method because it would be easy to add or remove cables in the future. You will not get that flexibility using zip ties. Also, I don't like using plastic for "long term" use as (especially here in Las Vegas) it will become brittle over time.

California has such a mild climate, this isn't much of a concern here. I still don't expect you'd see problems with the plastic deteriorating even in very hot climates unless the plastic staples are exposed to direct sun light. These plastic staples are manufactured to secure Romex for high-voltage applications and meet all the requirements so I don't think there is an issue with deterioration?
I didn't mean those plastic staples, rather the plastic zip ties as I've seen these degrade to where they will just snap off. Again, as you stated, it all depends on the climate you are exposing them to. :)
 

AnthonyZ

Active Member
My wiring sucks. It sucks bad.

I so want to see current photos. It might make some of us feel better about ourselves :)

I have a tendency to "tweak" a minimum of once a week and my own gear has gotten somewhat...um....well, ugly.
 
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