Elk M1 Active Low?

I have a bunch of Napco C200AP motion sensors that can also double as occupancy sensors. They have a "fast response mode", that requires an active low (~1V) when the panel is armed, and an active high (~12V) when the panel is disarmed. What's the best way to get this out of an Elk M1?
 
The manual is here for your reference.

A voltage output from the M1 (e.g. outputs 7-16) should be fine for this. You'll need to write a rule to turn the output on when the panel is disarmed and off when it is armed.

I don't know what you mean by active high and active low but you can set the Elk zone to Normally Open or Normally Closed. The Elk system will go high or put ~12vdc on the circuit when the circuit is closed and 0.0vdc when the circuit is switched open.
 
Mike.

I was confused by the active low too (hence why I'm asking) but they appear to define an active low as 1V and high as 12V

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Active high means that when the condition is true, the signal is high (in this case +12V).
 
Active low means that when the condition is true, the signal is low (near 0V, or below 1V in this case).

From the installation manual:
 
Quick Response Mode
If Terminal 5 is connected to the Status Terminal (Arm Lug) of the control
panel, the sensor will provide a quicker response time while the panel is
disarmed.
Note:
The control panel’s Status Terminal must provide a low
output when armed.
 
It looks like you would connect one of the M1 outputs to terminal 5 of the motion detector to tell the detector if the system is armed or disarmed.
 
Mike.

I thought of using the Elk outputs, but they don't provide any voltage when off. Based on this manual (under Control Terminals) for another Napco product, they appear to define active low as 1V, and I wasn't sure what kind of circuit I'd require to get that out of the Elk. Or am I just confusing terms/over-complicating things?
 
Here's an excerpt from the manual:
 
The CNTRL Terminals are active low; that is, they will go to
about 1 volt when active (on). With no output device connected,
a voltmeter placed across the PGM Terminal and Remote Power
(-), will read 0 volts. When troubleshooting the CNTRL outputs
(with no device connected) connect the positive (+) voltmeter
lead to Remote Power (+) and the negative (-) lead to the CNTRL
Terminal. If the meter reads 0 volts, the CNTRL Terminal is off. If
it reads approximately 12 volts, the CNTRL Terminal is on.

It is likely that ~1 or less will signal active low to the motion detector. Of course proceed with caution when connecting voltages between devices.
 
I think that what you need to do is to connect the positive terminal of an M1 output to terminal 5 of the motion detector and connect the common terminal of the M1 to the common terminal of the motion detector. Then using Elk rules you would turn the output off (low) when the system arms and turn the output on (high) when the system disarms.
 
I only did a quick search of the installation manual but I think that your answers are in the advanced features section.
 
My advise is free and if it doesn't work for you I'll return every penny of it.
 
Mike.

It's just an open collector/LV trigger that is either held high (0V) or low (+12V) to ground, or relation to ground.
 
The M1's triggers will not satisfy this, you'd need a current sink to ground, not a +V trigger. Basically a relay would be needed.
 
Their troubleshooting steps confirm this. Basically just a switched negative.

DEL
 
thanks for the correction, i don't want to be the cause of any harm to giesen's M1.
 
mike.

A relay would definitely work.  But a simple pulldown resistor, say 470 ohms, may also work. Just connect the resistor between the M1's output and NEG. If the input to motion sensor if a logic type input, which I suspect it is based on the <1V low level specification, the resistor may be all that is needed.

DELInstallations said:

It's just an open collector/LV trigger that is either held high (0V) or low (+12V) to ground, or relation to ground.
 
The M1's triggers will not satisfy this, you'd need a current sink to ground, not a +V trigger. Basically a relay would be needed.
 
Their troubleshooting steps confirm this. Basically just a switched negative.

Click to expand...

 
I don't understand the terminology here. Are you saying that terminal 5 of the sensor is switched to ground?
 
Mike.

So I should connect terminal 5 to the NO terminal and my M1OVR and the COM terminal to a negative power terminal (again on the M1OVR)?

Presuming I turn on the relay when panel is disarmed...

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RAL said:

A relay would definitely work.  But a simple pulldown resistor, say 470 ohms, may also work. Just connect the resistor between the M1's output and NEG. If the input to motion sensor if a logic type input, which I suspect it is based on the <1V low level specification, the resistor may be all that is needed.

Click to expand...

That's not going to satisfy here. Napco is a switched negative/pull to ground. The M1 provides a +V trigger, so the only way would be to invert the trigger, so the trigger would need to be held high in a normal condition and then turn "off" when the desired operation is performed. That's what the Napco manual gets into.

To the OP, either you'd need to invert the rule action (ON is actually OFF, etc.) or use a relay to invert the actual trigger and become a switched negative instead of the switched positive the M1 provides.