False Alarm in Shock Detectors

Yevpator

New Member
Hi,

All Shock detectors manufacturers claim they have False alarm immunity. But what does it mean in that context ? I understand what is a false alarm when we're talking about a motion detector. It is when detector produces alarm despite nobody is really in the room. But Shock detector is a different story. Every vibration the shock detector feels is real. Of course we can set the level of sensitivity at the installation stage, and thus we can say that every impact that is weaker then the configured one is a false alarm. But the problem is that the "same" impact(force) may have different wave form, so IMHO it is not too correct to compare each impact with one that was set during the installation.
Any help would be highly appreciated,

Best Regards,
E.L.
 
Depends on the unit and application, but your statement sounds more like an editorial than a question or observation.

There are many "flavors" of shock detectors and how they all work is somewhat different than each other.
 
And there is a difference between someone hitting a protected box with a hammer vs. the loud engine that passes by, or the thumping subwoofer, or thunderstorm.
 
Depends on the unit and application, but your statement sounds more like an editorial than a question or observation.

There are many "flavors" of shock detectors and how they all work is somewhat different than each other.
Hi,

Thank you for you reply. Actually, I'm going to implement my own detector. I checked 4-5 existing detectors of different manufacturers. I installed them all on the same surface, set them to the same sensitivity(low,high) and knocked on different points of this surface. The result was quite strange. The reactions of the detectors were different. So the question is which is the detector that react in a correct way ? Or, as I had asked previously, where is a bound between alarm and false alarm ? I'm looking for any standard which perhaps define that, but meanwhile haven't found a such. Actually, there is a standard for shock detectors but it does not define what false shock alarm does mean.

Best Regards,
E.L.
 
Curious, what types of detectors/sensors did you test? Also, by 'shock' do you mean via 'vibration detection'?

Hi,
I tested Impaq Plus, Viper, Spider and yet a few less famous products.
Regarding the terminology, 'shock' vs 'vibration' - I consider them as the same thing. Am I wrong ?

Thanks,
E.L.
 
In this case, based on those models, it looks like you're working with products in the EU. Assuming you're not working with a graded system or anything else that has BS standards.

I know the Viper acts more as a low range GBD device, I am unsure about the rest, but there's a microprocessor involved. These aren't the run of the mill "tuning fork" or inertia based devices. These are not vibraton/seismic devices.
 
Could you provide links to the products?

Reason I ask is I recently designed a custom detection project involving various vibration sensors/detectors (How-To is in the works BTW). B)
Hi

You just need to google the mentioned detectors names and you will get the links...
 
Hi

You just need to google the mentioned detectors names and you will get the links...


OOOOOooooooooooook!
dry.gif
 
... if you need help still, pls turn to me privately and I will send you some data-sheets that I had collected.

Actually "I" don't need the help and instead was trying to help you out! ;)

Anyway, like I stated earlier, I experimented with a few vibration sensors including piezo speakers that detected vibration (it's resistance varied), mechanical units that have weighted sensors that would 'bounce' on a pointed contact closure, and 'circular' sensors that seemed to use a ball in the center that would 'sway' toward the case edge to produce a contact closure.

All of these different sensors seemed to behave differently to a variety of testing 'stimuli' i.e. sharp taps, metal on metal (vs say a finger tap). I also noticed that surfaces and bonding of the sensors played a big part on sensitivity. The mechanical ones with the weights seemed to also behave differently depending on the orientation they were mounted in as well.

All except that last one I mentioned have some sort of sensitivity adjustment, but I believe what you seek is more of a 'signature' analysis of the actual vibration waveform to help detect false alarms.

I could not find anything that offered such an analysis. Depending on the accuracy of the actual vibration detection scenario you seek you would most likely in my opinion have better success with the piezo speaker method with excellent bonding to the surface being monitored. The only problem is having to analyze the 'signature' of the produced waveform real time within a reasonable cost..

There is a lot of information on various circuitry using the piezo speaker in this application that I found on various websites. The one I had success with is shown in THIS gallery. This project was created to detect the vibration of a DEXCOM diabetes remote monitor. Basically this unit constantly monitors the blood sugar level real time from a sensor a diabetic would wear on their arm. The unit will vibrate on a first preliminary warning, then beep and vibrate again on a 'level 2' warning.

I find it amazing that this is the only type of warning the remote will make, and a diabetic can easily sleep through them. This unit will detect this vibration and produce a contact closure (which was then rigged up to the Elk of the client so lights can turn on and whole house announcements accompanied with the warning).

The device can be set to such a low sensitivity that I can keep my finger pressed on the center of the mount and it will keep going off as it's detecting the blood pulse!

Unfortunately no signature detection is used as it's just a voltage comparator that is triggered when the voltage goes above a set threshold (i.e. the variable resistor sensitivity setting).

As you can see in those other pics I tried a mechanical vibration detection as well. The only problem was I could not get the sensitivity low enough to reliably detect the Dexcom unit's vibrations (as they only last for a second).

I don't have any pics of the circular detector I experimented with, but HERE is a link to it.

Anyway it was an interesting project and I learned a lot about vibration detection.

I did find some sensors that would be used to detect vibration changes from say, machinery, but those were VERY expensive! The reason these types may interest you is because they are used to detect vibration pattern changes in the machinery monitored (first clue something is going wrong with the machine).

Good luck with your vibration detection project! If you get any cool results, feel free to post them here as well! B)
 
I use a piezo electric vibration sensor in the mounted on the back part of my mailbox hard wired to the HAI OPII panel. The "mail box" is a metal structure inside of my brick mailback. The vibration sensor is mounted on the outside wall of the mail box. It is adjusted such that the slot or door opening triggers it. Last night we had some major thunderstorms and the thunder did trigger the device a couple of times. Typically though I do not get any false alarms with any vehicles driving by. But we are in a court of 5 homes and traffic would be driving kind of slow.

I also utilize ultrasensitive geophones to measure measure volume of traffic at an expressway nearby. Works and its very sensitive. I can set one on my basement cement floor and actually see footsteps. I do note that even adjusting the Piezo device to be sensitive; the Geophone appears to be more like "ultrasensitive".
 
Actually "I" don't need the help and instead was trying to help you out! ;)

Anyway, like I stated earlier, I experimented with a few vibration sensors including piezo speakers that detected vibration (it's resistance varied), mechanical units that have weighted sensors that would 'bounce' on a pointed contact closure, and 'circular' sensors that seemed to use a ball in the center that would 'sway' toward the case edge to produce a contact closure.

All of these different sensors seemed to behave differently to a variety of testing 'stimuli' i.e. sharp taps, metal on metal (vs say a finger tap). I also noticed that surfaces and bonding of the sensors played a big part on sensitivity. The mechanical ones with the weights seemed to also behave differently depending on the orientation they were mounted in as well.

All except that last one I mentioned have some sort of sensitivity adjustment, but I believe what you seek is more of a 'signature' analysis of the actual vibration waveform to help detect false alarms.

I could not find anything that offered such an analysis. Depending on the accuracy of the actual vibration detection scenario you seek you would most likely in my opinion have better success with the piezo speaker method with excellent bonding to the surface being monitored. The only problem is having to analyze the 'signature' of the produced waveform real time within a reasonable cost..

There is a lot of information on various circuitry using the piezo speaker in this application that I found on various websites. The one I had success with is shown in THIS gallery. This project was created to detect the vibration of a DEXCOM diabetes remote monitor. Basically this unit constantly monitors the blood sugar level real time from a sensor a diabetic would wear on their arm. The unit will vibrate on a first preliminary warning, then beep and vibrate again on a 'level 2' warning.

I find it amazing that this is the only type of warning the remote will make, and a diabetic can easily sleep through them. This unit will detect this vibration and produce a contact closure (which was then rigged up to the Elk of the client so lights can turn on and whole house announcements accompanied with the warning).

The device can be set to such a low sensitivity that I can keep my finger pressed on the center of the mount and it will keep going off as it's detecting the blood pulse!

Unfortunately no signature detection is used as it's just a voltage comparator that is triggered when the voltage goes above a set threshold (i.e. the variable resistor sensitivity setting).

As you can see in those other pics I tried a mechanical vibration detection as well. The only problem was I could not get the sensitivity low enough to reliably detect the Dexcom unit's vibrations (as they only last for a second).

I don't have any pics of the circular detector I experimented with, but HERE is a link to it.

Anyway it was an interesting project and I learned a lot about vibration detection.

I did find some sensors that would be used to detect vibration changes from say, machinery, but those were VERY expensive! The reason these types may interest you is because they are used to detect vibration pattern changes in the machinery monitored (first clue something is going wrong with the machine).

Good luck with your vibration detection project! If you get any cool results, feel free to post them here as well! B)
Sir Robin, Thanks a lot and sorry again. Actually I also got very good results with my own unit installed on either wooden doors or window frames. I would even say that the results of my own were 'better' than my mentioned references. The only confusing thing was how to decide which detector was right, the one which bypassed a vibration or the one which alerted on it. Today or tomorrow I'm going to try it on a concrete wall. I expect there for worse results. Another alternative I'm considering now is using accelerometer instead of Piezo-electric transducer. This alternative is relatively expensive solution and since I got quite good results with a cheaper one, piezo, I don't see any advantage to prefer it. Perhaps, I will see a difference on the concrete wall. On the market the most of the shock detectors are piezo based, I found only one utilizes accelerometer, Jablatron:
http://www.jablotron.com/en/Catalog/house+alarms/oasis+868mhz/wireless+detectors/the+ja82sh+wireless+shock+and+tilt+detector/
I think it is due to another application that is built-in in the product, tilt detection.
Regarding the other solutions mentioned by you, should be taken in consideration that the product we're going to design is battery operated unit, so current consumption is a big issue...
 
Back
Top