Another surge protection question...

[jmark71]

Hey Guys,

Here in Atlanta last week, as many of you may have heard, it got rather wet. We were quite lucky in that our house is a good 50 feet above the 100 year flood plain in the area, so were spared, at least from flooding. However, we did not get by unscathed...

Early on Monday, a nearby lightning strike caused a power surge. Now most of our equipment is stored safely away in the basement (although now I'm going to be thinking about waterproofing!) and is connected to an APC UPS unit. However, in my infinite wisdom, I forgot to put some sort of surge protection on the outlets behind the wallmounted TVs in the bedroom and family room (BIG OOOPS!), so the surge (as far as we can tell) tripped the breaker to the family room, but managed to sneak into the TV, fry it, jump into the CAT6/HDMI balun down to the matrix switch in the basement, and then up to the TV in the bedroom frying it! The matrix switch (an awesome Octava unit - I'll post a review seperately) actually seemed to survive the event though. Obviously, I was non-plussed with the TV repairs coming to around $1,300 (since my deductible is $1,000, it didn't make sense to file a claim).

Anyway... so there's the background... I've read a few posts recently here about whole house surge protection and that's probably the way I'll end up going. However, I also realize that protection at the device level is important even with the WH protection in place, so I've now (after the horse left the barn) added Leviton surge outlets behind the two TVs. Once the WH protection is there, I'll feel reasonably safe with the obvious exception of a direct hit. However, I have two concerns:

1) How do I protect from a surge coming into the house via the DirecTV dish line? Is that a realistic worry for a grounded system? The unit is a SWM and I've read that you shouldn't use surge protection on these units? So what are you to do.

2) We also have a cable line coming in (buried in the yard, so not a HUGE concern, but I want to cover all bases) that connects to the Cable Modem inside. Is there anything I need to do there?

Sorry for the long post... getting this out is somewhat therapeutic though

Any suggestions?

 

[Ira]

I started a similar thread last week.

Some people think it's overkill and/or worthless, but I'm getting several of the ZeroSurge boxes to put in front of my UPS's for my computers and my HT equipment. They are running a 20% off sale thru tomorrow on a couple of the boxes I was planning on getting. I will probably also put in a WH suppressor.

As with you, the part I'm still unsure about is the DirecTV dish. Mine had it's own wire running to it's own ground rod that I put in when I installed my first dish. But when DTV sent out an installer to upgrade me to a 5-LNB dish, he disconnected the ground. I didn't notice until months later, but I've never found out why. The problem I have is my electrical system ground rod is over 150' away from the dish.

I had a lightning strike fry my first DVR about 10 years ago. That's the only time I've ever lost anything to lighning. I was home when it happened, and I could smell the burnt plastic afterwards. I pulled off the cover and powered it up, and you could see a couple of wires arc'ing. At that time, all I had were the cheap suppessor/power strips. Fortunately, nothing else was damaged.

Wonder if the subject of protecting a DirecTV system has come up over on DBSTalk.

 

[MikeMelga]

Hi.

I'm new to this whole 'home automation' business. I am still building my house but I already bought 2 things to help me prevent surges:

The first one I bought, and most the important, was the UPS. I guess this effectively protects everything connected to it's outlets.

The second was a configurable kit I found by APC - it's called Protectnet:

It comes in two flavours: standalone or rackmounted. The rackmounted consists of a blank 1U panel with 24 slots for protection modules. Protection modules include: RS232, lan, analog of digital phone line and coaxial/cable TV.

Perhaps this may help.

 

[felixrosbergen]

For incoming CATV is used a surge protected splitter with it's ground connected to the house ground.

 

[drozwood90]

I would have done the same thing (splitter with ground). My issue is, in my new house, the ground and Neutral are tied together. I'd rather NOT put that kind of voltage into the neutral lines...but I suppose if the ground is "groundie" enough, then it should sink the voltage / current before it destroys anything by hitting everything on the neutral??

In my first house, I just tied that kind of thing to the copper pipes in the house. I guess for this, I'm going to need to tie it to ground outside (Cable / phone), and then to the grounding bar in my panel inside (antenna / w800 antenna)?

--Dan

 

[Ira]

The second was a configurable kit I found by APC - it's called Protectnet:

It comes in two flavours: standalone or rackmounted. The rackmounted consists of a blank 1U panel with 24 slots for protection modules. Protection modules include: RS232, lan, analog of digital phone line and coaxial/cable TV.

That looks interesting except for one thing...they don't have a surge module that fits in the chassis or rack for a gigabit ethernet connection. The only option is the "twice as expensive" standalone device. The phone/satellite stuff looks good. I guess the 10/100Mb surge module would be good for things like network printers or other stuff that isn't gigabit.

 

[MikeMelga]

That looks interesting except for one thing...they don't have a surge module that fits in the chassis or rack for a gigabit ethernet connection. The only option is the "twice as expensive" standalone device. The phone/satellite stuff looks good. I guess the 10/100Mb surge module would be good for things like network printers or other stuff that isn't gigabit.

Isn't the RJ45 surge protector suitable for gigabit? Does the fact being gigabit requires a different model? What's the difference?

 

[Ira]

That looks interesting except for one thing...they don't have a surge module that fits in the chassis or rack for a gigabit ethernet connection. The only option is the "twice as expensive" standalone device. The phone/satellite stuff looks good. I guess the 10/100Mb surge module would be good for things like network printers or other stuff that isn't gigabit.

Isn't the RJ45 surge protector suitable for gigabit? Does the fact being gigabit requires a different model? What's the difference?

They have two devices for networks (i.e., RJ45 connections). The PNETR5 is a module that fits in either the rack or the chassis, but it's only for 10/100 Base-T (Cat5) networks. The PNET1GB is rated for gigabit (1000 Base-T Cat5e/6) networks, but it is a standalone device and doesn't fit in the rack or chassis.

The response I got from APC asking about the availability of a gigabit module...

Thank you for contacting APC's email support on 09/30/2009 04:49 PM. I would be happy to assist you.

I understand your concern and I am really sorry to say that at this time there no Gigabit Protect net which fits in to rack and I will not be able to provide you the ETA( estimated time of availability) for this product.

Yes, APC will release this product at the earliest and even I can forward your request to the concern development team for further investigation on this product.

Pretty useless response, unless the response is meant to "freeze" you from buying some other product on the hope that their gigabit module will come out sometime soon.

I wonder how important the network surge suppression modules really are (assuming one believes that any surge suppression device is useful, which some people don't believe). If all the network devices are protected on the electricity side by being plugged into a surge suppressor, and the DSL (and phone) lines are protected by individual devices before before they plug into any device, and the satellite dish is protected by having the coax cables connected to a surge device where they enter the house, how can the network get a surge? Few networks have any other connections to the outside world other than DSL/phone/satellite/electrical. Where does a network-originated surge come from if everything that connects to the network is protected before it connects to it? Maybe it's possible for one of the network devices to fail internally and cause a spike on the network.

Ira

 

[AO-Brandon]

We have seen a lot of success with the HT500PC by TrippLite. I usually include at least one in every bid that I do and they almost always end up with one per TV.

HT-500PC - Product Overview

Protection Type: EMI / RFI
Plug/Connector Type: NEMA 5-15P
Receptacles: 2 x NEMA 5-15R
Load Capacity: 1440W
Input Voltage: 110V AC
Frequency: 50Hz / 60Hz
Surge Energy Rating: 5100J
Power Cord/Cable: 120 " 14Gauge
Dimensions: 1.38" Height x 3.5" Width x 8.6" Depth

 

[swaggy]

Would a TVSS (such as this one: http://www.levitonproducts.com/catalog/model_51120-1.htm) be considered as adequate protection from surges coming from the street? I am putting one in because I plan to use UPB light switches in my house.

 

[Ira]

We have seen a lot of success with the HT500PC by TrippLite. I usually include at least one in every bid that I do and they almost always end up with one per TV.

HT-500PC - Product Overview

For the same price, you can get a ZeroSurge or Brick Wall suppressor which have argueably better technology.

Do you use many of the TrippLite AV550SC UPS's in structured wiring cabinets? It looks pretty good to me as an alternative to regular batteries, but I'm new at all of this. BTW...your website shows the AV550SC list price as $158, but you sell it for $229. :lol:

 

[Ira]

Anyone know what happens to the devices like the APC ProtectNet modules when they become unable to provide any protection, e.g., when they've taken a hit? Does the phone not see a phone line connection anymore? Does the LAN device not see a LAN connection anymore? Or does everything still work but the ProtectNet module doesn't provide any protection?

Thanks,
Ira

 

[intozwave]

I live in Florida and one of the lighting capitals of the world - have had a DTK-WH8PLUS Whole House Surge Protection Kit on my residence for a while. Also have had this installed on a couple of my parents houses and have not lost any equipment.