HDTV question...

Ok, I am getting much closer finally. I tried the resolution you mentioned in the last post, I still get the horrible flicker. Going through all the settings, I can get one to come up CRYSTAL clear! It's a standard 800x600 resolution, with 45Hz refresh. Of course this makes the screen really large, and even the display properties will not fit entirely on the screen, due to the fact it is creating a "virtual desktop". Meaning the desktop scrolls around to where the mouse is. To get to a title bar, I have to move the mouse to the top of the screen and keep going, the same to the bottom of the screen to see the task bar.

I would be happy just keeping it in this resolution as it is VERY clear! I just hate the scrolling desktop.

Have you encountered this before?


Below is a pic I took of the screen zoomed way in (what is seen is about 1/5th of the full screen) with the camera. Though camera's do not take photo's of TV screens well, you can see that it is clear when zoomed in. So you can just immagine how clear it looks from normal viewing distance, viewing the entire screen. In the screen cap, you can see that the TV does indeed support the 1080i resolution.
 

Attachments

  • HDScreen.jpg
    HDScreen.jpg
    75.3 KB · Views: 48
Update:

Since this morning I have tried a few of the High Definition video's on MS's site, as well as watching Terminator 2 in HD this afternoon. WoW! I am amazed at the clarity! As many people, I have a HD TV, but never got to see it function in HD till now.

Even if you do not have a HD television, you can still check out the HD video's at Microsofts site. The look simply amazing on a computer monitor as well! You can check them out HERE.

Now if I could just get the entire desktop on the screen, and not have to scroll around it I will be set!
 
Good to hear you got it working despite my misguidance. I think getting the htpc to display on a HDTV is one of the biggest hassles of the whole HTPC task but once you figure out the correct settings you're set.
 
you really have to run 1080i when you have such a nice TV, 800x600 is a sin :) Have you tried the latest drivers? Are there MCE drivers for your card? Maybe it is time to give powerstrip a try, it lets you tweak every aspect of your video signal.
 
I assume your HDTV is widescreen and I think 800x600 is a 4:3 resolution, so if the aspect ratio is looking correct, this should explain having to scroll up or down to see either the top or bottom of your desktop. 800x450 (if you have it) should give you a better result.

However, as electron says, it would be sad to keep such a great TV at such a low res. I think 1280x720p@60hz (or similar) should be reachable with a few tweaks, and as I assume this is the native res of your TV, should look great. The flicker could possibly be reduced by reducing the refresh rate (50 or 30Hz).


It is possible that the reason it isn't working well at high-res is to do with either your DVI cable type or your DVI-in connector type.

As I mentioned a while ago on another thread there are 4 types of DVI connector, DVI-D, DVI-I, DVI-A and DVI-M. I'm pretty sure that the connector on your Radeon is a DVI-I (both digital and analog compatible) and if your HDTV doesn't have VGA-in I'd be ready to bet it is of the same type (or a DVI-M which is the same but smaller).

This can cause confusion as all DVI cables types can connect to these:
If you are running a DVI-D to DVI-D cable then this is not the problem.
If you are running a DVI-A to DVI-A, or a DVI-I to DVI-A cable then this is your problem, since you will only be getting the analog signal to the TV.
If you are running a DVI-I to DVI-I things become a little more complicated, as it is possible that only the analog signal is going through (PC settings) or that only the analog signal is being displayed (TV settings).

Finally it is possible that your TV does not support HDCP (unlikely to cause a problem in this case tho) or that it will only receive high-def DVI signals that are HDCP encoded.


If you are not sure which DVI cable type you are using, then take a picture of both ends and post it. It would also be helpful if you could post the brand and model of your HDTV so that I can check the spec for limitations.

I hope some of this helps :) .
 
Guys thanks for all your help, this stuff is really over my head. I thought a DVD cable was a DVI cable, period.

The FULL model# of the tv, from the back is: 60PW936317F.


I did find a website with some Specs on the TV HERE.
It mentions on that page: "high-definition projection TV with DVI direct digital input;"

On another note, I was pleased to read the 2 reviews at the bottom of that page :)

I also found this in the users manual (PDF Sheet):
HD INPUT-AV 5—use to connect digital
equipment with DVI (digital video
interface) 1080i or 480p output. DVI is
a specific digital input allowing
encrypted transmission of uncompressed
HD content. DVI includes
HDCP (high-bandwidth digital content
protection), which is supported by the
motion picture industry, satellite
providers, and most of the consumer
electronics industry. DVI is gaining
momentum and quickly becoming an
industry standard for the consumer to
view high-definition material while
keeping content protected.

Digital video interface (DVI) with
1080i (1080 lines, interlaced) or
480p (480 lines, progressive scan)

The Graphics card is a Radeon 9200se with the latest (As of 3 days ago) "Catalyst" drivers.

Here is a picture I just took of the DVI cable. It is the same on both ends:
 

Attachments

  • DVD_Pci.jpg
    DVD_Pci.jpg
    39.1 KB · Views: 20
That's a dual link DVI-D cable (best type IMO), so forget about all I wrote on cables. Doesn't seem like a HDCP prob either.

I gotta go out now (6:45pm in the UK) and won't be back till late, but I'll check the specs tomorrow and get back to you.
 
Techtooth, thanks! I really appreceiate the help! Ihave been building, programming and ugrading computers for almost 15 years, but know nothhing about this stuff, other than what I have picked up in the past week or so.

Micah: No misguidance whatsoever, thanks for the tips and suggestions. THe one about a black desktop was one I though of JUST before I read your suggestion, so anything is helpful!

Now I have 2 projects open, my 7" touchscreen just arrived for my CarPC project!
 
I may have found something, I got this from www.tweakguides.com:

Under your graphic card properties, go to "Options" then;

Disable quick resolution feature: If you have the ATI Taskbar Application enabled, the 'quick resolution feature' provides a menu (when you left-click on the small ATI icon in your system tray) which provides options for changing the color quality (16 and 32 Bits Per Pixel) and your desktop resolution. Once again, this is a relatively useless function, since not many people constantly change their desktop resolution and color quality. Tick this box to disable this feature and free up some system resources, and should you need to, change your color quality and resolution in the ATI Control Panel as usual.

Reduce DVI frequency on high-resolution displays: This option changes the frequency on displays which have a DVI (Digital Visual Interface) input, typically LCD or TFT flat panel monitors. If you are experiencing graphical anomalies or problems on such displays when running at high resolutions (i.e. 1024x768 or above), tick this option. For everyone who is using a standard computer CRT (Cathode Ray Tube) monitor make sure this option is unticked.

Alternative DVI operational mode: If you use a DVI display (as described above), and experience graphical anomalies or problems (at any resolution), tick this option. For everyone else, make sure this option is unticked.

Here is a link to the full guide. I realize that you will already know 90-95% of the stuff they say here, but you may find a few useful "tweaks" particularly to do with refresh rate on page 4 as well as what I have quoted from page 6.
It does also give a detailed breakdown of every option available under both the ATI control panel and the ATI catalyst control center.


Having checked as much as I could find on your TV, I'm pretty sure your problem still lies somewhere in your PC settings.
However, I couldn't find what your screen's native resolution is and I found no mention of it supporting 720p, only 1080i. There was something that bugs me about "choosing" between interlaced and progressive, is there an easy setting on your TV about that? It could be that the TV is trying to display progressive at above 480 lines and just can't do it. I'll have another look into this if the above didn't help.

Good luck and keep us informed!
 
Well, This is really frustrating! I have tried just about every configuration known to man, and still no luck.

I set the resolution on the PC to 1920x1080. The TV see this when I make the change, as the screen goes blank, then flickers a bit and then displays the screen, and a Onscreen Display states "1080i". So the TV does "know" the resolution comming in.

Yet, when in this resolution, the colors are quite dark, and the screen flickers quite badly. Using this resolution, I then went into the catalyst (ATI's version of PowerStrip) advanced settings. From there I clicked the "Force" button which gives a context menu for resolutions and refresh rates. I went through every single refresh rate from 30 up 100 and every single one in between. No luck. When in 800x600 the screen is VERY clear, and the refresh rate needs to be set to 43 for it to work correctly. Only drawback is that scrolling "virtual" desktop.

Being this did not work, I uninstalled the Catylist software, and installed the latest version of Powerstrip. I went through the same motions with it, trying different resolutions and refresh rates.... nothing....

I honestly do not know where else to go from here. I am beginning to think that the TV just can not handle the 1080i digital input. I know it is supposed to, but supposed to and actually doing so are 2 different things.

Here is a section from my TV's PDF manual:

HD INPUT-AV 5—use to connect digital
equipment with DVI (digital video
interface) 1080i or 480p output. DVI is
a specific digital input allowing
encrypted transmission of uncompressed
HD content. DVI includes
HDCP (high-bandwidth digital content
protection), which is supported by the
motion picture industry, satellite
providers, and most of the consumer
electronics industry.

Would I run into these same issues if I were to get a DVI or VGA to component converter? I am reluctant to get one, as there is the definate possibility that this will not work either. Here is the inputs on the back of the TV:
 

Attachments

  • tv.gif
    tv.gif
    24 KB · Views: 30
Do you have any monitors that have DVI inputs? It might be a good idea to check if the problem is the output.

I'm going to try to find the TV manual online and see if I can find more info on the "choosing" between progressive and interlaced.
 
If the TV supports 1080i, then it has to work, unless his video card just isn't powerful enough to drive those kind of resolutions (which is what I am starting to believe). Might want to search google and see if anyone else has a 9200 running with those resolutions. Last time I checked, the Media Center drivers for ATI cards only supported a limited number of newer cards, the 9600 was the bottom line at the time, so maybe it is the card.
 
From the ATI 9200 specs:
*16:9 aspect ratio monitors are supported on 1920x1080 and 848x480 on Microsoft® Windows® XP, Microsoft® Windows® 2000 and Microsoft® Windows® Me. The complete list of resolutions depends on the driver version and operating system. NOTE: resolutions are limited by the performance of the attached monitor. DVI-I monitors will be limited to 1600x1200.
The board goes to resolutions higher than 1600x1200, but they aren't supported through DVI.

I know this is why I needed to buy a new video card when I got my 1600x1200 LCD. I wanted to run DVI and my older ATI card wouldn't even support that through DVI. It would support it through the analog VGA connection.
 
So that confirms what I was thinking. He either needs to get a VGA->DVI cable, or a new card.
 
Back
Top