Help routing wire

beelzerob

Senior Member
We're adding some walls downstairs, where the low voltage up until now has had a free reign. Now I need to add some regular 14/2 wire for some plugins and I need to route the wire across the hall to where the power panel will be.

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All of the low voltage runs in the side of the I-beam up top. The high voltage wires I'm going to run go through the wall on the left. Then they need to somehow cross the hall there and make it to the room on the right, where the door is partially open. I could go through the ceiling, but that would mean almost making contact with the LV wires, though it would be at a 90 degree angle. I could also run the wires across the opening on the left (directly under the I-beam), and then across the open door frame....but that would mean running the HV wires parallel about 1 ft away from the low voltage wires.

The wiring is for a woodworking shop, so there is going to be some nasty motors on some of these. However, the particular wires I'm routing here are unlikely to see sustained use with something like a table saw or the like. They're just not well positioned for that. There will also be an HV run that powers flourescent lights...I dunno if they produce noise problems too.

Is it possible the I-beam will shield the LV wires from an HV wire directly below it? If so, then I could probably get away with running the wires across the door opening.

Suggestions? These wires represent about half of what our house has, so I don't want to risk a lot of interference after trying so hard to avoid that in the rest of the house.

thanks, as always.
 
You're probably ok either way but I would probably opt for the 1 crossing at 90 degrees rather than < 12" for any distance. I'm sure you'll get a more precise answer but what I wanted to note is are you sure you only want to run 14/2 for a circuit running motors and stuff. Sounds like you want at least a 20A circuit and for that you need 12/2. Much better off over sizing the wire to the workshop!
 
Hmm...that's a good point Steve. The way I'm wiring this room is so that each piece of equipment will be on its own breaker, and none of these are machines are rated for more than 15 amps, so I figured 14/2 was fine. The table saw is the biggest hog and it says 110/15A. I've been running it on a long extension cord and even with slightly bogging down in wood it hasn't tripped the circuit, so I'm thinking it won't often get past 15A.

We're putting outlets throughout the shop on separate circuits so that you can move equipment around and still plug it in on its own circuit.

I think Ill have to do an inventory of our equipment and see what their ratings are....maybe I could get by in some places with 12/2 and a single 20 amp circuit breaker instead of 2 14/2 circuits on separate breakers.
 
Sorry, the only thing I could think of was "hahah, he has dead "husks" of old PCs around in his basement too!"

I was just told to organize or toss the ones I have.

haha <_<

--Dan
 
Hahah...ya, those are actually in the "If I knew how to throw these away I would" pile. I think you're not supposed to just put them in the trash, but the *special* throw away day only happens once a year. And so they sit....

Well, I went and did some inventory of my equipment, and the 3 biggest suckers of juice are the table saw (15A), jointer/planer (13A), and dust collector (16A). That last one is a bit of a shock, since we've been running it off of a long extension coord in a circuit with other items on a 15A breaker....so I don't know how we've survived this long. The good news is that the D.C. will actually be housed in a closet right next to the power subpanel, so wiring that for 20 amps won't be hard at all.

I think you're right though Steve. I'm going to switch to 12/2 for all circuits except stuff like lights, so that even if I use 15A breakers I'll be set if I need to up it to 20A. Thanks for the sanity check!
 
Well nuts...I just ran into another problem. I was going to use one of my spare ALC relays to control the dust collector so that I could wire up buttons around the room so we could turn it on and off. However, since I just realized the D.C. motor says 16A, then that means I can't use my ALC relays, since they are only rated at 15A. NUTS!

Is there another option similar to ALC, where I can control it with simple momentary pushbuttons from across the room, without needing some kind of controller board? If not I guess I'm going to have to get one of those remote control outlets specifically for dust collectors, but they're rather expensive. I was pleased with my cheaper solution using what I had on hand.
 
Just to be clear, Rob, you want to run the line voltage cables from this stud at the start of the arrow, to the area above the door (arrowhead), crossing the 'hallway' below that HVAC trunk line?

How are the LV cables supported?

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This probably doesn't make anything more clearer, but here goes....

wiring_topdown.jpg


This is a topdown floorplan look of the pic. The thick blue line is all of the LV wires. The wire are supported by resting inside the I-beam cavity, and there are some small sticks screwed in place to keep it there. Nothing fancy.

The red line represents 120V wire running in the wall directly below the I-beam. Now, that 120V wire has to get to the power panel in the closet across the opening. The green lines represent the two ways that it could do that...it could go up into the roof (where the yellow insulation is), but that means crossing right across the I-beam opening...so the 120V wire and the LV wires may be separated by only a couple inches at that point, though it WILL be at 90 deg. The other green line crosses through the top of the doorway opening where you can see the dead husks of PCs. That would keep it further away from the LV wires, but it would also mean that it would have to run across the top of the other opening (magenta), which would put it at maybe 1 ft below the I-beam, but running parallel for that distance.

I wondered if being completely within the I-beam cavity would protect the wires for that short of a parallel run, or if the LV wires had to be completely enclosed in metal to be safe. Dunno that.

Does that make ANY more sense?
 
I have an I-Beam in the basement that I utilize for some LV in a similiar fashion. I'm not sure how much it helps other than not having any noise issues on my zoned speakers.

As much as I tried keeping some LV away from HV; there are places which I having them running close with no ill effects that I can tell. I have added / swapped a "few" 14 guage for 12 guage wires with new breakers. In the midwest all of the HV wiring is in conduit. In FL ran the LV after the HV (romex) some of it running along side of the HV 10 years ago or so. There too I have no real noise problems.
 
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The blue arrows show the location of the line voltage cables on this side of the 'hallway'; the fourth blue arrow shows the location of the line voltage cable jumping across the 'hallway', sothe line voltage cables are 2 feet over from the LV cables, running parallel to them and the beam.

The first red arrow brings the line voltage cable down a couple feet (or 18", or 6 feet). Keep the line voltage cable close to the door frame. I don't think any hardware screws would penetrate that double/triple stud, but be careful.

You could probably raise the LV cable bundle an inch or 2 (or 4) with a soft fabric strap.

Basically, run the line voltage cables in the ceiling of the hallway a couple feet over from the beam, or on the other side of the HVAC trunk line.

Edit - this is assuming that I have the layout correct. <_<

Edit 2 - modified floorplan view

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I would personally choose to run it in the wall, the go up to the top plate one or two stud cavities away from the opening, and cross the ceiling. then come down into the closet. Crossing the LV at a 90 deg intersection
 
I see exactly what you mean Neurorad, and I think that's a good idea. I have to run it about 3' into the other room to get it past an HVAC duct so that I don't have to lower the clearance in there, but then it's smooth sailing. That's what I'll do. THANKS!
 
The LV sits in the I-beam for almost the length of the house....so if I go up until the ceiling, no matter where, it will end up right next to the I-beam. If I go with neurorad's idea, then it will *still* be crossing at 90 deg, but it will also have a foot or more of separation. When it's parallel (in the wall), it will be about a 5' separation.
 
I'm running into similar probs in my house, retrofitting in the finished basement.

I have 2 large HVAC trunk lines running the length of my house, in parallel. There are a pile of LV cables run on the top of the ducts, and it appears that there is a large line voltage cable retrofit below.

I'm sticking with the above/below the trunk lines, for retrofitting cables, when I can.

Looks like your I-beam parallels that HVAC trunk, I'm guessing for a good portion of your house. That space for the HVAC trunk line is perfect for retrofitting cables long distances. Don't limit yourself to the beam area - use both sides, above, and below.

Edit - is there room for conduit(s) next to the duct and/or beam? Will make it easier to add cables later.
 
Well, this is all for a workshop area, and the "finished" look will just be OSB painted white. So if I have to add wire later on, I'll either take down the OSB or just screw conduit on the surface.

Also, almost all of the walls will still be open on one side or the other....so getting to the wiring and adding more should be pretty easy.
 
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