Security/video system recommendations

I haven't had a security system in 5 years or so.  The last system was a GE Simon which was a monitored variety and worked pretty good for us, but that was a different property with different needs.  Our house previously was in a tight neighborhood with soccer moms around at all times.  Our new hous is in the country with no snooping neighbors.  However, we didn't need the security system before, but have had several breakins in the new neighborhood with no possible help from neighbors due to vegetation and property size.  I was hoping to get a few recommendations for what to look at for a system I plan on building/installing myself.  My goals are as follows:
 

• Self monitored (mobile app/text msg/push notify/etc)
• Use large array of wired door/window sensors already installed (haven't counted, but more than 16 would be my guess)
• Allow use of wireless sensors to expand network
• Control/controlled by X10 commands

 
I have an x10 automation system i nstalled that uses a CM15A connected to a Raspberry Pi running HomeGenie.  I can set up more complex commands through HomeGenie if necessary.  I was also thinking about adding video (probably 2-3 external cameras).  It would be great if everything worked together, but I don't know if that's possible or how complex that would be.
 
My first thought was to use the GPIO ports on the Raspi with HomeGenie and maybe use a video system from Costco (Samsung for instance).  Any suggestions?

Welcome to Cocoontech!
 
If you want to do home automation as well as security, the top choices for an alarm panel will be an Elk M1 Gold or a Leviton/HAI Omni Pro II. 
 
X10 isn't the best choice for home automation these days, but depending on your needs, it may be able to do what you need it to.  I still use X10 in my house for some basic automation.   Both the M1 and Omni Pro II can interface with X10 as well as other automation protocols.
 
Self monitoring is probably a big mistake.   There are times when you will be out of range, or otherwise unable to receive an alert from your system.   Then what?  You'll be much better off with a monitoring service like you can get from Alarm Relay or Next Alarm.  It's not all that expensive.

I had a monitored system before and found that it was terrible.  My father-in-law entered the house with Simon turned on.  He said the alarm wasn't very loud and the call to me came after several minutes.  I have read that a criminal can be in and out in 5-10 minutes, so at that rate, monitored systems are useless (assuming the monitor doesn't call me right away and the police don't respond for 20+ minutes anyway).  I figure self monitored + video would give me the ability to call police and have evidence.
 
I'm happy with my automation currently.  If I upgrade, I'll most likely expand to Insteon since some components are SmartHome/Insteon anyway.  The Simon unit claimed X10 compatibility, so I figured automation wouldn't be too big an ask.
 
Thanks for the suggestions.

I think you need to separate the issues that you had with your previous Simon system and the monitoring service.
 
If you feel the alarm siren isn't loud enough, that can be easily fixed by adding additional sirens, screamers, whatever you prefer.  It's a trivial matter if you are planning on installing the new system yourself.
 
If you don't like the response time of the monitoring service, then switch to a different one.  Their are numerous choices out there.   And if you install the system yourself, you are free to choose whatever service you think is best.  Many require no contracts, so it is easy to change.
 
You're right that most burglars don't stick around very long. 5 to 10 minutes is often about all they spend.  Though in a remote area, they might feel safe enough to stick around a bit longer.   When my neighbors were burglarized a few years ago, they spent an hour loading up a truck with stuff from the house, which had no alarm system.
 
I'm not sure what you are thinking you would do if you got the notification of a break in first, rather than the police.   If you think you'd check the video and then call the police yourself, you're just wasting time and making it less likely that anyone will get caught.
 
Nothing prevents you from having a system like the Elk or Omni Pro from notifying the monitoring service AND sending you an e-mail directly.   So you can have it both ways.
 
Just remember Murphy's Law.  If something can go wrong, it will.  You may be out of cell phone range.  The video system may not work. Or maybe both.  Using a monitoring service is just another level of defense.

You already named the first issue with your original panel....Simon. All in ones (AIO) are horrible as far as security and functionality, so that's what you've experienced. Integral siren/sounder and a keypad/control that is easily disabled and/or ripped off the wall (not arguing the tamper portion some AIO's offer, which can be negated easily as well).
 
Self monitoring is a choice to assume the liability, but keep in mind, you are NOT going to get response from the PD if you call them up and tell them your alarm is going off and/or are self monitoring unless you can physically prove there is an unauthorized entry.
 
Nothing is going to stop a smash and grab and no system is going to prevent that, the one thing a system does is put a time constraint on an intrusion and also report. The only item that is going to assist in a smash and grab is going to be a video system with more cameras and quality equipment to gather information and still, it may not catch anything useful.

Welcome to the Coocontech forum bkenobi.
 
+1 on the points mentioned above relating to self monitoring.

I want to throw in my opinion on a monitoring system vs self monitoring. I know that I wont get many to agree with me but I have so far decided on self monitoring.
 
It is my opinion that alarm systems do not catch thieves, they scare them away. In all of my personal experience I have never heard of an alarm system resulting in the capture of a thief. That is not to say that it has never happened but I have never heard of it. It is more common that the police arrive and check the place out to find that the thief entered and left in a hurry.
 
The alarm system is effective at deterring a thief by it's presence alone (signs, cameras, lights) and scaring a thief away with a loud siren and even more lights but I don't expect my system to catch a thief. By the time the monitor calls the owner and then calls the police and then add the time for the police to dispatch and arrive at the home.....well I just think that it;s a long shot that the thief will still be there.
 
I have decided to self monitor and get a camera or two that will record on motion detection. I will get email, text and maybe a phone call so that I can look in with the cameras and call the police myself. I understand that I am more likely to miss an alarm than a professional monitor but I just don't place that much value on getting notified of the alarm at all. I see the noise and lights as the main force of the system and hope that it will do the trick and put little faith in a human showing up in time to do any good.
 
I may change my mind at some point and feel free to try to convince me otherwise but I am not convinced that a professional monitor adds that much to the system.
 
Mike.

You are looking at a narrow purpose of an alarm system, Mike. Sure, if you only want to deter burglary, then I agree, having it monitored rarely results in apprehension of the burglar.
 
IMHO, if you're going to monitor, you should have burglary, fire, and CO monitored. Here are some points to consider:
 
1. What if you are out of touch for a variety or reasons, such as no internet or cell service, out of range, on a plane, driving your car in a place you cannot easily pull over (crossing a bridge), or other places you cannot use or are unable to use your cell phone. With monitoring, they may not catch the burglar, but the monitoring company will summon the police who can check your home and have it secured.
 
2. What about panic alarm? One press of that button summons the authorities without confirmation or a separate phone call. Panic alarms can also be programmed not to sound the local alarm. This lets you stay hidden without alerting the intruder you are in the home.
 
3. Do you want the call to the fire dept to be delayed while you check things out? I'd rather have the alarm company call the fire dept right away.
 
4. Carbon Monoxide could incapacitate you before you realize.
 
5. There can be substantial discounts on your homeowners insurance that lower your outlay for the monitoring service.
 
With a monitoring service, you can still receive the same alerts your receive with self-monitoring, giving you tome to check your cameras and let the monitoring company know whether you want them to dispatch the authorities.
 
I have ten cameras at my home, and they still do not cover 100%. One or two cameras won't help you much.
 
Lights and sirens do help, though the lights are of little use during the day. Sirens are generally ignored by neighbors and passersby, and professional burglars know that.
 
Hope this helps,
Kevin

Kevin:
 
You made some very good points and up until now I have been just looking at the burglary aspect of the system.
 
I have not gotten to fire/smoke detectors yet but they are next on my list and a good argument for a monitoring system.
 
I like the panic button and I do have wireless keyfobs to set off the alarm system sirens etc. At that point it will be up to me to dial 911.
 
And I admit that I did not consider that my homeowner's insurance might be discounted. I'll have to look into that.
 
Thanks for the input, Mike.

All good points that I will have to consider.  But, as multiple people have posted, I can switch services or self monitor down the road.  What I need a primer on is what hardware to look at.  Obviously the consensus is that the Simon is junk (no surprise since it's typically a free system).  So, what SHOULD I look at?  I was envisioning a security system, and a video system that could be linked, but maybe there's a better way to do that.  What brands/model numbers are considered good?  Or, maybe what should I avoid?  I know nothing other than Simon = bad and the local mass security store wanted to sell me a $10k+ combined "starter" sysem a few years back.  Oh, and FWIW, they recommended self monitored for my location, but I'm still open to considering the alternative expecially if I add CO2/fire sensors.

Yes, "self-monitoring" is really no monitoring.  No matter how "connected" you think you are, there will be many times when your not, and even when you are, do you actually think your camera(s) are going to send you pristine back pictures of the robbers taking your stuff or your house burning down?  Then what will you do those other times, let them just take your stuff? 
 
The real secret of creating a reliable security system is make it one you will ALWAYS use, and one that greatly minimizes false alarms.  We use a keyfob to are and disarm, and think that is the best way to go.  Also make sure you system has all the latest anti-false alarm technology, and make use of it. But do not kid yourself with the "self monitoring" thing.

ano said:

Yes, "self-monitoring" is really no monitoring.  No matter how "connected" you think you are, there will be many times when your not, and even when you are, do you actually think your camera(s) are going to send you pristine back pictures of the robbers taking your stuff or your house burning down?  Then what will you do those other times, let them just take your stuff?

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The PD around here will laugh at you if you called them...not trying to give you a hard time, but imagine the conversation with the operator:
Hello?
I think someone's breaking into my house
Where are you?
At work
How do you know this?
The alarm called me and I think I saw someone on a camera on/in my house
So you believe someone is breaking into your house, are you sure? Who is going to meet the officer at the house?
Nobody, I'm at work (shopping, jogging, the gym) but will be there as soon as I can leave.
 
I'm saying this because I work on large systems for municipalities and also have done my fair share of residential. In the case of specific systems, honestly, monitored and installed properly, I've had plenty of systems that resulted in apprehensions or mitigation of damages. If you want to catch someone in the house, you don't run audibles, those are mainly for the scare tactic and to inform end users an alarm is occuring independent of the keypad. Don't kid yourself, a single or pair of cameras is not going to catch anything useful or worthwhile other than seeing a general view with very little detail. Even 6-8 cameras isn't going to really catch much usable footage or resolution on a standard house for purposes of identification or really seeing what's going on. Ok, let's then talk about MP IP....now you've just increased the unit cost of the camera by 3-4X and may get pixel distortion which again, can render the footage or images unusable.
 
So in your case, you're going to attempt to stream bandwidth to whatever connected device you have, computer, I-droid, Win-fire or what have you....now have you considered the bandwidth that it takes to upload a video stream to whatever device? How about the codec the unit uses? What is your downstream bandwidth to the connected device? Are you planning on streaming a DVR? Even at 4G speeds and realistic frame sizes and rates you are going to have issues and the video will be choppy, even skip sections like a very old time lapse recording.
 
Signage, lights and similar do help deter the novices, but the honesty factor is nothing is going to stop someone that wants in. In the realm of reality that I've told accounts and friends, I can walk around a property during the day with a clipboard, tape measure and dress like a contractor and I don't look one bit out of place to anyone except the most nosy neighbors that happen to be home.
 
I only say this because I've got 20 years under my belt in the field with these systems and deal with small(ish) residences all the way up to full blown enterprise systems where a single recorder costs more than your car, not to mention they're monitored by in-house central stations (long discussion) and guards that meet all the standards of commercial monitoring.

Ironically (or perhapse not), the advice I'm hearing here has more or less led me to the same place I found several years ago after talking to the local security supplier/installer.  We were broken into back then and so I was gung ho to install a system right then.  I found that really there's nothing that can prevent a smash and grab at out place due to seclusion (also called privacy) and being outside of city limits (thus county sheriff coverage).  A monitored system will provide someone to call if the alarm goes off, but police response time will be pathetic.  When I found the door smashed in and called the police, they eventually arrived 1.5 hours later.  They found nothing they wanted to use even though I showed them a clean palm print with all 5 fingers on my bathroom mirror.
 
I was primarily concerned about the moving van scenario, but realistically I can solve that with a gate at the property entrance (be it motorized with codes or a simple coral style).  I am a DIY type that has just finished the automated lighting project(s) I was working on and figured I could install a simlpe panel for the sensors I have in place and add a couple wireless ones to cover the doors that are not covered.  It sounds like this is really pointless as insurance will replace anything that is lost.
 
Since recomendations on hardware to research seem hard to come by here, I guess I'll look at getting a gate and finding a different project to play with.

You're right that no security system can absolutely prevent a break in.   But having an alarm system is a deterrent.   Many/most thieves will go somewhere else if it is apparent that you have an alarm system.  Of course, there are some that won't, but you just have to think of it as a case of reducing the odds that you'll get burglarized.   Insurance is great if you do get robbed, but on the whole, I'd rather do what I can to reduce the chance that I'll have to make use of it. 
 
You asked for suggestions, and based on what you said you wanted to do in your original post, I suggested the Elk M1 and Omni Pro II.  They would be top choices if you want to combine security and automation. 
 
If you just want simple security, look at panels like the Honeywell/Ademco Vista series, GE/Interlogix NX series and the DSC Power Series systems.   All of these can work with both wired and wireless sensors.   Each brand has multiple models, depending on your needs and the number of sensors, keypads and other accessories that you plan to have.
 
Once you research them, you'll most likely have many questions.  You'll find folks here who can answer just about anything and tell you pros and cons for all of them.   No system is perfect in every way. You need to decide which is best for what you want to do.

My goals are as follows:

• Self monitored (mobile app/text msg/push notify/etc)
• Use large array of wired door/window sensors already installed (haven't counted, but more than 16 would be my guess)
• Allow use of wireless sensors to expand network
• Control/controlled by X10 commands

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You asked and you received honest answers from the folks here.    You can do what you like whatever it is.  Its your stuff.
 
No one here gets paid by the forum and just volunteer their answers. 
 
Much of the information here comes from DIYers just like you, folks that do commercial automation, software automation,  residential security and commercial security. 
 
The drive in the answers of what you see comes from folks that are very passionate about what they do and like about automation and this forum.
 

Since recommendations on hardware to research seem hard to come by here

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They are not. 
 
Heck; half the time I am on the forum I am mostly just reading and not posting as the forum has much information relating to automation and security and DIYing it all.
 
Don't let the answers dampen your DIY drive; keep reading on the forum and asking questions.