UPB GenII PIM Compatibility

S

sharby

Member
I'm a long time UPB installer that has decided to go full force with GenII (Web Mountain/PCS). I went ahead and immediately bought my first WS1D6, SW7 and most importantly the PIM-R GenII. By the advice of WM, I was told that this PIM-R is backward compatible with GenI (Simply Automated SA240 switches). To my surprise, only the GenII switches are being seen/programmed in UPStart (Version 5.0 B2). Am I doing something wrong? This would be a huge disappointment if I cannot mix and match GenI and GenII on the same network. Thank you!


-=*Sharby*=-
 
I have a mixture of all 3 brands including GEN 1 SA switches and Gen 1 and 2 HAI and PCS devices. My Gen 2 PCS PIM works with all the brands.

I should mention that I've been struggling trying to come up with a combination of multiple phase couplers and/or phase repeater that gives me reliable comm to all my devices (not completely successful yet). In my experimentation with different combos I found that with the exact same config (phase couplers) my GEN 1 SA PIM gives me noticeably better comm to all my devices (Gen 1 & 2) than a new GEN 2 PCS PIM plugged into the same outlet. It wasn't that the PCS Gen2 PIM wasn't compatible, just that it didn't perform as well and couldn't communicate with some of my devices unless it was plugged into the right outlet (but then it couldn't see other devices). I went back to using the GEN1 SA PIM because it gave me better comm to more of the devices.

I use the same PCS UpStart version as you.
 
Just when I convinced myself that UPB is the way to go ... I come across this post. It sounds waaay too much like working with X10. Say it ain't so! :o
 
I'm going to go ahead to just rescan my network. Maybe something is "caught up" with the old software.

-=*Sharby*=-
 
123 said:
Just when I convinced myself that UPB is the way to go ... I come across this post. It sounds waaay too much like working with X10. Say it ain't so! :(
Click to expand...

In my opinion it is the way to go. I've haven't had a missed command in 2 years using UPB. There are some rules of course and depending on your exact situation fine tuning is always a good idea.

First an foremost, don't let anyone tell you that you won't need a phase coupler, you will, if not at the start, at some point. Just bite the bullet and put it in. :o Depending on the size of the home you may need more than one, not usual but I've seen it happen.

Give yourself all the advantages, go for a direct line to the electrical panel for the PIM. It's not necessary but it avoids lots of the pitfalls and gets your UPN signals to the panel nice and clean.

Do not wire UPB switches live, turn off the breaker. I've seen lots of electricians wire it live and blow the chip while doing it. Not that I mind, i get lots of work fixing them and cultivate new customers in the process.

I've not had a problem yet mixing Gen 1 and Gen 2, not that it couldn't happen to someone, I've just not seen it. Personally I'd suspect a weak device before I'd think of a problem with mixing the two.
 
Ok,

My PulseWorx GenII Pim-R is NOT backward compatible with Simply Automated UPB switches. This PIM is running firmware 5.50 (configured in both low and high sensitivity modes) with UPStart. The Simply Automated UMC-DB9 works fine with firmware 4.17. Am I missing something here? The GenII Pim-R sees all GenII switches without a problem. Please help! Thanks

-=*Sharby*=-
 
Were I you I'd be calling Pulseworx and asking this question. I know they have moved to GenII as has HAI, I don't believe that SA has. Either way A UPB controller should be able to operate either or it's not much good to anyone. I've not used a Pulseworx PIM so I can't specifically speak to it. I have used Gen 1 and Gen 2 HAI PIM's with no troubles mixing other brands of devices.
 
My only possible guess so far is that its related to the PIM firmware. With PCS PIM v5.47 (at least according to the label on it) and UPStart 5.0b2 I am able to see all PCS GII and SAI GI switches just fine and can test them, program them, etc. I do get a strange error during some operations that says the Powerline Interface is out of date, use 3.05 or higher. The only difference between our tests is you are using PIM v 5.50 and I am on 5.47, so perhaps there is something different there causing the problems?
 
My Web Mountain PIM (Version 5.47) came in today and works flawlessly. It sees both GenI and GenII switches (SA GenI, WM GenII, PCS GenII). At this point I'm going to point towards either a timing issue on the PCS pim OR firmware. Hopefully, everyone else will have been test results with the Pulseworx device.


-=*Sharby*=-
 
Pulseworx has confirmed that PIM version 5.50 has a timing issue that will not work with Gen I devices. However, later versions from PCS correct this issue. Web Mountain is using 5.47 which works perfectly. That plus a SPR (Split Phase Repeater) give me 99.999% reliability in my house. All new houses that are installed with GenII produce 0 service calls. A big improvement over filters.

-=*Sharby*=-
 
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