Running wire outside the house

[kd5crs]

Hello everyone,

I have been working on automating my window blinds with a basic design I found on the Instructables website. Each blind control unit is a self contained, infrared controlled, 4 AA battery powered little box that is mounted to the blinds. That way, I wouldn't have to run any wires inside my house (which is woefully underwired, hadn't those builders heard of home automation in 1978?!?) Sure would be going through lots of AA batteries, though, and I'd need an IR emitter run to each room.

Then I had one of those blinding inspirations that is so obvious it makes your ears ring:

All my windows are on the outside walls of my house.

Obvious, right? I mean, by definition! So I've decided to rethink the plan. I need two relays to control each blind (one for go/stop, one for direction) and 5-6 volts DC to run the motor. So, my idea is to run the wires outside the house, tucked up neatly under the siding, to a central location that has a 8-relay computer or INSTEON (haven't decided yet) relay controller and a AC to 12V wall wart. I would need to run 16/2 for power to each of 4 windows, and 18/4 (or better) to each window for the relays. Then I'd punch in through the wall at the window for the interface, much like the cable installers do.

Has anyone gone this route for running wires? Any suggestions, critiques, warnings? Anyone try it and it worked out great, or tried it and it was horrible? Suggestions on wire to use?

Thanks.
Brian

 

[Rupp]

If all you need is a wireless IR solution then I would recommend the Powermids wireless IR devices. I use 5 of these for my blind automation.

 

[drozwood90]

Brian,

I was working on something like that before I had to move.

I can share some stuff with you offline if you wish (I think it would take too long to go over everything in a forum).

I think between you and I, you can have a GREAT product, and I can finally get the rest of my blinds automated!! Afterwards, I think it might be good to do up a little tutorial...like the other one I still need to do (how to convert an UPB appliance module into a dry contact).

PM me if you want to chat...I can give you a contact number to hit me up on.

--Dan

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

If all you need is a wireless IR solution then I would recommend the Powermids wireless IR devices. I use 5 of these for my blind automation.

He is wanting this for power also I'm assuming.

I would make sure you know what you are 'punching' through. Also, I know here in Las Vegas, UV protection is a must with anything made of rubber, so if sun exposure is going to be intensive, get UV rated jacket or at a minimum, paint the cable.

I'm not sure you need that heavy of a gauge cable. Also, what are the voltage requirements? You mention 5-6 volts, but also say you need a 12 volt wall wart (unless I misread your post).

 

[kd5crs]

Rupp: Good idea, but that doesn't solve my power problem.

BSR: Good point about the UV. Looks like I can get 1000' rolls of UV protected Cat 5e for $99. I can use 1 pair for power, 1 for the motor relay, and 1 for the relay... relay. The reason I was going to inject 12V is because of the voltage loss though 24 AWG wiring. My longest run is almost 100', so 12V will only be 8V when it reaches the window. The voltage is then limited to 5V on the motor control board. If I inject 6V it will only be 4V when it reached the window, and that's too low.

Dan: Well, my setup isn't that complicated! :+D RS232 from the computer to the relay controller. 2 relays per window: one is on/off for the motor, the other to control a DPDT relay inside the top of the window blind that reverses the motor. So, relay 1 on, blind closes, relay 1 and 2 on blind opens, relay 1 and 2 off blind stops. The third pair carries 12V, limted to 5V on the board at the window.

Mechanically, I opened the top of one of my blinds and found that it is a 5.5mm heaxagonal rod doing the rotation. Coincidentally, the GM2 motor from Solarbotics is a good fit into the 1/4 drive portion of a socket with a bit of sanding. So it goes motor -> 5.5mm socket -> blind rod. I had to remove the "open the blinds by hand" arrangement, but that just slid off.

Experimentation will tell if I can get reliable operation from just using a timer, or if I need a sensor to tell when the blinds are fully open/closed. That's a good use of the 4th twisted pair, or that's why God created the DS10A. I'll use a Big Red Button for local control at each window, but mainly they will be computer controlled.

My wife asked about power outages, which I hadn't considered... but the blinds pull string can still open the windows in that case.

That's the plan, anyway! I've tried it out on the test bed and it works great.

Thanks,
Brian

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

The reason I was going to inject 12V is because of the voltage loss though 24 AWG wiring. My longest run is almost 100', so 12V will only be 8V when it reaches the window. The voltage is then limited to 5V on the motor control board. If I inject 6V it will only be 4V when it reached the window, and that's too low.

I'm just not getting a good feeling about this. Do you know the actual current draw?

 

[sic0048]

Rupp: Good idea, but that doesn't solve my power problem.

BSR: Good point about the UV. Looks like I can get 1000' rolls of UV protected Cat 5e for $99. I can use 1 pair for power, 1 for the motor relay, and 1 for the relay... relay. The reason I was going to inject 12V is because of the voltage loss though 24 AWG wiring. My longest run is almost 100', so 12V will only be 8V when it reaches the window. The voltage is then limited to 5V on the motor control board. If I inject 6V it will only be 4V when it reached the window, and that's too low.

Dan: Well, my setup isn't that complicated! :+D RS232 from the computer to the relay controller. 2 relays per window: one is on/off for the motor, the other to control a DPDT relay inside the top of the window blind that reverses the motor. So, relay 1 on, blind closes, relay 1 and 2 on blind opens, relay 1 and 2 off blind stops. The third pair carries 12V, limted to 5V on the board at the window.

Mechanically, I opened the top of one of my blinds and found that it is a 5.5mm heaxagonal rod doing the rotation. Coincidentally, the GM2 motor from Solarbotics is a good fit into the 1/4 drive portion of a socket with a bit of sanding. So it goes motor -> 5.5mm socket -> blind rod. I had to remove the "open the blinds by hand" arrangement, but that just slid off.

Experimentation will tell if I can get reliable operation from just using a timer, or if I need a sensor to tell when the blinds are fully open/closed. That's a good use of the 4th twisted pair, or that's why God created the DS10A. I'll use a Big Red Button for local control at each window, but mainly they will be computer controlled.

My wife asked about power outages, which I hadn't considered... but the blinds pull string can still open the windows in that case.

That's the plan, anyway! I've tried it out on the test bed and it works great.

Thanks,
Brian

Do you have a link to the Instructables directions you used to modify your blinds? Or if you have heavily modified them to work in your scenerio, perhaps this could be a good "How-to" candidate. I'd love to see more examples of what this looks like and how it works.

 

[mustangcoupe]

Experimentation will tell if I can get reliable operation from just using a timer, or if I need a sensor to tell when the blinds are fully open/closed. That's a good use of the 4th twisted pair, or that's why God created the DS10A. I'll use a Big Red Button for local control at each window, but mainly they will be computer controlled.

My wife asked about power outages, which I hadn't considered... but the blinds pull string can still open the windows in that case.

one thing to consider is if the blind is not 100% open/closed for one reason or another .... how would you time for this? not knowing the exact position and I bet the motor speed is slightly different with a reduced/raised voltage.

 

[kd5crs]

Current draw: 97 mA running, 563 mA stall. I don't think it could stall out without eating the blinds (these are torquey little motors) but 24 AWG should be plenty for 600 mA at 6V. Nothing should melt.

The original Instructables is here: Blinds

Yeah, I didn't have much luck with a pure timer setup when I tried it the LDR way. The author said he got good results, but mine became unusable pretty quick. I think I have to use a sensor for the open position. Close is easy to do with a timer, because it doesn't matter if you slightly overshoot it. Also, I'm directly turning the mechanism in the blinds now rather than turning the hand closer with a motor like he does in the Instructable. That should take out some variability.

I'll probably use a sensor in each position, with a backup timer to prevent damage to the blinds. If you've got the one reed switch it is trivial to add another.