Simply Automated UPB

I've had a Simply Automated UPB setup connected to my HIA Omnipro II for several years.  All devices worked 99% of time.  Every now and then a few lights wouldn't get commands, no big deal though.
 
I have 400A service with 2 main panels.  I have a HAI phase coupler installed.
 
Recently all devices on Phase o quit working through UPStart, but still wil sometimes  receive the HAI commands.  UpStart can't even find the devices when in programming mode.
 
I have both my Omnipro and a Windows box connected to different PIMs at same time.
 
Any ideas?

Sounds like your phase coupler may no longer be functioning.
 
Since it is supposed to be installed protected by a circuit breaker, did you check the breaker?
 
Just FYI many of us install a coupler in each panel.

None here other than maybe a new local UPB powerline signal sucker around. 
 
My experience with a sudden loss of an already implemented UPB set up signals one day (and thereafter) were solved by installation of a UPB repeater between phases. 
 
I did start though with a PCS/HAI/SA phase coupler (tried all three on separate breakers).
 
PCS phase coupler did fail on me once and was promptly replaced by PCS (great warranty on their stuff).

What new devices have you installed?  Water heater, Heat pump, overhead fluorescent bank lighting, pump?
If you plug the PIM into the opposite leg, do you get communications on that leg?
 
I had an intermittent loss of signal like you describe and traced it to the times my 240VAC water heater turned on and bridged the legs together attenuating the signals.
I added two additional couplers (total of three) and boosted the signal enough for reliable comms. 
One additional coupler (total of two) would have probably been sufficient but I wanted one in each panel and sub panel.

I'm using the simply automated ZPCI-B Phase Coupler.

No new devices

Wired directly into breaker slot. All 3 status LEDs are green invade pic doesn't attach.

mattbuff5 said:

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1416328108.282370.jpg I'm using the simply automated ZPCI-B Phase Coupler. No new devices Wired directly into breaker slot. All 3 status LEDs are green invade pic doesn't attach.

Click to expand...

 
That rules out the circuit breaker issue.
 
 
So if we assume that the coupler is still good then my next guess would be you recently connected something new that is absorbing the signal.
 
For example, in my home I found that UPS devices as you might use to power a computer really absorbed the UPB signal. Installing UPB filters on them solved the problem. 
 
One day I started having problems and it eventually dawned on me that I had installed another UPS and forgot to include the filter.
 
 
If you HAVEN'T installed any new equipment then I suppose its possible the coupler has failed in some way. Do you have a spare?

I do not have any UPS devices installed.  I have a lot of equipment, but it has been in the house since construction - as has the UPB devices and phase coupler.  I just find it odd that the entire o phase suddenly quits working.  Is there anyway to troubleshoot the phase coupler itself?

Well we are back to the coupler having failed.
 
One thing you could do is move the PIM to phase 0 and see if the problem now becomes communicating with phase 1.
 
If the problem "moves" then I would, lacking any other information, conclude the coupler has failed.
 
You really should have a coupler in each panel so why not order ONE more unit.
 
Swap it with the current unit.
 
If it DOESN'T solve the problem then the current coupler is likely good and you can install it in the other panel - and keep looking for the problem.
 
If it DOES solve the problem then order a second new unit for the other panel.
 
 
But for now move the PIM to phase 0 and see what happens.

How do I set the PIM to Phase o?

Frederick C. Wilt said:

Well we are back to the coupler having failed.
 
One thing you could do is move the PIM to phase 0 and see if the problem now becomes communicating with phase 1.
 
If the problem "moves" then I would, lacking any other information, conclude the coupler has failed.
 
You really should have a coupler in each panel so why not order ONE more unit.
 
Swap it with the current unit.
 
If it DOESN'T solve the problem then the current coupler is likely good and you can install it in the other panel - and keep looking for the problem.
 
If it DOES solve the problem then order a second new unit for the other panel.
 
 
But for now move the PIM to phase 0 and see what happens.

Click to expand...

Plug it into an outlet on the other phase

The Upstart program diagnostic stuff tells you the granular information.   Upstart is very intuitive.  You cannot mess anything up.
 
You can check signals to and from anything on your UPB network.  Upstart is free.  UPB PIMs are very reasonably priced at less than $100 each.
 
I would utilize an extra UPB PIM just to check on signals throughout the house and whether the phase coupler is talking UPB across the phases / in between the two main electrical load (fuse) panels.  You will see it.  I would keep one around just to DIY your own diagnostics stuff.   Get the same PIM as you have already connected to the HAI OPII panel and keep it around as a hot spare.
 
Here I keep two online UPB Pims near the fuse panel connected (software / OmniPro II panel).  One floater for the laptop wherever diagnostics and one connected at the furthest point of electricity in the home away from the Panel connected to a Quatech serial server.  (it is overkill and not really necessary today).
 
Here my UPB signal sapping stuff appeared randomly at first; then noticed it was sort of regular.  I attributed it to new construction / new electrical next door  (in ground pool pump?).  But that was a guess.  I just then installed a repeater and it fixed my issues.
 
Curious if you are familiar with the inside of your two fuse panels or want to be? 
 
I mean you can hire an electrician most likely he/she will not be familiar with the technology being utilized so you will need to find an electrician / UPB installer person. 
 
IE: a UPB familiar electrician installer will have spare PIMs, Upstart and will be comfortable with removing the cover from your fuse panels if they need to make physical changes. 
 
The DIY pieces mentioned above with Upstart / extra PIM an a laptop will work for diagnostic stuff.
 
The PCS IP connected PIM would let you do diagnostics via a wireless connected laptop such that you can move both the PIM and the laptop around the house.  You can also then connect to the IP PIM via the internet (WAN).

So the weird part of my issue (to me at least) that I haven't seen in discussion yet is the following:
 
My HAI PIM that is connected to the Omnipro and my SA PIM that is connected to my PC are physically plugged into the SAME receptacle that is directly wired off one of the breaker panels.
 
When I send lighting control commands from the SnapLink on my iPhone, the signal works properly and the respective lights responds appropriately (both devices on the s phase and o phase).  However, when I try to send commands from UPstart through the SA PIM connected to my PC, nothing on the o phase recevies the signal - in fact - UpStart can't even 'see' the device.
 
Does anybody else find this weird?

Well not all PIMs are created equal.
 
Perhaps the HAI PIM is more powerful/sensitive.
 
Or perhaps the SA PIM is damaged.
 
Download the version of UPStart that is compatible with your HAI PIM and see if UPStart works OK when using the HAI PIM.
 
Just FYI (and this has nothing do to with your problem) is that there are different kinds of couplers - inverting and non-inverting. I tried both and in my home the SA inverting did not work well at all, where as the HAI non-inverting helped a lot. Go figure.

I would also be suspicious of the SA PIM.  Generation I UPB products DO NOT support repeaters, and although SA says their current products do, I can tell you, that is not what I am finding.
 
So I was an early adopter of UPB and had mostly SA switches back in the Gen. I days.  After several couplers, my signal was OK, but with a PCS repeater, it was SOOO much better.  BUT Gen 1 stuff doesn't work with a repeater in the return path.
 
O.K. new house, and I decided to go all HAI Gen. III with the same PCS repeater.  Everything works fantastic, EXCEPT with a few SA devices, even new ones, which aren't working good.  And a SA PIM might be part of the problem.  I have a PCS PIM that I will try today.  But for "O" traffic, WITH a repeater, your stuff on BOTH ends must support a repeater and some SA stuff doesn't.

Yup; here my Omnipro II connected PIM is HAI.  One spare is HAI.  The other two are SA (one is USB and the other is Serial).
 
The newer multitoggle dual load UPB switches are all SA.
 
The older stuff is a hodgepodge mix of HAI, SA and PCS UPB switches. 
 
A few years back here did put a PCS, SA and HAI phase coupler in using autonomous breakers just to see the difference.
 
Aside from the inverted and non inverting phase couplers.....
 
SA is using a propietary USB driver for their UPB PIM and PCS is using a USB to Serial converter inside of their USB PIM.
 
I had issues utilizing a USB to network device using the SA USB PIM with a Digi USBAnywhere and Lantronics USB to network device.  PCS is using a Digi based embedded firmware controller for their network PIM today.
 
Note that this involves installation of two PC drivers; one just for the USB to serial cable converter and one for Upstart (which is installed by default when installing the software).
 
I put in an HAI repeater and I think but am not sure that the HAI, SA and PCS repeaters are all the same with just different labels on them (not sure though).  The repeater fixed my UPB transport stuff between phases and I don't pay much attention now that all of the switches communicate with all of the PIMs wherever they might be.
 
I am guessing too that you have an HAI to Serial connector to utilize the HAI PIM with a PC eh? 
 
A USB to Serial converter will also work if you do not have serial ports on your laptop.
 
HAI PIM = = > RJ-connector to RS-232 cable = = > Serial to USB cable
 
As Frederick mentions above your best diagnostic tool is Upstart. 
 
You can tweak stuff with Upstart but not fix hardware issues (if they exists) with it.