POE Surveillance cameras - CAT cables under vinyl siding?

[ecborgoyn]

I'm about to deploy a bunch of POE surveillance cameras around the house exterior.
 
What do folks think about running CAT5 cables under vinyl siding and/or along the siding edge channels?  I DID once run the grounding conductor for an OTA TV antenna along one of the siding 'J' channels, so I guess I've already started the practice..  But not yet for signal cables.  Running below/beside the siding would make a few of the camera placements a LOT easier to cable.
 
I'm thinking about using direct burial CAT cable for these runs.  Or maybe plenum grade cable.  I'm hoping that nowhere the cable is exposed to direct sunlight (i.e. UV), but I can't depend on it.
 
Should I install surge-protection for these type of runs?
 
Thoughts?  Any other camera cabling tricks-of-the-trade?

 

[wkearney99]

Conduit is also good for keeping someone else from wrecking the wires at some point in the future.  
 
I can only imagine the adventures caused by a contractor replacing the siding some time in the future...  
 
Tricks of the trade generally encompass GOOD ideas, not hacks to get around legitimate work and expense.  
 
Call me jaded but I really try to abide by the premise of 'least surprise' when it comes to installing things in my home.  Especially those out of sight.

 

[drvnbysound]

Where I've done soffit mounted dome cameras and no cable is exposed at all (where the cables are completely in the attic and/or above the soffit) I've run indoor cable. If the cabling comes out past the exterior wall at all, even if it's inside/behind the siding I've done direct burial cable.

 

[ecborgoyn]

Bill,
  I DID think about the issues of replacing the siding someday..  Need to weigh the effort of running conduit vs. re-running wires later.  I also like doing things 'the right way' and avoiding future re-work.  But as I get older the probability of the re-work is going down and the labor (and cost) savings now is starting to dominate.  A few of the camera locations would be tough (and ugly) to address with conduit.
 
Thanks.

 

[Del91574]

Given the choice, it's in the realm of "it is what it is". UV/sunlight resistant cable and outdoor rated should be a given. The most difficult is going to be where to put any slack or service loop cable.
 
It's not necessarily a "hack" way, but given the choice of pulling pieces of siding back and/or hiding access holes and fishing between points and running conduit everywhere outside, there's a choice that most HO's would go with. Conduit work isn't cheap, nor is making it look halfway decent (or spaghetti using PVC and it moving around with the weather).
 
You could also fish in the cable between A & B behind the siding and get around certain areas. Same with opening up a small section of stud bay and fish in around top/bottom plates just like HV cables, then put the sheathing back. It's one of the short list of choices when a completely finished house is presented to the end installer. Either that, or installing switches and cascading the copper between them to get between points to limit the amount of copper back to the head end.

 

[ecborgoyn]

Thanks for the comments.  I'd only be running cable behind/within the siding for a couple of cameras.  I thought about running plenum cable through cold-are returns 'bays' for one or two locations, but that would violate code.  The runs behind the siding are a bit more benign.  I'm attempting to get the cameras at a reasonable height in order to (hopefully) get face-shots.  Putting cameras under the eves of a two-story house is easier, but not as useful.
 
On a related topic, I'm still thinking about something for the front door.  Commercial 'Door Station' devices are a bit expensive (Mobotix, etc).  There's the 'new age' devices like the 'Ring Doorbell' wifi camera devices.  But these don't integrate well with other cameras.  I'd like a low-cost POE device for the door.  Such a device is an 'overt' surveillance camera.  I'm also looking at more 'covert' camera options for the front porch and door.

 

[westom]

 I DID once run the grounding conductor for an OTA TV antenna along one of the siding 'J' channels, so I guess I've already started the practice..  But not yet for signal cables.  

 
Protection is always about how a surge current gets to earth.  That OTA antenna ground must be routed to have no sharp bends.  That (rather than behind vinyl) is more critical. 
 
Same applies to protecting outside camera cables.  How would a surge get to earth?  If it striking those wires?  Then better is a properly earth grounded  lightning rod so that it need not find earth destructively via those cables (and house). 
 
Critical is how lightning gets to earth.  Most important is connections to earth that have no splices, no sharp bends, is not inside metallic conduit and other features that would otherwise increase impedance  (not resistance - impedance).
 
Soffit mounted camera is best for many reasons - including wire protection from many environmental threats.

 

[pete_c]

Unrelated to pulling cable under eaves; just a note here about my CCTV DIY'd stuff. 
 
You can maybe DIY a front doorbell single board HD/fisheye POE camera with SIP on the board if you wanted to purchasing a blank combo cover plate with a doorbell ringer on it.  These boards are available these days for less than $100 in 3-5MP formats.  The size of the camera motherboard is around 30cm in diameter.  Only thing is not to fat finger it.  Really though it is not difficult.
 
Here I DIY'd a couple of these IP camera boards with Speco IP67 metal Domes. New ones are now even smaller.  Battery RTC, SD/USB memory, et al.  Very tiny stuff and I use large magnifying glass lamp to work on them.  It's been a few years now and they are working fine outside today. 
 
Today hodgepodge cameras revolve around Axis, Optex (combos) and Grandstream (boards and cams).  Mixing old and new I can see all of my cameras with my Omnitouch screens and my Wintel embedded consoles.  I make due with a Grandstream encoder/decoder, Leviton HAI CCTV/Touchscreen hub and Zone Minder (even though I play with other NVRs). 
 
Zone Minder is old now (I have run it over 10 years). 
 
The LED ring doorbell (hardwired to the OmniPro 2) triggers both stills and videos today wherever or whenever you want.
 
Nothing in the cloud, (unless you want it to be).
 
New in recent months is a smart phone / tablet console application called zmNinja which works fine in Android, iOS and Windows 10. 

 

[ecborgoyn]

Pete,
  Thanks for the DIY 'encouragement'.  Sounds like a great project and I'll need to research camera boards.  Our front door is protected on a porch so the device is not exposed to direct weather.  Just mainly temp extremes.
 
  Still investigating....   I place the Door Station camera low on my priority list.  But my wife places it very high.  This could drive me to a COTS solution.

 

[pete_c]

Much easier with a front door that is protected on the porch.  Here the sun beats on the door in the afternoon and the door is behind a glass storm door which makes it hot enough to fry an egg in the late afternoons.
 
Here after doing one camera on brick (side) and exposed to the weather/sun, running cabling from main level, garage attic, second floor attic and down the chute (raceway) to the basement and over the the central closet area.  Dunno if I would mount or have the energy for mounting a doorbell box / camera on the brick next to the door.  (2-days maybe at an even pace - PITA though).
 
It was the brick thing mostly.  None the less the new stuff just uses the doorbell wires and wireless; much easier as most folks have two wires going to their doorbell these days. (COTS - commercial off the shelf - can get a wee bit expensive sometimes)
 
Relating to the camera boards; they are very small and compact to the point of needing a jewelers set of tools, large magnifying glass lamp.  Everything is there relating to connectivity (LAN wired, wireless, SIP, SD storage, RTC with battery and now your choice of lenses).
 
Noticed too there is plastic and plastic and metal and metal.  IE: I have over the years watched plastic or metal deteriorate in just a couple of years while some plastic hold tough way after 10 years.  (in FL by the ocean - within 1-2 years and watched it crumble in my hands).

 

[tmbrown97]

I personally like ToughCable for these types of runs... Depending on which one, you've got at the minimum the drain for any transient voltage and shielding (if you terminate it properly)... you can go with the full braid shielding (same as you see on coax) for more strength and protection.  It's UV rated, can be buried, etc. 
 
I'm looking for that same door camera right now for a friend... just starting to look... I'll post back if I find something good.