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Insteon Double-tap

wuench

Senior Member
I am expecting my first order of Insteon switches this weekend. In reading the Insteon Switchlinc manual there is no reference to the ability to program different links for up tap, down tap, up double tap and down double tap. Yet, in the Insteon details white paper on page 48 there are references to being able to program different link groups for different taps. I know this kind of behavior is available in UPB. I would really like to program a switch to turn off all the other switches on a floor with a double-tap down.

Is it impossible to do this? If not, is it just not possible now because we don't have an app to program the switches like UPStart?
 

upstatemike

Senior Member
This is a really good question! I'm going to take a look at that white paper reference because I would also like to have different behaviour with "up paddle" vs "down paddle".
 

Rupp

Senior Member
According to Oman on the HomeSeer forum the SDK doesn't provide the capability to "react/hear" button pushes. The switches have to be polled. However if you assign your switches an X10 address they report their button pushes and multiple tapping is very possible with a bit of scripting.
 

electron

Administrator
Staff member
I don't think thats what they are talking about. UPB switches let you activate a different link, based on how the switch was triggered. This is all done in the switch, HS shouldn't have anything to do with this. I didn't realize that Insteon supported this as well.
 

eufreka

Active Member
On the switchlinc v2 dimmers, a double tap triggers instant full on or instant full off...single taps do local ramp rate on and local ramp rate off.

Is that what y'all mean?

The Icon dimmers don't do doubletaps, I believe--which is why I am curious as to how well they work as secondaries to Switchlincs in 3-way setups...
 

dhoward

Member
Thank you wuench, I knew I had seen that information somewhere, just couldnt remember where.

I have worked with Insteon extensively and was trying to program for double and triple taps and could find no explanation of how to do it. I searched everywhere and couldnt even find where I had seen mention of it. I finally gave up and assumed I either imagined it or was mistakenly reading UPB info.

In any event, I have not found any way to program for double or triple taps using the Insteon "tap-tap" method. The upcoming beta of PowerHome (to be released today or tomorrow) has full link setup support from software so I will play with this scenario when I get home tonight.

I'll let everyone know as soon as I find out if you can create groups using double or triple taps using software.

Dave.
 

markthomas

Active Member
Insteon switches work like Smarthome's X10 ones: A second tap on the top brings the switch to full on. Unlike UPB, you cannot activate a different link directly from the switch. (Note that an Icon switch won't respond to a double tap).

Note the whitepaper says an Insteon device configured as a wall switch could be configured to respond to double taps, not necessarily that it applied to anything in their current product line. B)
 

wuench

Senior Member
I did find this reference in the Indigo forum to programming different behaviors for double tap from the app.

I also did catch the could in the white paper. I may have to order the SDK to get to the bottom of this. And I may have to order a couple of UPB switches to compare before I go any further.

Another interesting point in the whitepaper I noticed is that the Powerlinc V2 is programmable. You can download a new SALad app and replace the current Core app. So I wonder if this approach would open up any of these types of capabilities hinted at in the whitepaper. Like reporting dim states, or advanced switch programming.

And i'm looking forward to what you find out with Powerhome, Dave.
 

wuench

Senior Member
Well I guess this sums it up...

Eric,
Thank you for your email. At this time this is not an option on Insteon switches. The only thing double tapping does is jump the load to full on or full off. I hope this helps.

Thanks again,
Matt
SMARTHOME, Inc
 

Rupp

Senior Member
I can tell you guys that I have several Insteon switches all programed with an X10 address and using HomeSeer I have programed triple taps as well as double taps to trigger events.
 

markthomas

Active Member
Rupp said:
I can tell you guys that I have several Insteon switches all programed with an X10 address and using HomeSeer I have programed triple taps as well as double taps to trigger events.
Sure, you can listen for multiple transmissions... but it's not quite the same as true double-tap support.

For example, with the UPB switches you can have a double-tap on the top of the paddle enact a link without turning its load on.
 

Rupp

Senior Member
markthomas said:
Rupp said:
I can tell you guys that I have several Insteon switches all programed with an X10 address and using HomeSeer I have programed triple taps as well as double taps to trigger events.
Sure, you can listen for multiple transmissions... but it's not quite the same as true double-tap support.

For example, with the UPB switches you can have a double-tap on the top of the paddle enact a link without turning its load on.
Agreed. I was just stating that what you seek is possible just done in a different way.
 

fitzpatri8

Active Member
markthomas said:
Sure, you can listen for multiple transmissions... but it's not quite the same as true double-tap support.

For example, with the UPB switches you can have a double-tap on the top of the paddle enact a link without turning its load on.
The trouble with that approach (or using software, timers and counters to discern number of presses and start suitable macros) is that you introduce that annoying delays (to me--YMMV) between button push and light activation while the switch determines your intent.

I'd rather skip the delay and just use a Keypadlinc, where each button's actions can be labeled. Or a hybrid compromise, with a decora-style switch controlling the room's main lighting side-by-side with a keypadlinc driving macros for the more sophisticated user.

Tom
 

gregoryx

Active Member
Thought I'd pipe in with what may not be evident to everyone: the old X-10 Switchlinc switches sent a unique pattern on the powerline for a double-tap and another unique pattern for a triple-tap.

I think Rupp's saying that the Insteon switches do that in X-10 mode as well.

I would also love to see a special double-tap and triple-tap for Insteon.
 

upstatemike

Senior Member
gregoryx said:
Thought I'd pipe in with what may not be evident to everyone: the old X-10 Switchlinc switches sent a unique pattern on the powerline for a double-tap and another unique pattern for a triple-tap.

I think Rupp's saying that the Insteon switches do that in X-10 mode as well.

I would also love to see a special double-tap and triple-tap for Insteon.
I was not aware of this. What unique pattern was sent? Is this documented someplace?

*edit*
Never mind, I see it now in the SwitchLinc manual. Extra House Code transmissions for the extra taps.
 
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