X-10 pro/con

[PaulD]

My current OPII system is built around UPB but I also have the capability to play around with X-10. Looking at using X-10 for some non critical/safety situations because the components are dirt cheap compared to similar UPB units. I know X-10 has communications issues but that is not what I am asking about here so don't bash X-10 here because of communication issues. My questions relate to the performance and reliability of the X-10 devices in general (excluding communication issues). Do they perform as advertised? Do they have a short life? Any major issues to be aware of?

An example would be using a MS14A wireless motion sensor to turn on a closet light. My closet light switches are UPB but I did not run wire for a closet door sensor when I built my house. I have several other trivial applications I would like to mess around with also.

 

[tenholde]

My current OPII system is built around UPB but I also have the capability to play around with X-10. Looking at using X-10 for some non critical/safety situations because the components are dirt cheap compared to similar UPB units. I know X-10 has communications issues but that is not what I am asking about here so don't bash X-10 here because of communication issues. My questions relate to the performance and reliability of the X-10 devices in general (excluding communication issues). Do they perform as advertised? Do they have a short life? Any major issues to be aware of?

An example would be using a MS14A wireless motion sensor to turn on a closet light. My closet light switches are UPB but I did not run wire for a closet door sensor when I built my house. I have several other trivial applications I would like to mess around with also.

I am mostly UPB, but I use X10 wireless devices. I would recommend looking at DS10a instead of the MS14A for a closet door. What are you using to receive X10 wireless signals? I'm using W800 with a HomeSeer plugin and all works well.

tenholde

 

[RAM]

My current OPII system is built around UPB but I also have the capability to play around with X-10. Looking at using X-10 for some non critical/safety situations because the components are dirt cheap compared to similar UPB units. I know X-10 has communications issues but that is not what I am asking about here so don't bash X-10 here because of communication issues. My questions relate to the performance and reliability of the X-10 devices in general (excluding communication issues). Do they perform as advertised? Do they have a short life? Any major issues to be aware of?

An example would be using a MS14A wireless motion sensor to turn on a closet light. My closet light switches are UPB but I did not run wire for a closet door sensor when I built my house. I have several other trivial applications I would like to mess around with also.

I agree with tenholde about using a DS10A for the closet light application.
I have 100% X10 yet (no zwave, UPB, etc.) and it works very well for me. I have had very few hardware failures over the years and with X10 being so cheap, it has never been a problem. With a few filters in the right place and a good coupler/repeater, I am very happy with my 'old' X10 stuff.

 

[pete_c]

I still use "old" X-10 keypads and just recently playing with DS10A's. I use both a W800 and an MR26.

When testing my sprinkler system I use the palmpad outside and I am able to turn on each zone manually with no issues.

Currently testing two DS10A's connected to my W800. One is in the garage mounted inside of an old Rainbird box (with Rain8's) connected to my Rainbird rain sensor and it is working well with no issues to date. The other DS10A is mounted in the basement also talking well with the W800.

Historically at one time many years ago in my old home did use the small "Eagle" eye devices and they worked well. (even the 3-4 outside located ones).

 

[PaulD]

What are you using to receive X10 wireless signals? I'm using W800 with a HomeSeer plugin and all works well.

I have a WGL UPB572 transceiver (not hooked up yet) that I intend to use for a wireless transceiver. See it here. It is designed to receive wireless X-10 commands and convert them to UPB commands which are then input as UPB commands into the powerline via a UPB PIM. As a result, all X-10 wireless commands will become UPB commands on my powerline. My OPII also has a X-10 wired transceiver hooked directly to powerline for any wired X-10 application that needs powerline for X-10 signals. I do not currently plan to use X-10 on my powerline unless there is no other option. From what I have read, I cannot put any X-10 filters or phase couplers in my system because they cause problems with UPB signals.

 

[pete_c]

Interesting Paul, I was thinking of testing UPB leaving my X10 powerline switches intact and connected to OPII.

I believe that the W800 doesn't broadcast to the powerline but maybe the MR26 does (never checked)....great idea (device) to keep your powerline utilizing only UPB.

 

[tenholde]

I have a WGL UPB572 transceiver (not hooked up yet) that I intend to use for a wireless transceiver. See it here. It is designed to receive wireless X-10 commands and convert them to UPB commands which are then input as UPB commands into the powerline via a UPB PIM. As a result, all X-10 wireless commands will become UPB commands on my powerline. My OPII also has a X-10 wired transceiver hooked directly to powerline for any wired X-10 application that needs powerline for X-10 signals. I do not currently plan to use X-10 on my powerline unless there is no other option. From what I have read, I cannot put any X-10 filters or phase couplers in my system because they cause problems with UPB signals.

I have a mixture of X10 and UPB on my powerline (phasing out X10) and use both X10 filters and an X10 coupler (along with UPB couplers) without affecting UPB signal strength.

tenholde

 

[PaulD]

Interesting Paul, I was thinking of testing UPB leaving my X10 powerline switches intact and connected to OPII.

I believe that the W800 doesn't broadcast to the powerline but maybe the MR26 does (never checked)....great idea (device) to keep your powerline utilizing only UPB.

I think the W800 is designed to capture X10 signals and send them out via serial to another device such as a computer. As far as I know, it does not do any signal conversion to UPB. The OPII has a port to plug in a X10 controller so you can send and receive X10 signals directly over powerline. I have one of those units also but have not tried to use my OPII for any X10 stuff yet. I have not tried to program anything via PCAccess for X10 stuff yet. I have seen X10 related commands on the programming menu but I suspect the command set it is very limited compared to what can be done with the other technologies.

 

[pete_c]

I have all X-10/Insteon switches for my powerline switches. These are connected X-10 fashion to the OPII. HS is connected to an Insteon PLM sending out Insteon protocol. I am doing most of the automation for lighting via OPII. The command set is limited but it works. IE: 0300c motion is detected outside via any of the outdoor sensors - all exterior lights go on. HS records said activity and tells ZM to save pics....I will be testing UPB by connecting a few sets of lights at a time. I was going to utilize it in the same manner with HS.

Historically started to play with X-10 around 1978. First computer to X-10 connection was around the beginning of Windows 3.1. Still have the computer and controller. I used a small POS computer. I believe it is a 286.

 

[oberkc]

I have NEVER had an X-10 hardware failure. My use is limited, however, to the last three years or so, maybe a bit longer.

 

[Photon]

I have something like 20 X10 devices that I can think of. I began in 1981 with lamp module and a tabletop controller so I could turn on a living room lamp before I descended the stairs in the dark of night. I gradually added items through the years as needed and as good deals presented themselves. I can think of just a single failure: A lamp module quit when I knocked the lamp over and broke the bulb. I discovered a blown fusible link when I performed a post-mortum, and it lives on since I soldered in a replacement. The only communication problem I've had is caused by the laptop on which I'm typing this, and that was esaily fixed with an XPPF filter. Three appliance modules spend December in coffee cans burried under snowbanks controlling Christmas lights. . .no problems.

I think it is interesting that the HR12A handheld wireless controller performs more reliably than my Elk M1XRF/GE xtal keyfob combo.

I wouldn't use X10 for a life-safety application or even to control a heating appliance, but I've been entirely satisfied with the technology for lighting control.

 

[pete_c]

I wouldn't use my HR 12A's for life-saftey connectivity to the OPII. Today various palm pads just run certain events. I used to use one to stream channels of internet audio and another one for my sprinkler system testing. Looking at the FOB combo for just security OPII related functions.

 

[trouble]

G'day

Before we did our renovation our whole house was X10, our ceiling lights were using the x10 lamp modules, had the electrician go in the roof and cut each cable between the light switch and the ceiling light and install a male and female power point. I then inserted the dimable lamp module in-between and it was a cheap and reliable lighting control. The only issue was all original light switches become unusable. We had about 18 light circuits like this, and used the x10 wireless sensors along with the x10 wireless palm remotes, and the back end was controlled by MisterHouse. The X10 wireless were communicating to MisterHouse and then to the powerline X10 modules via a W800.
I must say it worked well, and was reliable. The only real issue was the latency between the x10 PIR detecting you and the light turning on, it was about 1-1.5 seconds.

But i was fortunate enough to be able to change the whole house over to Clipsal C-Bus wired during the renovation, so I have all my X10 stuff in a box in the study gathering dust. Comparing the C-Bus to the X10 is quite fair, the x10 was (way way) less expensive, but the C-Bus is a cleaner and has very nice lcd light switches.

Paul

 

[Dave X10]

I have a whole house full of X10... and I am a big fan. I have found X10 does require a little engineering to construct a fully dependable system. But I haven't found it difficult to make my setup completely dependable. And even though a system of any size.. can be expensive.. X10 is the least expensive. I have several Pages about my setup and modifications.

But I also use other devices (not X10). Like switches that have motion sensors... someone even makes a motion sensor for bare-bulb fixtures.