Whole house audio

[rismoney]

Here is the current state of audio wiring-
Zones
1. Outdoor Side
2. Outdoor Back
3. Kitchen - ceiling 2spkrs
4. Dining R - ceiling 2spkrs
5. Family Room has a 5.1 [lcr in wall] [rear ceiling]
6. Master Bedroom has a 5.1 [all in wall]
3 kids rooms that I left wires dangling in the closet for future needs in 10-15 yrs

Now the house is not wired for local volume controls, I hope I didn't screw up too bad. I always thought of the keypads as either expensive limited devices, or cheap ugly knob warts. All the speakers are homerun hardwired w/ speaker wire to a head end, not cat5 [no abus]
Also relevant I am most likely going to go with the OmniPro II Controller for security and my existing UPB lighting automation.
I envision using Androids, iPod touch/ipad and/or remote controls for a solid WAF

The 2 devices I initially honed in on were from Russound MCA-C3 and the CAA66. I can't really tell the difference between these 2 from a functionality standpoint.
Do people use these things without the keypads? Do I use a separate receiver, or even 2 separate receivers for the two rooms that have 5.1?
Are there other offerings from Niles/Nuvo that align with my setup w/o wall keypads?

The other relevant point, is my doorbell has a cat5 cable. Can I have my doorbell ding/dong through the speakers?

Thanks for all your help. I have researched a ton on these forums a lot, and hope I am not being redundant
Thank

 

[Swancoat]

There's people with more expertise on this than me, but right now, I'd say NuVo is Ok... Supports 6 zones out of the box, and then 2 more with external amps. Any more than 8 requires an expansion kit (although if you go that route, you wouldn't need the external amps and could cover all 9 zones with the 2 NuVo boxes. To control it though, you're going to need the MPS4 (which you should get anyway) and the iPhone app (which is $99 itself). Not sure if you can expand the Essentia, but if you can, it's probably preferable to the Grand Concerto (since the bigger keypads aren't an issue for you anyway).

However, given that you're not going keypads anyway, and may want to expand zone by zone, Sonos is probably the way to go. You can leave all of the equipment up at the head end and control with iPhones/iPod touchs cheaper than NuVo.

 

[standon]

I have the MCA-C5 amp, some zones have a keypad while others do not. I liked the keypads for the C series, it was a decent balance of price and appearance. The c3 and c5 both have 2 unamplified zones in addition to the 6 they list, which would be perfect for your 5.1 zones. You'd output stereo to an amp that will convert to 5.1 to those rooms. I might actually recommend the keypad for those rooms though, which have IR receivers built in - or you can run your own wire to handle IR but the C series amps are very capable of repeating IR signals to sources located near the amplifier.

With regard to control, lots of things can control Russound and Nuvo amps... Elk, HAI, CQC, HS etc... Now there are many ways to control it, via IP or serial but I am not positive there is an app already created out there (especially for Andriod as I have all apple devices).

Also the doorbell thing is a bit more complicated than they let on. I have a Russound Compoint intercom system, which strangely enough does not use the paging zone. What I do is have my Elk M1 monitor the doorbell as a zone and have CQC monitor that zone and do an action. Sounds complicated but it's instantaneous. You'll have to figure out how to do it based on what you use, but out of the box I don't think any amps have any inputs for a doorbell.

 

[rismoney]

Thanks for the great info. standon - I don't understand what you meant by outputing stereo to an amp and convert to 5.1. I thought of getting a Multizone 5/7.1 Denon,Onkyo or similar AV receiver, for all the HDMI consolidation in the family room.

Not sure how the 5.1s [axiom m22/vp100 speakers] fits into the Russound model of two speakers in each zone.

I read more on these forums, and think that CasaTunes software might be a good way to manage the Russound. This then provides management of the sources through a decent interface, and has the flexibility of a pc. I am not sure what the benefit of tying the an OmniPro to a Russound does for me.

Is Sonos a compromise in sound quality?

I think I am starting to rule out the nuvo. I have easy access to a large # of pc's and servers, and the MPS4 just doesn't seem compelling.

 

[standon]

The unamplified zones means it has stereo (a red and white RCA jack) out - meant to be connected to the input of an amp. I use 2x100w circuit board amps for mine and distribute it to my outdoor/garage zones. The method I'm explaining is how to integrate the 5.1 into your other zones, effectively giving you the full 8 zones instead of the 6. When I was trying to decide what to do, I essentially ruled out the Nuvo because it was slightly more expensive than the Russound.

So [Russound/Nuvo Zone 7 or 8] ---Red/White Stereo Output Jacks----> [Receiver Amplifier upconvert this stereo signal to 5.1] ---Speaker Wire---> [5.1 Speaker setup]


I can't really add any input on CasaTunes, I would assume there are a lot of ways to control the amp but I use CQC for my control. I know that the amp can interface via IP, but I'm not sure what the limitations are but this is a pretty straight forward way to communicate from your mobile device to the amplifier. I just searched and here's an example of an app for an ipod.

What sources do you have in mind? Keep in mind that if you want to seamlessly manage an idevice, you'd have to buy the expensive iBridge. I'm assuming you'd probably want to use the computers you have at your disposal, which is what I do via a logitech squeezebox duet but it could get complicated if you don't have any automation software. You'd have to close the Russound app (with apple) and open the iPeng app to control the music.

I've heard really great things about Sonos, if you're sure you won't be adding any other automation to your home then it's probably a good choice to consider. Hopefully this all makes sense.

 

[Neurorad]

FWIW, the Nuvo MPS4 is made/designed/engineered by Autonomic Controls, and I've read the new Russound music server is as well.

You could consider an AVR in each of the 5.1 zones, and use a whole-house audio system as an input to each AVR. Honestly, I don't know the 'best' way to accomplish the 5.1 in those zones, but that is one way it could be done.

 

[rismoney]

So last night I pulled the trigger buying a Yamaha RX-A2000 through a killer deal for ~550 at BestBuy unexpectedly. SO I thought I would go down the road of now buying a Russound, like a CAA66 or something. All my gear is in a single closet.


Now-I think I might be leaning towards ditching the Russound concept, because I have a fairly open floorplan and just having the versatility of large multisource doesn't necessarily make sense to actually use since I would hear competing sources.

Sonos looks very intriguing. Do I have to buy say a ZP90 for every zone, or could I buy say 1 and an 8 channel amp to distribute the sound? As I said I don't necessarily need 5 Sonos players since I already have speakers in all the rooms, nor do I need to hear unique music in them either.

Rich

 

[tmbrown97]

What about a sufficiently powered amp and a speaker selector? An 8-channel amp is still generally designed for multiple sources so you'd have to split the same source to all channels and will generally cost a bit more... if you want to go really simple, you could just do an impedance matching speaker selector and optionally volume controls for each room.

 

[jwilson56]

Take a look at my blog here on CT. I have a six discreet zone whole house audio system that is all touchscreen controlled. It was also probably the cheapest way to do it. With over 1500 watts of power there is no chance of a melt down as you can get using LPADS and nothing to mount in the walls. I have had many people duplicate my setup so check it out.

 

[Sacarino]

I have been hankering to try out this $700 HTD controller/amp for 6 sources/6 zones for a while now, but I just haven't gotten around to it yet. I don't have speaker runs yet, and I definitely don't want to do local volume keypads in a retrofit (even though it supports them), so the RS-232 capacity to drive it via touchscreen is perfect for me.

I'm sure the Russound or NuVo stuff is certainly nice, but I just can't see WAF approval on $1500+ for zoned music & announcements... that's a tough sell.

 

[pete_c]

Very nice Shane. Looks a bit to be a Russound clone for a reasonable cost.

My sound is split between an older AB8SS/3 plain whole house audio amps and the Russound. I did configure each of the bedrooms with their own sound and external sound via a keypress. So I have four recievers set up in each of the bedrooms/office. The master bath has its own system plus its off of the main house system. The main floor of the house is split to 6 zones using the Russound CAS44; recently added the garage (externally mounted) / outside (externally mounted). I purchased the keypads and utilize the OmniTouch for control. Initially I did install in-wall speakers while I painted and fixed up the rooms. I redid one side of the garage and added the speakers during that endeavor. The main in wall speakers are all the same brand. The media room is using a bit of a mix of externally mounted and in ceiling speakers for the 7.1 sound. Recently moved a connection to the subwoofer from the front of the room to the back of the room.

John mentioned Lpads melting in the wall above. In the 1980's I split my audio receiver (250watts/channel) at the time to three zones plus the main mm room. While having a party I had one Lpad do a burn in the wall; mostly smoke. Fused the Lpad.

 

[jwilson56]

Pete that is exactly why I would never use LPADS not to mention I have an older home with wet plaster walls. I also wanted the ability to play different sources/tracks in each room.

 

[ccap]

Hi rismoney

stumbled onto your thread and thought I would send a reply. My system consists of an HAI Omni Pro II with Russound CAV and CAA units. I have the Uno keypads in the rooms, however I use Casatunes to run the system. Casatunes is excellent. The guys there are great and are there at every turn if you have questions. I have been using it for over three years. I installed it on a home built WHS, which stores all my music, photos, MCE recordings, etc. I use my android and Itouches to control the Russound and HAI.

I have also used the Sonos and they are very nice devices. I temp hooked a ZP90 up as a source through the Russound and when selected thru Casa, I then pull up the Sonos app and run the music selection, media from the WHS, pandora and all other internet music Sonos is tied into. Casa also has some internet music selections, but Sonos does a better job at this.

I also use the HAI with the HTX Home theater extender box with Omni studio software and the HAI 10p touch panel. I programmed the touch panel to control my dedicated theater. It all works nicely together.

Good Luck