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M1 corrupt database - save operation fails

I recently have been going back through my rules to add comments since Elk added the rule comment capabilility in a recent release. Since adding comments I have run into an issue where I go to save my database file and the RP software hangs up and I have to kill the RP application. I thought this was a fluke and ended up restoring a prior datbase version and all was well (except the work I had completed that was now lost). One week later after adding a few more comments and creating a variety of additional rules I have run into the same problem. I am at a point where my database is saved and is in sync with what is in the M1 control but my rules comments have shifted around in the rules and now the comments don't match the rules they were created for. I also can't make any changes to any exiting rule, add any rules, or change any comments because if I do the RP software hangs up when I go to save the database.

It appears the logic in the RP software that controls the sequencing and indexing of the comments is somehow getting out of whack which is screwing up my comment placement and also preventing the software from being able to save the file. It seems that using the copy/paste funtion on the rules window may be part of the problem because I noticed some rules being misplaced after doing several of these operations.

Has anyone experienced similar problems and more importantly is anyone aware of a way to reorganize the datbase so I don't have to revert back to an older version and lose a bunch of work again.

Thanks for any help or thoughts,
Matt
 

AO-Brandon

Active Member
unfortunately, some of us have experienced a similar problem. you can view the thread on here by following the link. THIS LINK it seems that ELK is working on the problem, but as of yet, the issue is outstanding.

my comments in this thread reflect my own personal opinion and not those of Automated Outlet.
 

Lagerhead

Active Member
Hate to resurrect this old thread but I am really P.O.ed at the moment because of much the same 4-year-old problem.

The OP is from 2006. In August, 2008 I had the "shifted comments" problem and the DB corruption almost exactly as the OP described. I reported the problem to Elk who asked for more information and suggested a number of things to try. Well meaning, I suppose, but pointless. I salvaged the database but there was never any real solution form Elk, or frankly any acknowledgement of a genuine problem. The comments for my rules? I had to re-enter them all by hand.

WELL today I have The Shifted Comments Problem again, but this time I have 145 rules. This will be a huge P.I.T.A, a huge waste of my time, and oh by the way, it is also risky because it can potentially harm critical, long-tested rules. Must I also suppose that my DB will fail to load next time, or the next?

I will not bother to report it to Elk this time. I already know what the response will be, and I will need the time instead to work on fixing my rule comments.
 

Photon

Active Member
I found I didn't have this issue until I created more than a half-dozen or so comments. As I added rules, I have reserved comments for only the most important or confusing rules, keeping to just the minimum. I have a 3-ring binder in which to keep my documentation off-line. One place to keep a full dump from RP, and also prints of interesting threads from here and Elk's forums. No, not as conveient as having the comments work in RP, but that doesn't seem to be an option.
 

Lagerhead

Active Member
I get your point. But it reminds me of an old joke we used in relation to support from IBM (having been an IBM customer for some 15 years).

Patient: Doctor, it hurts when I move my arm this way.

Physician: I see. My advice is, don't move your arm that way.
 

Steve

Senior Member
The new version of that is:

iPhone4 Customer: When I hold my phone in my left hand I lose my signal.
Steve Jobs: My advice is, don't hold the phone that way.
 

electron

Administrator
Staff member
Are you using the new .NET version of ELKRP? I had this problem many times until I started using the new .NET version. It does suck, and I ended up rebuilding my rules from scratch (backups/documentation helped with that process). I always wanted to write my own (web based) rule editor for the M1, but ELK won't release the specs (understandable I guess, since it's also a security controller). It looks like they are stored in a local access database, but will take some time to map all these values.
 

Lagerhead

Active Member
Are you using the new .NET version of ELKRP?
No, I haven't made the jump yet, still running the last "traditional" version of ElkRP. So I would be happy to know that "the problem is fixed in the next release" (yet another IBM-joke).

BTW, is the .NET version a drop-in, or do I have to prep my XP system in some way?
 

electron

Administrator
Staff member
You can run both on the same machine, it will import your old database, and create a new copy (which is not backwards compatible). Since the comments issue is an RP issue (and not ELK M1), I am hoping that these problems will be gone with the .NET version. I still need to do some more testing tho.
 
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