Need Some Driveway Sensor Advice

[upstatemike]

I am planning to rework my driveway sensors next month before the weather turns bad but I can't decide on the best strategy. I was originally planning to bury a vehicle probe next to the driveway but over the summer I noticed that most delivery guys leave the truck on the street and just walk up the driveway so I don't think a vehicle probe is really what I want.

My new idea is a 3 fold system:

1- A photobeam across the steps leading to the back porch door (I don't want to use a motion sensor because that porch is used a lot in the summer for just hanging out and would generate constant false alarms)

2- Another photobeam on the landing of the door from the garage to the mud room. This is where packages are usually left and I mainly want an alert if something is sitting there breaking the beam.

3- Some sort of general driveway alert - and this is where I'm stuck. I don't want a vehicle probe because I want to catch foot traffic. I don't want to have a lot of false alarms from sunlight or blowing branches so I am reluctant to trust a PIR. I cannot easily get wire across the driveway for a Photobeam (and the snow plow guy would probably run it over anyway). So what is my best technology to catch 100% of vehicle and foot traffic with zero false triggers from wind, snow, sunlight/shadows, etc? (Also the temperature range is -20 to +90 F)

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

Maybe an ultrasonic sensor?

http://www.cocoontech.com/index.php?act=Se...ghlite=maxbotix

 

[upstatemike]

Maybe an ultrasonic sensor?

http://www.cocoontech.com/index.php?act=Se...ghlite=maxbotix

Unfortunately ultrasonic and microwave sensors are sensitive to wind loading/vibration in outdoor applications.

 

[Photon]

Perhaps a couple sensors (PIRs, light beams, or any other technology) across the path leading to the house configured as Burglar Interior Followers. They would both have to violate within an appropriate time of your choosing before the system reports activity. Someone hanging out by one sensor won't do it, nor will a blowing object.

How 'bout a box with a prressure mat inside and a sign, "UPS - place packages here."

 

[upstatemike]

Perhaps a couple sensors (PIRs, light beams, or any other technology) across the path leading to the house configured as Burglar Interior Followers. They would both have to violate within an appropriate time of your choosing before the system reports activity. Someone hanging out by one sensor won't do it, nor will a blowing object.

How 'bout a box with a prressure mat inside and a sign, "UPS - place packages here."

I'm looking at Dakota Alert stuff right now. I can use your idea of requiring two different sensor triggers within a window to decide if I really have a visitor... probably using the Stargate for the logic rather than the Elk (So I can use nested logic rather than simple trigger/command logic). The dakota route would also let me easily add a wireless driveway probe down the road if I want. Only concern is I've seen some mixed reviews on Dakota Alert and quality control.

I like the pressure mat idea but it seems like a photobeam would do the same thing and be easier to install.

 

[beelzerob]

For the driveway, can it be viewed mostly from the house? What if you aimed an Axis camera at it and defined the motion area to be just the driveway? I THINK those have a discrete signal for motion...not sure about that. And i don't know if falling leaves would trigger the motion sense on it, but I'd think not.

 

[upstatemike]

For the driveway, can it be viewed mostly from the house? What if you aimed an Axis camera at it and defined the motion area to be just the driveway? I THINK those have a discrete signal for motion...not sure about that. And i don't know if falling leaves would trigger the motion sense on it, but I'd think not.

I think camera based motion would be too prone to false alarms from sun/shadow changes. Not to mention what happens when it gets covred with blowing snow!

 

[beelzerob]

Well, I was thinking if there was someplace from inside where it could be mounted to point at the driveway. In our house, we have a storage area above the garage with a window on the front, which looks perfectly down the driveway, so it's an optimal place for such a camera so that the weather can't get at it. Not many people have such an advantageous layout, though.

I've not owned a motion camera like the Axis, so I don't know how easy it is to fool. I thought you could put a sensitivity on it too.

 

[drozwood90]

For the driveway, can it be viewed mostly from the house? What if you aimed an Axis camera at it and defined the motion area to be just the driveway? I THINK those have a discrete signal for motion...not sure about that. And i don't know if falling leaves would trigger the motion sense on it, but I'd think not.

I think camera based motion would be too prone to false alarms from sun/shadow changes. Not to mention what happens when it gets covred with blowing snow!

Not so...it depends on how well you tune it. I was able to tune the camera that watched my front porch on my last house so that it did not trigger on anything except people and large dogs. Cats, squirrels, birds, etc. did not trigger it. Although, I DID have a spider trigger it once, it crawled across the lens. I fixed that by requiring the camera to trigger AS WELL AS an IR sensor. After that I got rid of ALL my false alarms.

And this is with a crappy X10 camera (B/W wired), using SupervisionCam software...and a cheapy $20 4 port video capture card from Tiger Direct (put hacked drivers on it to get all 4 ports at the same time).

So, I have some "gross" IR detection (one, maybe two sensors depending on the area watched), which wakes the camera / turns on lights if necessary. Then the PC does it's thing looking for motion. I have it capture the images and make 2x copies local (to an ethernet enabled hard drive...just in case my server gets stolen). I also have the images offloaded (in real time) to a Google Mail account (what else am I supposed to use the 7 gigs for??).

HTH

--Dan

 

[electron]

For the driveway, can it be viewed mostly from the house? What if you aimed an Axis camera at it and defined the motion area to be just the driveway? I THINK those have a discrete signal for motion...not sure about that. And i don't know if falling leaves would trigger the motion sense on it, but I'd think not.

I think camera based motion would be too prone to false alarms from sun/shadow changes. Not to mention what happens when it gets covred with blowing snow!

This is why I am separating the floodlights from the motion sensor, so I can use that motion sensor as my driveway sensor. It has a 70ft reach, and if you block the photocell, you can have it work 24/7. My floodlights also have a test switch, which resets the motion sensor after 5 seconds, so this might actually work.

 

[upstatemike]

This is why I am separating the floodlights from the motion sensor, so I can use that motion sensor as my driveway sensor. It has a 70ft reach, and if you block the photocell, you can have it work 24/7. My floodlights also have a test switch, which resets the motion sensor after 5 seconds, so this might actually work.

I have been running this way for years but am having trouble covering the area I want without sun/shadow issues. I have decided to uncover the photocell and let the light PIR sensors just handle the lights and only at night. With a wireless PIR on a post I can position it to catch both cars and delivery folks (during the day) while avoiding the sun/shade issues because I will have more placement flexibility. Plus the photobeams as backup should work well for daytime use which is my current concern. I have too many people sneaking up on me during the day!

 

[dBeau]

I am planning to rework my driveway sensors next month before the weather turns bad but I can't decide on the best strategy. I was originally planning to bury a vehicle probe next to the driveway but over the summer I noticed that most delivery guys leave the truck on the street and just walk up the driveway so I don't think a vehicle probe is really what I want.

My new idea is a 3 fold system:

1- A photobeam across the steps leading to the back porch door (I don't want to use a motion sensor because that porch is used a lot in the summer for just hanging out and would generate constant false alarms)

2- Another photobeam on the landing of the door from the garage to the mud room. This is where packages are usually left and I mainly want an alert if something is sitting there breaking the beam.

3- Some sort of general driveway alert - and this is where I'm stuck. I don't want a vehicle probe because I want to catch foot traffic. I don't want to have a lot of false alarms from sunlight or blowing branches so I am reluctant to trust a PIR. I cannot easily get wire across the driveway for a Photobeam (and the snow plow guy would probably run it over anyway). So what is my best technology to catch 100% of vehicle and foot traffic with zero false triggers from wind, snow, sunlight/shadows, etc? (Also the temperature range is -20 to +90 F)

It sounds like you are open to some crazy ideas or at least different ways of looking at the problem. Have you considered something as simple as your doorbell? I've noticed that the delivery guys always ring when leaving a package. In fact, nearly anyone who makes it into my driveway rings the doorbell.

This comes after a year of collecting data too. I know because I have a camera on the driveway with motion detection. If the doorbell rings, the Elk sends me an email and calls my cell. From there I can look at the camera live and usually them leaving. The times when the camera catches someone in the driveway it's always someone I dont immediately care about like lawn maintenance, a meter reader, or a neighbor's child learning to ride their bike.

So, you say you want to catch all of the traffic but do you really? I've found that knowing the doorbell rang is pretty good. Having the motion video from the camera (without an alert) for review confirms for me that I didnt miss anything.

 

[electron]

Let me know if you figure out a nice solution. I am in an area where we get lots of snow, so I can't even use the photobeam setup, and have been trying to figure this out for years.

 

[deranged]

I have 3 of these motion sensors on the outside of my house and never have a false trigger ( unless you count the deer and lost bear ).

http://www.crowelec.com/product_detail.asp?param=93

Any false alarms would be known, as an announcement is made through the house each time. Except at night, because of the deer.

StevenE

 

[upstatemike]

I have 3 of these motion sensors on the outside of my house and never have a false trigger ( unless you count the deer and lost bear ).

http://www.crowelec.com/product_detail.asp?param=93

Any false alarms would be known, as an announcement is made through the house each time. Except at night, because of the deer.

StevenE

Interesting device! I especially like the description:

It's Double Dual optic system simulates 3D stereo vision

!

I'll study up on this to see if it will work for me... Thanks for the Link!