Custom security camera setup recommendation?

[scottl31]

Hi,

My boss would like to set up cameras around the office that when motion is detected, it will call his iPhone and allow him to speak back and forth with the "intruder." He wants to see who is coming and going and when, among those who have access codes to the monitored security system.

Preferably wireless cameras that have an ethernet port with a POE option. Continuous live viewing over the iPhone would also be desirable for if he ever wanted to check in on the office to make sure we all aren't goofing off.

Anybody know if there are any off the shelf systems that do this? If so, then the ability to add other devices like sensors or smoke alarms would also be desirable.

Thanks,
Scott

 

[drvnbysound]

Not that it isn't possible, but I don't know of any surveillance system that will actually call a phone and then allow 2-way communication. That said, there are cameras (such as the Axis I have listed in the classifieds) that has a PIR sensor for motion, which could be used to send notifications (e.g. text or email) and could be configured for remote access, which does then provide the 2-way voice communication.

Here is a link to the camera on the Axis website: http://www.axis.com/...cts/cam_m1031w/

Here is a link to the classified add I have posted: http://cocoontech.co...network-camera/

 

[elvisimprsntr]

Is your boss paranoid? Or just compulsive obsessive?

You may want to look into cameras with built in motion detection and SMS/MMS messaging. I use IP cameras from Trendnet.com

 

[tmbrown97]

It's doable - there are cameras that will make a SIP call based on detected motion and follow rules. That said, if a client asks me for that, I walk away; if a boss asked me for that, I'd recommend a vendor so it's not on me - and I'd start looking for other jobs!

 

[pete_c]

I used Axis cameras/servers in the early 2000's. Actually totally modded the OS for an enterprise endeavor. I had much fun with the project.

The issues that I had with the "little" enterprise project (~ 100k company) related to destruction of the cameras wherever they were mounted.

Sometimes they only lasted 1-2 days.

I did though have to manage a combo IT / construction project in the late 2000's.

I wanted the ability to be able to monitor progress without me being there and did so with numerous IP cameras at the job site.

I still needed to do daily visits but the cameras helped me monitor project progress.

 

[JonW]

Seems to me that you could put together a system using HAI security w/ two way audio option and motion based cameras that would trigger the alarm to dial out. Not sure if HAI's cameras can trigger an event on motion, but if not, 3rd party recording systems can trigger an I/O port on motion that can be wired to an input off the HAI panel. It can also handle your security and smoke alarms.

 

[pete_c]

I am today sort of playing with this stuff.

I can turn on and off CCTV recording alarm functions with two methods (actually more via the HAI panel).

I have a question here now relating to a program block.

Can I trigger an event using two triggers with an "or" statment.

IE:

Here is an example:

When XXX is not ready (hardwired sensor)
or
when XXX is not ready (a different hardwired sensor)
and if time clock 1 is enabled
then do this or that (here is the recording CCTV event)

I cannot put the "or" between the two "when" statements. I can put an "or" after the trigger and the condition line.

Is there another way to do this without adding another programming block?

Answering my own question noticed that I can use two "when" statement and that will work. It doesn't make sense to me though.

When XXX is not ready (hardwired sensor)
when XXX is not ready (a different hardwired sensor)
and if time clock 1 is enabled
then do this or that (here is the recording CCTV event)

I am looking to be able to control the alarm CCTV recording functions with some simple but multiple function single program block lines using hardware sensors connected to the HAI OPII.

 

[Del91574]

It seems that nobody ever considers the legal aspect in regards to cameras and audio....I've had to deal with this many many times as well as design such systems to be compliant. Signage isn't going to be an answer, it never holds up in court 90% of the times as it's typically not worded correctly, placed conspicious enough, letters the right size, or brought to the attention of the subject parties.

Nearly all audio recording without consent of one or all parties is unlawful. Recording audio is very different from video, and there are definite federal and state laws prohibiting surreptitious recording and monitoring of audio interactions. These laws are taken extremely seriously by authorities and failure to adhere to them could result in serious consequences. There are two types of defined recording situations for audio recording. They are usually identified as "One Party Consent" and "Two Party Consent".

"One Party Consent" means that only the person doing the recording has to give consent and does not have to notify the other party or parties that the conversation is being recorded.

"Two Party Consent" means the person recording the conversation must notify all of the other parties that the recording is taking place and they must consent to the recording.


Federal Audio Recording Laws

The federal wiretapping statute, also known as the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, permits phone calls (traditional, cellular and cordless) and other electronic communication to be recorded with the consent of at least one party, or "one party consent", to the conversation. This means that should you be among the people taking part in the conversation, it may be recorded because one person has consented to the recording.


State Audio Recording Laws

• States with "One Party Consent" for Audio Recording
  • Alabama
  • Alaska
  • Arizona
  • Arkansas
  • Colorado
  • District of Columbia
  • Georgia
  • Idaho
  • Indiana
  • Iowa
  • Kentucky
  • Louisiana
  • Maine
  • Minnesota
  • Mississippi
  • Missouri
  • Minnesota
  • Nebraska
  • New Jersey
  • New Mexico
  • New York
  • North Carolina
  • North Dakota
  • Oklahoma
  • Oregon
  • Ohio
  • Rhode Island
  • South Carolina
  • South Dakota
  • Tennessee
  • Texas
  • Vermont
  • Virginia
  • West Virginia
  • Wisconsin
  • Wyoming

• States with "Two Party Consent" for Audio Recording
  • California
  • Connecticut
  • Delaware
  • Florida
  • Hawaii
  • Illinois
  • Kansas
  • Maryland
  • Massachusetts
  • Michigan
  • Montana
  • Nevada
  • New Hampshire
  • Pennsylvania
  • Utah
  • Washington

A Note About Intent

Since many US states have a “gray area” in regard to hidden camera surveillance, the concept of “intent” has often been brought into the legal spotlight. Should you be taking hidden video surveillance of your nanny to ensure that she is keeping your children safe, this is seen as acceptable intent. However, if you are taking video surveillance of visitors to your home in order to blackmail, this can be considered malevolent intent. It’s also illegal, as stated before, to take hidden video of individuals in locations of expected privacy in certain states.


As I've said elsewhere, while it may seem "ok" on the outward appearances, all it takes, especially in the case of a business, is one person to complain or there to be an incident. Guaranteed to end up in court and the loser is typically the business or business owner.

 

[pete_c]

Thank you Del for the enlightenment regarding the legal aspects of camera and audio and hidden cameras.

I don't even know how I got involved in my last security project relating to security cameras.

I was doing mostly doing IT project work. The company had offices large and small all over the world. I did notice that they did have security cameras internationally mostly and only some offices domestically and in Canada. (EU, Middle East, Latin America, Pacific Rim et al).

Some guy who worked for this company walked into one of the company's offices one day where his wife worked. It was in the morning. Just a regular office and just a regular day.

He walked up to his wife and shot her in the head in front of everybody in the office that day.

And so my project began to install security cameras.

I learned some stuff while doing the beginning of this project (mostly checking out vendors and their wares).

 

[drvnbysound]

Based on the OP, I didn't see the need for audio to be recorded (or monitored for that matter) but rather provide a means of communication once motion is detected...

 

[Del91574]

There's a difference between (essentially) a video intercom and cameras with listen in capability. The legal issue is the listen in capability, where it can be used without the other party's notice, even if there's signage, waivers, etc. There's always going to be a "legal" expectation of privacy, even with cameras unless they're installed in public space (very strict legal definitions). By having it automatic and open communication lines without consent or informing the party involved, it's a slippery slope.

Once you start with the cameras, you're opening that can of worms if audio is involved...one incident or report and it's not going to be a pretty sight. Even just having the audio being broadcast with the video to a smartphone or PC starts opening up the wiretapping question(s).

As a pro, unless it's a video intercom (hell, even Aiphone does IP products) I wouldn't touch a proposal to do a project with automatic audio and listen in with a 10 foot pole.

 

[gatchel]

Even Aiphones can be used to listen in on conversations. Side entrance to a building, smokers standing outside chatting....I've seen it happen.


I used to work with Adpro VMD and recording products. The equipment allowed you to set up intelligent VMD criteria. Once the criteria was met, it would send an alarm to the CMS software with 3 frames of video for quick identification. You could then connect to the site live and allow 2 way audio communications to the "intruder". None of the audio was recorded. I don't know if they now make an "App" version or App compatibility. Also, it's cheap.

 

[scottl31]

Wow, a lot of responses. I thought there were none. I must have forgot to find where to enable notification of messages on the the thread. I'll find that and start reading from the top. Thanks everybody.

 

[scottl31]

OK, the intention is not to record or even have the cameras hidden. But recording seems to be part of what most of these systems do.
 
I'm baffled that anybody has any worry about any legalities when you are talking about somebody illegally gaining access to your premises. My boss's feeling about that is if a burglar beaks in and wants to sue him for recording, then bring it on. If I can get recommendations without worrying about the legal aspects, that would be great.
 
What I've seen are a lot cameras/systems that have 2-way audio on them which will detect motion and send an email (or text, or call) to the iPhone and then you can log in to the system and see what's going on and speak back and forth with the intruder. All I want is to know which of these are the best, or at least the ones that should be avoided.
 
Thanks,
Scott

 

[elvisimprsntr]

Talk to a lawyer before you install anything.