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Bypassing Ceiling fan Remotes


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#1 ano

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 10:29 AM

I usually bypass the remotes in ceiling fans so something like the Simply Automated Ceiling Fan switch can control them, which isn't to big a problem, but some of the newer ceiling fans use DC motors and have 6 speed remotes.  Has anyone successfully bypassed these remotes so they can be controlled by a wall switch? 



#2 kwilcox

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Posted 15 November 2014 - 06:15 PM

Those will be problematic.  I only bypass built-in lighting dimmers myself.



#3 Neurorad

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Posted 17 November 2014 - 06:20 AM

When I bought a new fan recently, I made sure it could be controlled with a pull chain.

#4 pete_c

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Posted 17 November 2014 - 08:33 AM

Has anyone successfully bypassed these remotes so they can be controlled by a wall switch?

 

No.  I have read about a take apart of the RF transmitter such that you can automate it. 

 

Here utilizing a few Hampton Bay ceiling fans.  These have pull chains and RF remotes to them.  Today I only utilize a UPB switch on the lamp side.

 

I have taken apart one fan and its just an RF module plus the analog pieces.

 

I have read of DIY combination automation of the RF remotes (involves a take apart) of a remote and being able to replicate the RF signals.

 

Misterhouse Hampton Bay RF Fan Control

 

I guess there is a standard relating to the RF commands and I am thinking it is or was 303.875MHz

 

The newer RF remote controllers also now utilize temperature settings.

 

Found this.

#
# brand:             Hampton Bay
# model:             UC7078T
# supported devices: Ceiling fan. Requires 303.875MHz RF transmitter
#
# Other Hampton Bay fans have similar remotes, but have no "Up Light",
# and the remote has a "Fan Forward/Reverse" button. I suspect these
# remotes would use the same codes, at least for the buttons that are
# common.
#
# The remotes use a Tiro wireless encoder/decoder set. I know the
# encoder is the M1E, but haven't cracked open the receiver to check
# the decoder. The datasheet for the M1D-95 has the pinout of the M1E,
# but that particular decoder is for a remote doorbell application.
# It can be found at
# http://www.tiro.cc/datasheet/doorbell/M1D-95.pdf
# I believe the decoder that is used has fewer address bits (they must
# be matched for outputs to be driven) and more data bits, since I am
# seeing 5 data bits driven, but the datasheet only shows 4.
#
# I looked up the FCC id on the back of the remote (CHQ8BT7078T) to
# determine the frequency of the remote (303.875MHz) at
# http://www.fcc.gov/oet/fccid/
# and ordered the transmitter from Computronics in Australia
# http://computronics.com.au/module/txrxpair/
#

begin remote

  name   UC7078T
  bits  7
  flags SPACE_FIRST|REVERSE
  eps            30
  aeps          100
  pre_data_bits 4
# Hex value of 4 dip switch code settings
  pre_data      0x0b
  header        400 300
  plead         700

# Even though space is sent first, pulse length is still  
# specified first.
  zero  300 700
  one   700 300

  min_repeat    5

  gap   12000

      begin codes
          KEY_LIGHTS_TOGGLE        0x48                      #  Was: LIGHT_UP
        FAN_HIGH        0x02
        FAN_MED         0x04
        FAN_LOW         0x08
        FAN_OFF         0x20
          KEY_LIGHTS_TOGGLE        0x40                      #  Was: LIGHT_DOWN
      end codes

end remote

How do I figure out the frequency range of my device?

 

You can go to the FCC govt site http://transition.fc.../oet/ea/fccid/9 And lookup your device's FCC ID.

 

The Hampton Bay fan remotes and similar devices such as RF controlled outlets, more popular in Europe, are an example of devices we are interested in supporting. These are covered by FCC Part 15, Subpart C, section 231

 

No hum fan speed controller



#5 ano

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Posted 17 November 2014 - 11:36 AM

Bypassing an AC motor is fairly easy if the remote is separate, usually located in the bottom.  There are typically two coils (four wires) going to the motor.  Put 120V across both and the fan runs full speed. Reverse the direction of one in relation to the other and the fan reverses. Add in some series capacitors, and the fan slows medium, low, etc.  Its not terrible difficult to bypass the remote, at least if you only want "high" but even if you want medium, its not terribly difficult.  Fan with pull-chains are a vanishing breed, and only the cheapest ones don't have a remote.

 

I guess remotes are fine for those that don't have automation, but its another remote to find to just turn on or off your fan, a pain.  With the Simply Automated fan controller, and an iPhone, I can control any fan anywhere without the stupid remote.

 

Unfortunately, like the addition of the "convenient" remote, the newest trend is DC motors which are much more efficient. Like remotes you usually don't have a choice if the wife likes the fan, but I was hoping someone might have some experience before I spent $300 in one.

 

If the fan companies cared the least but about us (home automation people) they would at least add a switch that would turn the fan on high when power was applied, then even with a remote it could be controlled, but instead they turn off when power is removed and reapplied. 

 

By the way, this is a side matter, but do those Simply Automated fan controllers look like they were pieced together as an afterthought, or what?  They control both the light and fan which is great, but there are no buttons to control the light. And the "high," "medium," "low," and "off," looked like they were printed on a laser printer.  Its a shame there aren't any other UPB fan controllers.



#6 Neurorad

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 06:31 AM

There are several online fan distributors that allow you to use pull chain as a search filter. This is one:

http://www.hansenwho...trol=Pull Chain

I spent days online looking for the perfect fan with a high WAF, a bright light kit, and a pull chain. The one we ended up buying is way too dim.

#7 ano

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 12:58 PM

There are several online fan distributors that allow you to use pull chain as a search filter. This is one:

http://www.hansenwho...trol=Pull Chain

I spent days online looking for the perfect fan with a high WAF, a bright light kit, and a pull chain. The one we ended up buying is way too dim.

With my new house i have really been rethinking my use of ceiling fan lights.  Since I live in Scottsdale, ceiling fans are pretty essential.

 

Around here, a bedroom typically has two or three switches. One switches an outlet which is used for a lamp, one controls the ceiling fan, and if there is a third, its the ceiling fan light, but often the ceiling fan and light use a dual switch in one switch space. 

 

As mentioned, ceiling fan lights usually are too dim, and the space for a bigger bulb is usually limited.  In many cases I usually skip the light kit, and use the ceiling fan wire to control other ceiling lights which I install, like track lighting. 

 

In my previous house, I had two switches for the ceiling fan and light, so I used one Simply Automated dimmer switch for the light, and a non-dimming switch for the fan. In my new house, there is only one switch for the ceiling fans (but two wires) so i decided to use the Simply Automated fan controllers which can actually control a fan and light.  That SOUNDS great, but these things are not all that pretty, and the only real way to control the light is with a link.  So a doubleclick on the switch next to it controls the ceiling fan light (or ceiling light).  Not ideal, but after 10+ years of UPB, about the best solution.



#8 rockinarmadillo

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Posted 23 November 2014 - 06:55 PM

I am currently in the market for several fans and have found that I have the same dilemma.    My wife has picked out a nice Emerson DC fan with a 6 speed wall switch.   It looks great and uses only 21 watts on high speed (which is about 1/4 of what the AC fan motors use)    It is a great fan, but it does not work with my automation system.

 

Here are the three options that I have come up with:

 

1. Change to a AC fan with a pull chain as Neurorad has suggested.   That is the simplest option, and great link by the way.

 

2. Hack a wireless controller as Pete has suggested.   This would be pretty easy if the wireless controller did not have a toggle switch with push for on and push for off.   To monitor the fan status, I would use a current switch that was designed for a small load.   The Veris H300 will go down to .15 amps, which should work at high speed, but at low speed?  Not sure.

 

3. Direct wire the Emerson DC fan to an automated relay switch for on/off control.   Then control the fan speed from the wireless handheld transmitter.   The wall switch transmitter that comes with the fan has two wires.   One for the hot wire coming in and one for the load to the fan.   No ground.  No neutral.   My guess is that the wall switch is pulling just enough current off of the line to power a RF transmitter.     But I can't find any detail on the web.   No response from tech support.

 

My preference is option 3.   We generally change the speed of our fans seasonally, so if the fan comes back on at the same speed it was when power was disconnected, it will be just fine for us.   However, I am reluctant to buy 6 fans without trying to see that it will work.     Does anybody here have one of these fans where they could try this?



#9 rockinarmadillo

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 09:42 PM

I finally got in touch with Emerson tech support.   It looks like option 3 will work, and that is the direction I am headed.   I will report back in a few months on how this works.



#10 Work2Play

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 01:23 AM

FWIW, with current sensors, if you need to detect higher amperage, you can wind the hot wire through it more than once.  If the fan pulls .1 amps and you need more, just wind a second time - now your current switch will see .2.

 

Awesome ideas guys - I'm lucky - my fans are old enough that they have the pull chains and I added the light kits myself.  California is stupidly restrictive about what light kits can be sold in stores - it's not worth it.  And table lamps - in basically every other state you get a light with a nice 3-way switch and 3-way bulb... in CA you get an on/off switch and a fluorescent bulb - which has already been proven numerous times to be harmful.  Idiots...

 

Simply Automated has such a great product operationally - they have the flexibility to do what much more expensive lighting systems can't (well, the UPB protocol does, and Simply Automated hits a price point, feature set, and reliability within that) - it's a shame that their products *LOOK* DIY.  Labeling your switches with printed paper?  What is this, the late 70's?  Today everything needs to be laser etched and look like it belongs in a multi-million dollar home.  I love my SA switches - especially the paddles since they look normal... but anything of theirs with buttons looks downright cheap and crappy.  The best/worst part is, it's just a faceplate - it wouldn't take much to make a new faceplate that looks 1000x better to just pop on an existing switch!



#11 jackjackattack

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 09:02 PM

I finally got in touch with Emerson tech support.   It looks like option 3 will work, and that is the direction I am headed.   I will report back in a few months on how this works.

 

This thread looks like it has been forgotten, but I am interested in your results rockinarmadillo.  My wife purchased an Emerson fan that I am expected to install and make work.  Did your bypass work?  Are you willing to share any instructions or advice?  I know enough not to electrocute myself.

 

Any help is appreciated and desperately needed.



#12 rockinarmadillo

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 10:13 AM

Works great.      You can replace the wall control that comes with the fan with a regular wall switch.   (in my case I used a UPB relay switch)  It will turn the fan on at the last known speed and direction.   You must then buy a hand held control to control the speed and direction.  I hardly ever change speed, so this fits my need just fine.

 

I also found that the RF wall control that comes with the fan is sensitive to interference.   Intermittently, I could not turn the fan on or off with the wall switch.   I traced the problem to my daughter's baby monitor.   When I turned the monitor off it worked fine.   Using the UPB relay switch eliminated the problem because on/off is no longer controlled by RF.

 

One more item.   The instructions tell you how to initiate and "condition" the fan.   This process tells the fan what type of blades are on it.   Dont skip this step.   It is important.






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