Heated Floor Control

T

TrojanHorse

Active Member
Hello,
 
I am remodeling my master bathroom and planning to add electric in-floor heat.  I'm looking at 110 or 220v systems.  Probably not water based systems since the area isn't that big and it's going to be supplemental comfort rather than primary heating.  
 
Does anyone have experience with in-floor electric heat and automating the temperature?  I have an Elk M1G and an ISY with Insteon (will post on UDI forum too).  I could add Z-wave to the ISY.
 
My understanding is that special thermostats need to be used for in-floor heating since triggering the system based on air temperature can cause the system to overshoot.  Maybe the smart ones measure floor and air temperature.  Also wondering if it takes a while for the floor to heat up.  Can you turn it up before taking a shower and then step out on a warm floor?  If not, maybe I just keep it on a very simple schedule rather than trying to turn it up on demand or based on some input from the automation system.  I would like to be be somewhat energy efficient while enjoying a warm floor.  
 
I would appreciate any feedback or insight.  
 
Thanks
 
TrojanHorse said:
Hello,
 
I am remodeling my master bathroom and planning to add electric in-floor heat.  I'm looking at 110 or 220v systems.  Probably not water based systems since the area isn't that big and it's going to be supplemental comfort rather than primary heating.  
 
Does anyone have experience with in-floor electric heat and automating the temperature?  I have an Elk M1G and an ISY with Insteon (will post on UDI forum too).  I could add Z-wave to the ISY.
 
My understanding is that special thermostats need to be used for in-floor heating since triggering the system based on air temperature can cause the system to overshoot.  Maybe the smart ones measure floor and air temperature.  Also wondering if it takes a while for the floor to heat up.  Can you turn it up before taking a shower and then step out on a warm floor?  If not, maybe I just keep it on a very simple schedule rather than trying to turn it up on demand or based on some input from the automation system.  I would like to be be somewhat energy efficient while enjoying a warm floor.  
 
I would appreciate any feedback or insight.  
 
Thanks
Click to expand...
 
I am not aware of any zwave US compatible in-floor heating thermostats (there's a 868MHz EU compatible one).  In my condo, use this:
 
http://www.sinopetech.com/en/boutique/products/neviweb-en/floor-heating-thermostat-web-programmable-3600-w/
 
It is regrettably a cloud solution which I do not like, but at the time I needed remotely controlled baseboard/floor thermos, there was no other solution.  It has been very reliable for the last two years despite the negative comment on Amazon -- the fellow did not know that an internet gateway was required too.  It can probably be integrated with isy since it has a REST/HTTP interface.  I played with the api but did not feel motivated enough to use it for automation.
 
I heard about wifi cloud connected thermostats that appeared recently on the market, but I don't have any experience with those.
 
vc1234

Thanks for the reply. In my initial search I've found this wifi thermostat with dry contacts that I can connect to my Elk relays. I'm going to try to get the network API to control with my ISY.

I will probably keep it simple since a floor takes a little while to heat up. Maybe I can monitor kWh usage to guide programming...

https://www.amazon.com/SunTouch-Universal-Programmable-500875-Thermostat/dp/B01BN4AJIO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Yes. If you have TOU metering you may want to beat the peak period, for sure. Give it a shot of heat early in the morning before getting up.
 
We had electric radiant floor heat installed when we remodelled our MBa ~6 years ago.  We used 2 mats, including a small separate mat in the WC, controlled with 2 on-wall stats:
 
tempo_-_main.png

 
NuHeat branded, they're re-branded Aube thermostats.  IIRC Aube's instruction sheet describes the dry contact on the back.
 
2 months ago, one died (GFCI notice wouldn't reset, supposed to die after a certain amount of time, I think), and we replaced it with this:
 
Signature_Lifestyle.png

 
We will replace the other when it dies.
 
I don't know if this new replacement offers a dry contact.  Initially I obsessed over the contact, when choosing the first thermostats, so I could integrate them.  I never installed a whole-house system, so didn't end up using the contact.
 
For the electric radiant heated floor, these thermostats are set-it and forget-it.  In the Spring I turn them off, and in the Fall I turn them back on.  Sometimes when I go on vacation, I turn them off.
 
The only reason I see to integrate them is to control that away/vacation function.  Would be nice, but not a huge issue, for me.
 
If I had to do it over again, I would have found a more knowledgeable installer who was smart enough to use a single custom mat.  Originally both mats were controlled from a single thermostat, but there was a noticeable difference between the 2 floor temps.
 
These new Nuheat thermostats are wifi-enabled, but I don't see any point it that, for my use.
 
The set temps are programmed by the day of the week, reaching the set temps at the beginning of the set cycle.  That is, if I set it for 85F from 5A-8A, the temp of the floor will be what I want by 5A, and will shut off at 8A.  Same thing in the evening.
 
I have yet to use an integrated floor heating thermostat, so I can't compare, but I've been very pleased with the floor heat control, without integration.
 
Dear TrojanHorse,
 
We (WarmlyYours) offer "Integration Kit" that can be used to simply connect a "high-voltage (120V/240V)" floor heating mat with a "low-voltage, 24V" thermostat of your choice (Z-wave for example). Some of the low-voltage thermostats allow you to connect a floor temperature sensor, so then the operation can be done by a floor or ambient sensors, or even both at a time if needed.
 
Correctly installed floor heating system under normal conditions would typically heat up to a comfort temperature in about 20-40 minutes (if not less). Check out operating cost calculator for our systems on our website.
 
Feel free to contact WarmlyYours at any time and we will be glad to design a system for you.
 
TrojanHorse said:
Hello,
 
I am remodeling my master bathroom and planning to add electric in-floor heat.  I'm looking at 110 or 220v systems.  Probably not water based systems since the area isn't that big and it's going to be supplemental comfort rather than primary heating.  
 
Does anyone have experience with in-floor electric heat and automating the temperature?  I have an Elk M1G and an ISY with Insteon (will post on UDI forum too).  I could add Z-wave to the ISY.
 
My understanding is that special thermostats need to be used for in-floor heating since triggering the system based on air temperature can cause the system to overshoot.  Maybe the smart ones measure floor and air temperature.  Also wondering if it takes a while for the floor to heat up.  Can you turn it up before taking a shower and then step out on a warm floor?  If not, maybe I just keep it on a very simple schedule rather than trying to turn it up on demand or based on some input from the automation system.  I would like to be be somewhat energy efficient while enjoying a warm floor.  
 
I would appreciate any feedback or insight.  
 
Thanks
Click to expand...
 
Interestingly, I sent an email to WarmlyYours the exact same day that I sent one to Stelcom about access to some sort of API for the nSpire (which is a a WiFi thermostat for in-floor heating) and have yet to receive a reply, whereas Stelco sent a reply within a few days...
 
This all gives me some good info to think about.  
Ultimately I think tying this into an automation system would be nice but isn't something I'm going to obsess over.  
A custom mat is something I hadn't considered.  
Thanks everyone for your replies!
 
Dear giesen,
 
We apologize that you didn't receive our response in a timely manner, however, we replied to your email within hours and email "bounced" back. Our system kept trying to deliver the email during the next couple of days but it seemed to be a "far-end server error".
 
We want to let you know that currently, we do not provide API access for nSpire Touch Wi-Fi Thermostat.
Please let us know in case you have any additional questions.
 
Regards,
 
giesen said:
Interestingly, I sent an email to WarmlyYours the exact same day that I sent one to Stelcom about access to some sort of API for the nSpire (which is a a WiFi thermostat for in-floor heating) and have yet to receive a reply, whereas Stelco sent a reply within a few days...
Click to expand...
 
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