Can OmniProII be locked?

[tiger1234]

I am getting an HAI OmniPro II installed by a pro along with the security (doors, windows), fire alarms and omnistat. I was planning to add and program the lighting later myself.

However according to the installer, if they install the fire alarms, they will have to password protect the OmniPro II and I won't be able to get accesss to it. The reason being he doesn't want me to accidently change the fire alarm programming and turn it off.

He suggested getting a stand alone fire system that the electrician would install and then I can have access to the system. Does that sound right? This is the first time I have heard of this issue.

 

[ano]

I am getting an HAI OmniPro II installed by a pro along with the security (doors, windows), fire alarms and omnistat. I was planning to add and program the lighting later myself.

However according to the installer, if they install the fire alarms, they will have to password protect the OmniPro II and I won't be able to get accesss to it. The reason being he doesn't want me to accidently change the fire alarm programming and turn it off.

He suggested getting a stand alone fire system that the electrician would install and then I can have access to the system. Does that sound right? This is the first time I have heard of this issue.

The Omni Pro II does have an installer code, which if you are lacking, does prevent you from changing any setting (but not programming or other user settings) on the panel. Alarm installers sometimes play tricks like these so they can get you to use their monitoring or support. Its fine if you want to use it, but otherwise just added cost.

Depending where you live, most homes do require 120V smoke alarms wired together. I've never heard of any locals that DON'T require those, and having or not having smoke alarms on your panel makes no difference. So I would take their advice and DO install all the fire alarms required by code, but I would install them on your panel as well. If installing them on the panel prevents your installer from giving you the installer code, then just install them yourself.

So, agree with the installer in advance that he will give you the installer code, EVEN if you have to sign an agreement that he won't be held responsible. If your on CocoonTech, chances are your tech-savvy and won't be happy with your system unless you can get the installer code. If you don't get the code, sending the panel back to HAI is the only way to reset it.

 

[PaulD]

However according to the installer, if they install the fire alarms, they will have to password protect the OmniPro II and I won't be able to get accesss to it. The reason being he doesn't want me to accidently change the fire alarm programming and turn it off.

Total BS just to keep you tied to them as a customer. If they go out of business or you are unhappy with their service, you would not be able to go to another service provider without a major headache. You are BUYING their service thus YOU own the end product....not them. They need to give you the code or you need to find another installer.

 

[tiger1234]

I am getting an HAI OmniPro II installed by a pro along with the security (doors, windows), fire alarms and omnistat. I was planning to add and program the lighting later myself.

However according to the installer, if they install the fire alarms, they will have to password protect the OmniPro II and I won't be able to get accesss to it. The reason being he doesn't want me to accidently change the fire alarm programming and turn it off.

He suggested getting a stand alone fire system that the electrician would install and then I can have access to the system. Does that sound right? This is the first time I have heard of this issue.

The Omni Pro II does have an installer code, which if you are lacking, does prevent you from changing any setting (but not programming or other user settings) on the panel. Alarm installers sometimes play tricks like these so they can get you to use their monitoring or support. Its fine if you want to use it, but otherwise just added cost.

Depending where you live, most homes do require 120V smoke alarms wired together. I've never heard of any locals that DON'T require those, and having or not having smoke alarms on your panel makes no difference. So I would take their advice and DO install all the fire alarms required by code, but I would install them on your panel as well. If installing them on the panel prevents your installer from giving you the installer code, then just install them yourself.

So, agree with the installer in advance that he will give you the installer code, EVEN if you have to sign an agreement that he won't be held responsible. If your on CocoonTech, chances are your tech-savvy and won't be happy with your system unless you can get the installer code. If you don't get the code, sending the panel back to HAI is the only way to reset it.

Ano, can you clarify "does prevent you from changing any setting (but not programming or other user settings) on the panel"?

Isn't it the same thing? Can you please provide me with examples of each?

I am definitely getting the fire alarms; we have to under code. The only question is whether those fire alarms are connected to the OPII (where he claims he cannot give us the code) or not connected (stand alone, where we get the code). If we don't want them connected, he won't install them; we will have to get the electrician to install them. And you are right, I indeed won't be happy with the system unless he gives me an installer code.

 

[tiger1234]

I am getting an HAI OmniPro II installed by a pro along with the security (doors, windows), fire alarms and omnistat. I was planning to add and program the lighting later myself.

However according to the installer, if they install the fire alarms, they will have to password protect the OmniPro II and I won't be able to get accesss to it. The reason being he doesn't want me to accidently change the fire alarm programming and turn it off.

He suggested getting a stand alone fire system that the electrician would install and then I can have access to the system. Does that sound right? This is the first time I have heard of this issue.

The Omni Pro II does have an installer code, which if you are lacking, does prevent you from changing any setting (but not programming or other user settings) on the panel. Alarm installers sometimes play tricks like these so they can get you to use their monitoring or support. Its fine if you want to use it, but otherwise just added cost.

Depending where you live, most homes do require 120V smoke alarms wired together. I've never heard of any locals that DON'T require those, and having or not having smoke alarms on your panel makes no difference. So I would take their advice and DO install all the fire alarms required by code, but I would install them on your panel as well. If installing them on the panel prevents your installer from giving you the installer code, then just install them yourself.

So, agree with the installer in advance that he will give you the installer code, EVEN if you have to sign an agreement that he won't be held responsible. If your on CocoonTech, chances are your tech-savvy and won't be happy with your system unless you can get the installer code. If you don't get the code, sending the panel back to HAI is the only way to reset it.

Ano, can you clarify "does prevent you from changing any setting (but not programming or other user settings) on the panel"?

Isn't it the same thing? Can you please provide me with examples of each? To give you an idea of what I am planning to do - I will be buying and installing a Nuvo Grand Concerto, HAI UPB Lighting and Avatrix matrix switcher myself and eventually integrate it all into OPII.

I am definitely getting the fire alarms; we have to under code. The only question is whether those fire alarms are connected to the OPII (where he claims he cannot give us the code) or not connected (stand alone, where we get the code). If we don't want them connected, he won't install them; we will have to get the electrician to install them. And you are right, I indeed won't be happy with the system unless he gives me an installer code.

 

[Neurorad]

The installer just doesn't want you screwing up his work. I understand that. Discuss it with him.

If he is still reluctant, then find another installer who will work with you. There are probably many to choose from.

 

[Desert_AIP]

Depending where you live, most homes do require 120V smoke alarms wired together. I've never heard of any locals that DON'T require those, and having or not having smoke alarms on your panel makes no difference. So I would take their advice and DO install all the fire alarms required by code, but I would install them on your panel as well. If installing them on the panel prevents your installer from giving you the installer code, then just install them yourself.

Are you saying install a second set of smokes wired to the Omni?
or wire the 120V smokes to the Omni?
If the latter, how do you go about that?

 

[10Seconds]

Are you saying install a second set of smokes wired to the Omni?
or wire the 120V smokes to the Omni?
If the latter, how do you go about that?

I would be interested in that too, I did not think it could be done.

 

[Steve]

What you do is replace one of the 120V detectors with something like the GE 350CX that has a relay and tie that relay into a zone on the panel. There are many threads that discuss it. Search for 350CX.

 

[AutomatedOutlet]

Make sure you get the installer code.

 

[cornutt]

I am definitely getting the fire alarms; we have to under code. The only question is whether those fire alarms are connected to the OPII (where he claims he cannot give us the code) or not connected (stand alone, where we get the code). If we don't want them connected, he won't install them; we will have to get the electrician to install them.

Get the electrician to install the smoke alarms; you'll probably have to have it done on his permit anyway in order for it to pass inspection. Then you should be able to demand the installer code from the installer. Before the walls are closed up, run yourself a Cat5 from one of the smoke alarm locations (it doesn't matter which one) to the controller location. Once your panel is in and your installer is done, you can replace one of the smokes with something like the GE 350CX that Steve mentioned, connect its dry contacts to the Cat5, and connect that to a zone on your panel. Now, the panel knows when your smokes are tripped.

 

[tiger1234]

All right, just talked to the installer.

Even if I was to not get the smokes from him, he said he still cannot give me the installer code. The only person he can give the installer code to is another licensed monitoring company, he says.

However, he also said that the only reason I would need the installation code is to change the security settings e.g. which number is called if an alarm is tipped. According to him, I can still go in and change any settings e.g. garage door open, turn light on using 'User Access Software', which is $50.

Now, I am confused. I would really like to use this guy. However, I do want the flexibility of adding lighting, audio, video etc. later on. Do I need the installation code to do that? What do I really need the installation code for?

 

[ano]

O.K. wait wait wait. First, code requires 120V interconnected smokes with battery backup. GET THOSE. Second, and this has been discussed a bunch, the CORRECT way to do it is add SEPARATE smokes to your panel, and have that panel monitored so if these smokes go off, the fire department comes. The WRONG way to do it is to somehow wire your 120V smokes to your panel using a relay. DON'T DO IT. First, the relay is NOT designed for that, and it is against the rules to misuse a device like that. Second, if you dig in the rules, in MANY locals, 120V wired smokes MUST be ionization types whereby monitored smokes connected to a panel must be the photoelectric types. Therefore if you wire your 120V (photoelectric smokes) to a monitored panel you are violating code. This isn't true in all areas, but some.

Why this is is related to how smokes operate. Ionization types are quick to react, therefore for 120V smokes that is the best. Photoelectric smokes are slower to react, but they have fewer false alarms. Because a fire department is a limited resource, laws are in place to prevent false alarms. In any case, it really won't save you much money connecting them together, and your really better off NOT doing it. Yes, I know having two sets of smokes is redundant, but nothing says they have to be in the same locations, spread them out.

The Omni Pro II is set up with a variety of codes that protect it, and limit access. Its designed so that an installer can "protect" certain settings from a user. If an installer put in your system, and he is monitoring it, there is liability to him is an owner "tweaks" with important settings, and for some reason your alarm doesn't go off. You can't disagree with that.

But since you do own it, you should be able to get the installer code if you want, but in return don't expect the installer to still accept the liability if something goes wrong. That is only fair.

If you don't get the installer code, you can't change settings related to configuration such as zone types, and you can't do other "administrator" functions. HAI breaks these out in the Installer Guide. You CAN do "USER" functions spelled out in the Users Guide. You can do much of what you want to do, but you CAN'T add zones, change zones, change the dial-in number etc. And you can't do a system reset that restores everything to default settings, so you can't erase or reset the installer code without the installer code.

This is just like Windows. If you don't have the Admin Password, your limited. If you lose or don't know the installer code, I've heard only HAI can erase it to reset it, but installer might know other tricks.

So, not having the installer code is not the end-of-the-world if your the type who wants someone to oversee and monitor your system for you. If you want that responsibility, the installer should give you the code, or at least set it to your code. For monitoring, if the installer will no longer do it, NextAlarm or others can monitor it for you. So its really a control thing, but they do have reasons for not giving you the code as well.

 

[ano]

All right, just talked to the installer.

Even if I was to not get the smokes from him, he said he still cannot give me the installer code. The only person he can give the installer code to is another licensed monitoring company, he says.

However, he also said that the only reason I would need the installation code is to change the security settings e.g. which number is called if an alarm is tipped. According to him, I can still go in and change any settings e.g. garage door open, turn light on using 'User Access Software', which is $50.

Now, I am confused. I would really like to use this guy. However, I do want the flexibility of adding lighting, audio, video etc. later on. Do I need the installation code to do that? What do I really need the installation code for?

Again, YOU need to decide who is going to maintain your system going forward, you or him? Who will be installing these extra products, you or him? You can do much WITHOUT the code, but you can't do everything. If YOU are adding zones, audio, etc. you need the installer to change the code to what you tell him, but wait until you its working great before you do, because that will probably be the end of your relationship.

I recommend you go without the code for now, and see if that is a problem.

By the way, there are TWO versions of PC Access, the user version for $50, or the installer version for $200. He has the installer version. Like I say, the difference is that the installer version can get to installer items, like zone settings.

So like I say, its not TERRIBLE not to have the installer code. Just remember it WILL prevent you from changing some configuration items. See the Installer Guide, it tells you all about it.

 

[tiger1234]

Thanks for the detailed reply, Ano. I understand why the installer may not want to share the installer code. However, I will like to add lighting and audio myself later on so I guess I will have to have the installer code.

I found this interesting "If YOU are adding zones, audio, etc. you need the installer to change the code to what you tell him, but wait until you its working great before you do, because that will probably be the end of your relationship."

Does it mean he will have to change the code if I ask him to do so?

Jeez! I thought this would be the easiest part of the whole thing!!!