Dimmable Halogen Recessed lights?

felixrosbergen

Senior Member
Hi All,

My builder has proposed standard 110V incadecent light recessed ceiling cans. In the stardard scope he does not provide a dimmer, but thats fine since i plan to put in OnQ ALC dimmers anyway.

I am concerned about energy use, but it seems CFL's don't dimm so well. Is there such a thing as 110v dimmable halogen lights? Would they be more energy efficeint than a regular incandecent?
 
I have been using PAR30 halogens for like 15 years. I don't have a single 'typical' incandescent or CFL in any typical recessed fixture. Regular halogens dim just fine. All my switches are programmed to turn my lights on at 50% and I rarely turn them up from there. I don't know that they are any more efficient, but I think they put our a nicer, brighter light.
 
Hi,

Most Halogen lamps can be dimmed using standard dimmers but while standard halogen lamps are more efficient than traditional incandescent they have nowhere near the efficiency of CFL.

Systems for dimming fluorescent lamps have been available for many years but these are special purpose systems. Manufacturers are working on creating CFLs that work with standard dimmers but I think that there will always be limitations with this due to the way CFLs work.

Manufacturers are also releasing even more efficient halogen bulbs that have up to 30% better efficiency than traditional bulbs rather than the 6-10% that halogen has traditionally delivered.

I think that you need to consider your lighting needs in the various areas of your home and put the appropriate bulbs in place.

For example a kitchen would probably benefit from CFLs as the lights may be on for a long period of time and it probably isn't necessary to be able to dim the lights - perhaps some low wattage under cabinet lights could provide low level lighting when the main lights weren't required.

A formal dining room may need dimming for atmosphere but is used only for a few hours every month - in which case the actual energy use of halogen or conventional bulbs is probably negligible.

In my living room I have a halogen downlights which provide a lot of light (but use approximately 200W) for when we need it but most evenings we use two table lamps and a floor lamp with 6W CFLs - because the CFLs are low wattage we don't need to dim them anyway.

One thing to be careful of when choosing switches and is that many dimmers have a leakage current even when they are off. This current isn't enough to cause a incandescent or halogen bulb to light but may cause CFLs to flicker, so you should always use a relay rather than a dimmer if you have non-dimmable CFL bulbs.

Paul
 
For example a kitchen would probably benefit from CFLs as the lights may be on for a long period of time and it probably isn't necessary to be able to dim the lights - perhaps some low wattage under cabinet lights could provide low level lighting when the main lights weren't required.

A formal dining room may need dimming for atmosphere but is used only for a few hours every month - in which case the actual energy use of halogen or conventional bulbs is probably negligible.

In my living room I have a halogen downlights which provide a lot of light (but use approximately 200W) for when we need it but most evenings we use two table lamps and a floor lamp with 6W CFLs - because the CFLs are low wattage we don't need to dim them anyway.

Paul

My kitchen is fully open to the family room/living room area so i would like to have very good light in the kitchen to work but also it needs to be dimmable for better atmopshere when we're mostly in adjacent living/family room.

I'll probably go for the halogens there, i like the look of them (much smaller actual circle in the ceiling) and the like the light they give off. Since they are the kitchen will be on very often any energy savings over regular incandecents woudl be usefull.

Just to confirm, these type of recessed halogens would be 110V and can be directly connected to the dimmer?
 
My kitchen is fully open to the family room/living room area so i would like to have very good light in the kitchen to work but also it needs to be dimmable for better atmopshere when we're mostly in adjacent living/family room.

I'll probably go for the halogens there, i like the look of them (much smaller actual circle in the ceiling) and the like the light they give off. Since they are the kitchen will be on very often any energy savings over regular incandecents woudl be usefull.

Just to confirm, these type of recessed halogens would be 110V and can be directly connected to the dimmer?


My understanding is that there are also low-voltage halogens that have a transformer in each can. So you can connect these to regular 120v wall dimmers, as well. It is not clear to me why one would choose low-voltage cans as opposed to 120v. Bulb longevity? Character of the light?

-AC
 
Watch out if your going to mix in any PLC lighting controls with 12v halogens as the transformer may cause noise on the lines.

Just avoid the cheap 12v halogen balast crap at Home Depot/Lowes/Expo Center and you should be fine. I use Hatch electronic balasts on my 12v halogens with PCS SmartSwitch Dimmers and they work perfectly. No flicker. No hum. No power line noise.
 
Watch out if your going to mix in any PLC lighting controls with 12v halogens as the transformer may cause noise on the lines.

Just avoid the cheap 12v halogen balast crap at Home Depot/Lowes/Expo Center and you should be fine. I use Hatch electronic balasts on my 12v halogens with PCS SmartSwitch Dimmers and they work perfectly. No flicker. No hum. No power line noise.


So what is better / more energy efficeint / cost efficeint / most important DIMMABLE?

Low Voltage Recessed Halogen lamps with ballast?

Line Voltage Recessed Halogen lamps?
 
I would like the know the answer to that also but I have resolved myself to use line voltage Halogen units in my new house even if low voltage is considered to be the current best solution. I believe that LED's are the future of lights but they will not be ready for prime time for a few more years when their cost and performance make them a viable option for the masses. That means I want lighting fixtures that are ready for them when they hit the mainstream. To me, that means my recessed lights will be line voltage.

Like MavRic, I would be interested in any differing opinions on the pro/con of the low voltage vs line voltage approach.
 
I installed 5 of these http://www.creelighting.com/products.htm in my recent kitchen remodel and they are great. They cost about $90 a piece at the local electrical supply house. The color is awesome they actually looked better an brighter than my standard 65 watt Reveal R30 bulb.

The price is a little steep but I figured my break even point to be about 7-8 years. If you also look at the fact that I didn't buy a trim ring for each housing that takes the effective cost down another $15 per light to $75. Not for everyone, but I am definitely impressed with the outcome. They are better than any other traditional LED module I have seen or used as far as color. They are dimmable, although I haven't put them on a dimmer yet.
 
The real question is magnetic versus electronic transformers. The UPB stuff works great with magnetics and some electronics. Your situation w/o transformers, just the recessed lights, is a perfect use for the dimmable switch.
 
So dimmer the line voltage before it gets to the halogen transformers that are in the recessed can is ok?

ALC dimmer say they can do both magnetic and electronic...

Started look at simply putting halogen based bulk in basic recessed light can, but they whole reason i want halogen is so allow for a much smaller can and hole in the ceiling...


The real question is magnetic versus electronic transformers. The UPB stuff works great with magnetics and some electronics. Your situation w/o transformers, just the recessed lights, is a perfect use for the dimmable switch.
 
low vs high volt?

For our new construction, my wife is insisting that the low-voltage halogen lights look better than line voltage halogens. I am wondering if there really is any difference in the quality of light. . the color temperature should be basically the same for all voltages of halogen light (about 3000K). The lifespan of a low voltage lamp may be longer, but. . .

The lower up-front cost of the fixtures and the ease of dimming make line-voltage seem more attractive to me. I'd love to hear some experience with the quality of low voltage halogen light as compared to 120v halogen. MR16 bulbs now come in both.
 
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