Where to install ceiling speakers?

[CORT]

Hello fellow audio enthusiasts. I have a central audio system that I am slowly installing in my house, and I am looking for suggestions on where to install ceiling speakers in a master bathroom. The room is approx 12' x 13' with 9' ceilings, and it will have its own dedicated 2 channel zone from the central audio amp. One of my greatest concerns is that 2 speakers may not be enough to provide adequate coverage for the room. The room gets a lot of use, so I want the audio to be "right". Where would you place the speakers, and how many would you install? Note the speakers have not yest been purchased for the room, but whatever purchased should have metal tweeters and rubber surrounds to minimize the impact of humidity. Placing a speaker over the shower is an option, though I'm not sure it is good practice. Here is the floor plan. A speaker in the commode area is not expected.

 

[BryanE]

Would you like the sound to fill the entire room or is listening in the shower more important?

Filling a 12x13 ft. room with sound shouldn’t be a problem with two speakers. You have plenty of options out there and typically with in-ceiling or in-wall speakers aesthetics are an important factory. In your situation, dispersion is crucial. Using a coaxial solution with a downward facing mid/tweeter probably isn’t going to do the best job. You might want consider something like these:

http://nhthifi.com/current/products/speakers/ic3.html

Or go with an ic4 if size doesn’t matter.

You could also consider something smaller like the Kohler Sound Tile solution from Polk:

http://www.us.kohler.com/onlinecatalog/new...d=1176778010678

 

[sic0048]

Getting proper stereo sound from two different speakers in a room like that where you have really three distinct listening areas (sinks, tub, shower) is going to be impossible. So I wouldn't even try. Instead I would look at using a single point, dual coil speaker. These speakers send out L&R sound from a single point. You might need two of these speakers in that room, but you would get stereo sound from both speakers. You could place one by the tub/shower and another above the sinks.

Something like this in a 6 1/2 size or something like this in a 8" size.

EDIT - added 8" size speaker link since that size is probably more appropriate in that sized room.

 

[drvnbysound]

Getting proper stereo sound from two different speakers in a room like that where you have really three distinct listening areas (sinks, tub, shower) is going to be impossible. So I wouldn't even try. Instead I would look at using a single point, dual coil speaker. These speakers send out L&R sound from a single point. You might need two of these speakers in that room, but you would get stereo sound from both speakers. You could place one by the tub/shower and another above the sinks.

SOmething like this.

While my MBA isnt quite as large, I used the exact speaker you pictured in my home. I have 4 of them - one in kitchen, MBR, MBA, and one in the soffit on the outside of my front door.

I agree, that true "stereo" sound is going to be quite impossible to get - at least any normal stereo staging.

These speakers (the dual VC ones) do take both Left and Right inputs from your amplifier, usually a zone. So unless you are willing to give up more than 1 zone just for the MBA I wouldnt put more than one in there. I think one of these in the center of the room would still work well. While I dont claim to be a "pro", its how I would do it.

If you are worried about sound dispersion, I would put (standard single VC speakers) one adjacent to both the shower and tub, and another between each vanity. Something like this:

 

[Steve]

I am certainly no audiphile either but I do have several of the Proficient dual VC speakers. I use the 8" C800TT. They work very well. I am currently remodeling the master bath and it is very similar size - roughly 13x9 in the same config except I ditched the tub and both sinks are next to each other next to the shower. I had planned to put another C800TT in there as well. I'd probably put it a little closer to the shower so you hear it better over the water. I think it would be plenty loud in a room that size.

 

[sic0048]

You would have to check the specs of the actual distribution amplifier, but I suspect you could probably hook two speakers up in series parallel (thanks drvnbysound for the correction) on a single zone. Just make sure the amp is rated for a 4ohm load.

Actually, I bet you could get away with a single 8" speaker if you mounted it about where the "S" in "Masterbath" is located on the building plan.

 

[beelzerob]

We have an enclosed shower (as in COMPLETELY enclosed...it's a steam room too) and we put a small speaker in there, as well as one in the outer area (so the tub could hear it too). We're not overly concerned about sound quality since this is background music.

The speaker we got are from steam-sauna-bath. 4 Ohms each, so we'll just run those in series off one channel.

The shower area is quite noisy, and in our last house, we had a speaker outside the shower area and could never hear anything (and that wasn't a fully enclosed area either). Volume in the shower area is going to be an issue I think, as when the showers are running it's noisy, and when the steam is running it's quiet. So we may have to develop some kind of means of simple volume control from within the shower (I'm leaning towards waterproof remote control).

However, it's probably not often we'll be listening to music during showers...probably more often during steaming. We'll see...

 

[drvnbysound]

You would have to check the specs of the actual distribution amplifier, but I suspect you could probably hook two speakers up in series on a single zone. Just make sure the amp is rated for a 4ohm load.

Actually, I bet you could get away with a single 8" speaker if you mounted it about where the "S" in "Masterbath" is located on the building plan.

Two 8-ohm speakers in series, nets a 16-ohm load.

Two 8-ohm speakers in parallel, nets a 4-ohm load.

As said, assuming your amplifier can handle it, wiring 2 of the dual VC models in parallel would be another option.

My MBA doesnt have a dedicated shower, only standard tub with shower head. My speaker is mounted approx. 1-2' outside of our tub, so I can physically look up and see it when Im in the shower. This works out well for my application, it's easy to hear.

I do have a wall mounted volume control near the vanity area. If Im planning to listen to music while in shower, I turn on shower first, and adjust the volume so I can still hear music with the water running - then hop in... no issues this way

 

[Neurorad]

The sound in my cavernous MBR blows, with 2 in-ceiling speakers. 11 foot ceilings, all solid surface.

I haven't come up with a good solution in the last year and a half, and I've been thinking about ways to improve it.

Perhaps multiple pairs of speakers? Some acoustical treatments will be in order, when we're done with our renovation.

 

[CORT]

The sound in my cavernous MBR blows, with 2 in-ceiling speakers. 11 foot ceilings, all solid surface.

I haven't come up with a good solution in the last year and a half, and I've been thinking about ways to improve it.

Perhaps multiple pairs of speakers? Some acoustical treatments will be in order, when we're done with our renovation.

Your experience is exactly what I am hoping to avoid. While I don't have 11' ceilings, I do have a lot of hard surfaces in the bathroom. My suspicion is that large spaces with hard surfaces need multiple speakers, i.e. 3 or 4 speakers in a space that would normally be served by 2. The next question to ask is can the space be served by 6" rather than 8" speakers.

 

[sic0048]

The only way adding more speakers in a situation like that won't create even more problems is if you try to localize each speaker. IE have a speaker in the shower enclosure, one at listening level around the tub, and one over by the sinks. I'd also think that having separate speaker controls for each speaker is almost a neccessity. That way you could leave the tub and shower speakers off unless actually in the shower or tub.

Adding more sound sources is just going to create more reflection points in a acoustically unfriendly environment.

 

[CORT]

Thanks to all who replied. At the moment, I am contemplating installing 4 or 5 smallish 5 1/4" dual voice coil speakers in the bathroom as shown below (speaker locations in red). My motivation is to put more drivers in the room to allow for lower volume levels and hopefully reduced sound wave reflections from the bathroom's hard surfaces. The speaker in the shower area might be a little iffy, so I need to be sure that the model I am looking at is appropriate for humid environments. However, there is a nice Panasonic exhaust fan over the center of the shower stall.

What are people's thoughts on my speaker plan B?

 

[Sokoloff]

I suspect that plan will work out better, though you will obviously need to pay attention to impedances (the "ohms" rating) with serial/parallel speakers.

You might also want to get a few extra speakers and treat the shower one as a "consumable" to be replaced every 3-5 years. If that's your only problem, it's not the end of the world, IMO, in exchange for music in the bath.