Garage Door Control
- Thread starter TLGriff
- Start date
elvisimprsntr
Active Member
I hope you have good liability insurance. Automatically closing a garage door is a very bad idea. And before someone chimes in regarding some newer garage door openers which offer this feature, I suggest you read the limited liability section of the manufacturers warranty.TLGriff said:
I have already cited documented cases in this and other forums where a child was crushed to death under a garage door, even with a beam break sensor. The parents of the child sued the homeowner (the uncle), Sears, and the contractor who installed the door opener. There is also the scenario in which you park a vehicle half way in the garage and the beam passes under the vehicle. Even if the door reverses direction it will likely at least cause some damage to the vehicle.
My conscience is clear. Is yours?
You can do it safely, but you have to do it correctly. You need a sensor to determine when the door is open, and a sensor to determine when the door is closed. One sensor won't cut it.elvisimprsntr said:
Second, the beam sensor the garage door manufacturers provide by law is a joke. Because people usually close their garage door as they go into their house, the door IS closing unsupervised, which is very dangerous. What you need is a wall of IR beams across ever inch of garage door opening. I use one with 10 beams, but what you use will depend on your garage door.
Last you need to write some programming to stop the door should a beam be blocked. On mine, the beam sensors will even stop the door when I use the opener button to close the door, not the automation system.
There is no reason you can't make it very safe, but like anything else, its going to cost you more money to do it correctly.
elvisimprsntr
Active Member
It's not just about safety. It's about liability. I suggest you speak to your homeowners insurance provider if your home brew Rube Goldberg autonomous garage door contraption of sensors and programming would be covered against personal injury or property damage.ano said:
I have no respect for those who attempt to automatically close their garage door. I have even less respect for those who help those who ask how.
You might want to go to Amazon and type in "Automatic Garage Door Closer" and see what comes back.elvisimprsntr said:
https://www.amazon.com/AutoCloser-Automatic-Garage-Door-Closer/dp/B0013N0GZM/ref=sr_1_1
https://www.amazon.com/GT-100A-Automatic-Garage-Door-Closer/dp/B000JJJRCE/ref=sr_1_2
https://www.amazon.com/Garage-Guardian-Automatic-Closer-Timer/dp/B01D077520/ref=sr_1_3
And then you will also want to look at the products that allow you to control your garage door from your smartphone, anywhere in the world.
https://www.amazon.com/gLink-smart-phone-garage-remote/dp/B00VPF3EVQ/ref=sr_1_sc_1
https://www.amazon.com/Chamberlain-MYQ-G0201-MyQ-Garage-Controls-Smartphone/dp/B00EAD65UW/ref=sr_1_sc_2
Apparently these companies didn't get your memo on the liability. Note that ALL of these systems use the stock one IR beam which I said was inadequate.
About 7 or 8 people are killed a year by garage doors. But 450 are killed a year from just falling out of bed, and another 480 are killed falling of of ladders. 70 kids die every year chocking on hot dogs. Life has risks, but most of these can be managed.
elvisimprsntr
Active Member
ano said:
And you failed to read my first post.
And before someone chimes in regarding some newer garage door openers which offer this feature, I suggest you read the limited liability section of the manufacturers warranty.
I would have expected more from a self proclaimed Guru
Donning my asbestos suit, I'm going to emphatically disagree, especially given prior experiences in testifying about system integration and automation.elvisimprsntr said:
HO's insurance isn't going to say a single thing about the control if the factory safeties are intact. They don't require HO's to replace their old knob and tube wiring, their rubber insulated BX or aluminum wired branch circuits. They definitely don't require the HO to replace their 1970's Craftsman GDO with add on wireless operation or installed keyswitch.....I've worked on plenty of both of those over the years.
It's really not that much different than taking a keyfob GDO remote and using it within the house or people hitting the button as they walk into the house. Of course, the safeties would also need to be adjusted appropriately for the reverse and stop feature, not to mention the PE's that are used as a safety. I know my GDO reverses if my door binds slightly in my 70 year old house, even just barely breathing on it or when it hits slightly hard on the apron, it'll reverse. That's part of the reason why you don't use a piece of wood but something like a paper towel roll.
How the automation is implemented is a different scenario. Putting too much logic on it wouldn't be what I'd call beneficial. There's better ways to skin the cat through hard relay breaks vs. programming logic. Programming is a flawed method.
There is a UL standard for door opener safety - UL 325. It was updated a few years ago to include safety requirements for doors that can close automatically. If your system meets the UL 325 standards, as well as any additional local building code requirements, you should be reasonably safe from any negligence and liability claims.
http://www.cepro.com/article/potential_legal_liabilities_for_integrating_garage_doors_with_home_automati
http://www.cepro.com/article/potential_legal_liabilities_for_integrating_garage_doors_with_home_automati
Really doesn't cover much or require much. Most modern GDO's have the secondary sensor (PE beams) so the only item that would be discretionary would be (thinking out loud) adding a basic chime/strobe in the garage timed before the auto operation begins. That's a belt/suspenders install, but it would be the HO's responsibility to prove you didn't follow UL.RAL said:
DELInstallations said:
Under the 2010 changes, audible and visual warnings are required for 5 seconds before the door starts to close. Not discretionary.
You could try and upgrade an older system to meet the current standards. But should you ever have any legal problems, you'd have an easier time if the system was manufactured under the current standards and listed as meeting them. Just that much less for the lawyers to argue about.
The commercial available interfaces and GDO's, yes. That said, anything homebrew would technically not be listed, though the integrator could also show that due dilligence and design criteria was met, however there's no way to prove that the warning devices were functional at the time of an incident, unfortunately.RAL said:
It comes down to a legal argument, and that's what the article states, the integrator would have to prove they brought it to the HO's attention or deficiencies were noted to the HO. Really it's pointing to the integrator documenting their install to avoid exposure.
tmbrown97
Senior Member
Though I agree this went pretty far off topic, it's not irrelevant info, and the flaming was minimal. We do not over-moderate here if things can work themselves out.TLGriff said:
I'm also in the camp of not blindly closing a door, but I won't preach. In my own home, it alerts me that the door is open and it's up to me to close it. If I ever really wanted to open/close it remotely, I'd install a camera inside the garage so I could monitor. I'm pretty OCD about the garage; I have to watch it close 100% of the way, and it's not because I'm worried about babies or pets - it's about making sure it didn't hit a car and reverse or anything like that.
Now regarding the damage that might happen to a car... many years back now, I had my car sticking half-way out the garage (backed in) on one side, while I was up on a ladder on the other side of the garage... I leaned against the ladder and hit the remote in my pocket closing the door on the hood of my car. This was an old, poorly maintained 80's era opener. It took a second to realize what was happening, and once I figured it out, there was no way to get off the ladder or dig through my pockets in time. I watched in horror as the door came down on my hood and pushed my Suburban hard enough to see the front end dip a bit. However, it did finally reverse, and there wasn't a mark on the vehicle.
Thanks W2P,
I feel better now anyway now that my "conscience is clear".
I'm more from the common sense side.What I'm talking about is automatically closing the door well after dark on the off chance that it gets left open by accident. And if there were children around here, I might reconsider, but there aren't.
Regarding parking ones car under an automatic door; that's kind of like parking it on a railroad crossing and then wondering why it's not there the next day.
Tom
I feel better now anyway now that my "conscience is clear".
I'm more from the common sense side.What I'm talking about is automatically closing the door well after dark on the off chance that it gets left open by accident. And if there were children around here, I might reconsider, but there aren't.
Regarding parking ones car under an automatic door; that's kind of like parking it on a railroad crossing and then wondering why it's not there the next day.
Tom
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