Selling an Automated House

[ano]

I probably agree with most of that, but I will also say I believe that public perceptions might have changed a bit in the last 5 years.  The reason being, with the service providers wanting to sell services for home automation (Verizon, AT&T, cable companies) there have been a flood of TV ads about controlling your house with your smartphone.  If you get Consumer Reports magazine, this was the cover article this month, "Run your home from your phone."   But, possibly what could scare away people is the thought of having to pay a monthly charge for these services. That does bring up that what is said probably should include some comments about "homeowner owned. no monthly charges"  
 
Obviously the HAI panel will stay, possibly downgrading to a lower model.  Sensors will stay, but I could remove the wireless ones, and the wireless receiver. As for UPB, the thought of removing all the switches it a bit more trouble then I think it might be worth.  I'd also like to upgrade to Gen II for my new house.  Luckily no X-10. I'd definitely remove that.

 

[signal15]

I left the Elk, Vera, and Zwave equipment in mine.  A lot of the comments indicated that people were afraid of it, and "who is going to fix it when it breaks?"  My feeling is that in a home under $750k-$1m, it's definitely a liability.  In homes more than that, it's a feature.  I think this will change at some point, but right now, it's just one more thing for the buyer to be concerned about unless you happen to find a geeky buyer.
 
My suggestion would be to either take out the things that obviously make it look automated (voice alerts, touch screens, etc), or don't make that a selling point.  
 
It caused me some problems, especially with older buyers.

 

[ano]

O.K. I got lots of input on this. It seems the real estate agents really wanted me to keep everything in because they thought it adds home value, but I'm not really sure they fully understood what was involved. 
 
What I decided was to greatly simplify, and at the same time, take the expensive parts out of the system that no one would likely miss, but keep some parts in. 
 
The first switch, that I'm planning for this weekend, is to swap out an Omni Pro II for an Omni LTe.  Same size board, same pinout, but half the price, and certainly enough to drive some keypads and UPB lights and security system.
 
Next, I removed my Kwikset Zigbee locks. They are pretty pricely,and I'm not totally convinced the new owners will appreciate them.
 
Next, I removed 4 Zigbee OmniStat2s (controlling two systems) and I replaced them with a nice simple $50 Honeywell 2-stage non-programable thermostat.  This was a tough decision, but it mean I could recover $1000 in thermostats plus a Zigbee PIM (another $200) and I don't think people would miss it. 
 
Next to go is the wireless receiver. I have a combination of wired and wireless sensors. The wired came with the home and is certainly fine for basic security. The wireless added some sensors, wireless fire alarms, driveway sensor, etc. 
 
Then there was the UPB switches. I had about 60 Simply Automated Gen I switches. What I decided here was to leave most of the switched, and the UPB PIM on the panel. First, they are a pain to remove. Second, I'm planning from the start to use a UPB repeater, and these switches don't work with a repeater when they are on the "opposite" phase. Third, they look pretty cool. And finally, since UPB switches can talk to each other, this would allow me to have a four button controller in the kitchen to turn on/off all lights, and/or fans with one button press, which is pretty impressive.
 
I did remove some UPB switches where was only one and it wasn't often controlled. Like bathroom lights, closet lights, etc.  Overall, I removed about 10 switches.
 
Then I removed UPB control of my pool pump and pool cleaner. Installed two mechanical timer switches.
 
So I still can claim its an "automated house" and the panel can control many lights and ceiling fans, but I have the expensive stuff that adds less value.
 
A good compromise, I think.

 

[pvrfan]

...Next, I removed my Kwikset Zigbee locks. They are pretty pricely,and I'm not totally convinced the new owners will appreciate them.
...

 
Everything you did made sense to me except the bit above.  This lock has a smartphone app, no?  I think that stuff that can be controlled with a smartphone is a plus, these days.  I would guess that the vast majority of folks looking at  a house around $1M would be carrying a smartphone.  Probably more of a "Dad" feature than a "Mom" feature (to use brutal generalities)...but I would still think a feature rather than a dis-feature.
 
Craig

 

[ano]

Everything you did made sense to me except the bit above.  This lock has a smartphone app, no?  I think that stuff that can be controlled with a smartphone is a plus, these days.  I would guess that the vast majority of folks looking at  a house around $1M would be carrying a smartphone.  Probably more of a "Dad" feature than a "Mom" feature (to use brutal generalities)...but I would still think a feature rather than a dis-feature.
 
Craig

That is a great point, but here is the thing.  Automated locks in this case, are controlled by my HAI/Leviton OMNI Pro II, and certainly HAIku is a great smartphone app. to control an HAI panel, and I think Leviton makes one as well. That is simple, but someone needs to buy it, and pair it with the panel or lock, in the case of a Wi-Fi lock. O.K. I could give instructions, and a tech savvy person could do it, maybe. But wait, the panel needs Internet access, and it has to go through a router, and I have to have Internet access in the house. Etc. 
 
But when I sell the house, I don't supply routers, or cable modems or DSL modems, or Internet service.  So it gets more and more complex.  Its not like someone can just add a smartphone app. and be good to go. Its not like that. 
 
So for a tech savvy person, its sounds crazy to not include these things, but the reality is, they might go completely unused.  
 
So what I decided instead is, AFTER someone purchases the house, I will talk to them to see their feelings, and if they want to learn more and are interested, I will volunteer to help them get it all going. If they don't care about it, then that will be the end, but you CAN'T remove components from a house once it goes on sale. You have to do it before its offered for sale.

 

[ano]

So operation "Sell Home" is in place, and yesterday I replaced my Omni Pro II panel with an Omni LTe.  I've discovered that this panel only supports 16 wired zones which I think is a rip-off. (Leviton says it supports 32 zones, but it turns out, 16 have to be wireless, and I'm taking my wireless receiver.)
 
So the challenges are how to name zones and switches. My "library" may be the next person's child's play room.
I removed many of the UPB switches that you might never control remotely anyway, but about 30 are left.
How to I demonstrate this to the buyers?  That is tricky, but I think I will put some notes around the house like I see in model homes. For example, I might place a note above my touch panel that says: "Most lights and fans can be controlled at this panel, a computer or with an app. from your smartphone. To control a light from this panel, touch "Control" then select a light and touch "On" or "Off" Note that not all lights can be dimmed." I think this is simple, yet gives a good demo.
 
The final challenge is what automation program should I start them out with?  It has to be pretty minimal and non-intrusive. I was thinking of even leaving them an old laptop with PC Access running and connected, but would that be too over-the-top?  

 

[LarrylLix]

West Bedroom, East Bedroom, Master.
 
When people buy houses the advise is always, "get all your locks changed". The electronic locks would all be tossed as well as any smarts that you might retain a "backdoor" into.
 
This stuff scares buyers but after moving in they may install the same stuff. Even most alternative energy system need to be removed or so many tire kickers will show up to see the "freak show" but none wan't to own it.

 

[ano]

I would never leave $250 locks. They have been replaced with new locks that are easily rekeyed by the new owner using the included tool. Its probably not a good time to be a locksmith.

 

[GadgetBoy]

I recently sold my house. I removed everything - the only thing left was a few speakers that I had mounted in the walls (without the amplifiers attached) and the alarm system (which I advertised the house with). I also removed all surveillance cameras. Initially, I thought the cameras would be a nice feature, but my agent advised me against it, as it might result in the potential buyer asking, "what's wrong with the neighborhood that he needs all these cameras?". As far as the HA system, I currently use Homeseer and felt it would be too difficult to educate the buyer on the system and worried I may become "tech support" post the sale of the house.
 
I also staged my house. We rented a POD, packed as much stuff as we could into it and shipped it off to their storage facility. When we found the house we wanted to buy, we simply had the POD shipped to the new location - a nice way to jump start your packing. We then painted the rooms and rented some furniture. We had a three bedroom house that looked like a one bedroom (master bedroom, den and gym). We needed to have the place look like a 3 bedroom so we rented beds for the other two bedrooms. Headed over to the local TJ Maxx / Home Goods / Marshalls and picked up some new pictures and accessories. I'm fortunate that my brother-in-law is a professional stager, so we obviously had him to help us with ideas.
 
We priced the house right, listed it on a Wednesday, began showing it on Sunday (the open house), and accepted an offer that Saturday (there were 3 bidding). Didn't get asking price, but got at the top end of the range we were expecting.
 
BTW, the house was in the ~$500k range in a decent neighborhood. 
 
Be smart, hire a good agent, and be realistic about the worth of your house (if you want it to sell quickly).

 

[ano]

We actually did/are doing very similar. I really like your POD idea. We rented a staorage unit, so lots of stuff is there for when we stage. Probably with the two UHaul rentals, the POD whouldn't have cost more.  I also left speakers, that each have an ELK amp near them, but all the wires are now forever hidden in the walls. CQC is now gone, and my Omni Pro II has been downgraged to a Omni LTe.  That alowed me to leave all the consoles.  I left about 30 UPB switches. Not only is it a real pain to remove them all, but the technology (and LED colors) has changed over time.  Having these switches in place really makes a simple "automated home" as the HAI can control all the switches from an iPad/iPhone app. (HAIku) and a simple Simply Automated 4-button switch can run some lighting scenes which are easy to demonstrate. A simple note suggesting to press this for this for a demo is super easy to show.
 
Our realtor (and another we didn't go with) were very excited about the home automation aspect, and both said it was a big plus. (This house is in the $700K range.)  We been spending months painting, fixing, landscaping, you name it. It probably won't go on sale for a few weeks, but I'll keep everyone posted.

 

[ano]

So... my home sold in one day with multiple offers. Not bad for the somewhat sluggish Phoenix home market. Did automation help? It didn't hurt.
 
So have a Omni LTe and maybe 20 UPB switches installed. I wrote the new owner to tell them what they will need to "program" it. I'm not sure how anxious they are to learn more about it.  It definitely can just be used as an overpriced security system, if they so chose.

 

[LarrylLix]

After they have it ripped it out expect an offer to sell it back to you.
 
 
Edit: Geeezzz. Even the emoticons don't work on this forum.

 

[GadgetBoy]

They most likely wouldn't know the value and would throw it out.
 
I had a different view. My feeling was that it wasn't that tough to go around the house and replace the automated switches with original Levitons and quite frankly, did not want to have the equipment go to waste. I'd rather hand the stuff off to a friend and let them have fun with it.

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

Edit: Geeezzz. Even the emoticons don't work on this forum.

:mellow: :blink: h34r: :blush: :angry2: :excl: :hesaid: :icon_pai: :axe: ray: :nono: :rockon: :nutz: :rofl: :horse: :wacko: :wacko: :huh: ^_^
 
I see what you mean!

 

[LarrylLix]

Well here is the quote button at work. Maybe you can get some Administrator to fix this forum so it supports IE browsers using Java 7 and Java 8  like other forums using it have. Perhaps you have some connections in that respect.      :<