Smart things vs. Vera

[IVB]

Random comment from a dude with a house built in 1911. I had knob & tube in much of the house, an updated panel but only a few outlets going to it. I also have a wireless unfriendly neighborhood due to extreme airwave pollution (NorCal, high tech = high density of everything wireless), so a variety of mainstream paths just wouldn't work.
 
Took 4 years, but 6 months ago I finished ripping out all the knob & tube and running romex to everything. Now I can use any lighting technology I want. But more importantly, LED bulbs flicker on dimmers without a neutral.
 
If you can, i'd suggest slowly running neutral to the switch. 

 

[Dean Roddey]

There are a couple big threads on Reddit about SmartThings, and they aren't pretty. And there are enough folks talking that it's seemingly not just the common issue that some small percentage of folks will always have an issue with any product. Leaving aside product features and such, between lack of reliability and outages of the cloud service (some aspects of which it depends on apparently), a lot of folks seem not happy.
 
I'm finally starting to see some more widespread understanding of the limitations of cloud based systems, as folks get real world experience with the realities of that.

 

[wkearney99]

It's indeed good to see a wider range of participants, approaches and devices.  There's bound to be complications.  
 
The upside to some of ST's approach is getting a somewhat more versatile editing framework for configuring devices.  It's tough providing an effective UI for editing, especially across multiple platforms.  Going with a web-based solution gets around a lot of that but also brings along other adventures.   
 
This also blurs the boundaries between what's "local" versus what's "online".  Lots of the online stuff (on various platforms) is barely more than spit-and-bailing-wire lashed together nonsense.  But it is generating fresh interest in automating things in diverse ways.  Ways that have often been "too hard" to do in the past.  Too hard to get a developer to integrate them, too hard to get enough details about how to do it reliably, too hard to overcome vendor insistence on certain approaches, etc.

 

[macromark]

Today's "smart hub" is basically an access point for a web service. This approach is done to keep costs down, particularly the hardware.  Since most of these devices include tiny processors with limited RAM or storage and few ports, they can retail at $99 without putting the company out of business. However, and this is due to "creative" marketing, I don't think a lot people actually realize what they're getting when they click the 'buy' button. A lot of posts on Reddit (like this one) bear that out, as do conversations and emails we have daily with prospective users.
 
The upside for smart hubs is that they are simply more affordable than locally-controlled systems and that attracts a new (usually younger) target audience. This is a good thing as it brings for people to the party!  The downside is that cloud server or internet outages and maintenance updates translate to home automation outages too. This is a bad thing... potentially very bad, and possibly very expensive. Some companies are responding to these issues and making some changes but (to date), none of these are able to function fully independently like a locally controlled system.

 

[drvnbysound]

Mark,
 
You definitely hit that one on the head - for me at least.
 
I was really liking the idea of having a robust "smart hub" for ~$100, and the ease of setup was reportedly very good. However my ears perked up as soon as I heard mention of a cloud service and the device needing an internet connection. Following this more, I am glad I did not jump on board right away.
 
I really would like a robust, dependable, insert you word here, primary controller that does not rely on a internet connection; something to replace the Leviton VRUSB and RFIT would be nice. Granted, I have mine working, but it has it's own issues and is seemingly due for an upgrade!
 
Having said that, I know that I'm likely in a situation that may be different from others, where I've done all of my automation via Elk directly and have no desire for any wall-mounted or other interface devices. The Elk performs the automation tasks I need, and the keypad allows me to arm/disarm as needed.

 

[macromark]

Mark,
 
...I really would like a robust, dependable, insert you word here, primary controller that does not rely on a internet connection; something to replace the Leviton VRUSB and RFIT would be nice. Granted, I have mine working, but it has it's own issues and is seemingly due for an upgrade!
 
Having said that, I know that I'm likely in a situation that may be different from others, where I've done all of my automation via Elk directly and have no desire for any wall-mounted or other interface devices. The Elk performs the automation tasks I need, and the keypad allows me to arm/disarm as needed.

I'm guessing you're using a VRC0P as a secondary controller then? Not a lot options for the Elk at this point unfortunately. Our software does have an ASCII/JSON interface so our little HomeTroller Zee would actually work for you but... nobody's written an Elk protocol driver for it.
 

 

[drvnbysound]

I'm guessing you're using a VRC0P as a secondary controller then? Not a lot options for the Elk at this point unfortunately. Our software does have an ASCII/JSON interface so our little HomeTroller Zee would actually work for you but... nobody's written an Elk protocol driver for it.
 

 
Yes, and yes
 
But really, I don't have an issue with the VRC0P at all. My issue lies more with having to use the VRUSB (primary controller) and RFIT to build the network and enroll devices. As stated, my network works without issues, but that combination can certainly be flakey.

 

[Sparkman1]

I'm guessing you're using a VRC0P as a secondary controller then? Not a lot options for the Elk at this point unfortunately. Our software does have an ASCII/JSON interface so our little HomeTroller Zee would actually work for you but... nobody's written an Elk protocol driver for it.

Wouldn't UltraM1G3 do the trick?
 
Cheers
Al

 

[macromark]

Wouldn't UltraM1G3 do the trick?
 
Cheers
Al

It would if he wanted to offload the automation functions to HomeSeer and just use the Elk as a security panel. 

 

[ddennerline]

MacroMark – Maybe HomeSeer can work with Elk to build a new http://www.elkproducts.com/product-catalog/m1-to-leviton-z-wave-interface. The caveats are:
1)      Support all Leviton Z-Wave devices. I am not sure that any PC controllers currently support all Leviton scene/zone controllers.
2)      Support the association class (instance notification)
3)      Must talk Elk prototcol and use Elk rules engine.
Basically, it would be full replacement for RFIT and M1-XSLZW. I am getting concerned as Leviton hasn’t released any RTIT updates in over two years. According to my AO contact, Leviton support is not very customer focused these days.