CAT5 under house eve - do I need an underground rated? In Sun?

[Linwood]

I have lots of grey UTP, and need to run some of it under the even of a house outdoors where I cannot pull through the attic (been trying for a day).  
 
The cable is labeled MER/CMR(UL)  CMC if that helps.
 
I could call the location damp -- it is out of the sun entirely (other than reflections), and generally protected from rain.  
 
Is the grey cable suitable for a protected but possibly damp location outside? 
 
I assume direct burial will work if not, is there something different for outside-not-underground? 
 
I think I may also have a place I need to run in bright sun along a pool cage.  Same question, is the standard grey OK, is direct burial, or something else? 
 
 
 
 

 

[drvnbysound]

I don't know the NEC answer (so take my response with a small grain)... but I've run quite a bit of indoor Category cable to soffits for IP cameras. Having said that, I've never had the cable exposed as I utilize dome cameras that mount flush with the soffit and the cabling tucks into the soffit. I've only run direct burial, UV cable where it has been exposed to the elements or in conduit.

 

[Linwood]

Thanks.  I'm struggling with getting into the soffit reasonably, not good with this aluminum stuff, afraid if I start pulling it loose I won't get it back up, 
 
Ouch, I just realized I had been looking at CCA prices.  Solid copper for UV rated (not direct burial) is a bit over $100 and direct burial is closer to $150.   Copper is getting expensive.
 
I assume CCA is not a real good idea for this kind of work (and POE)?

 

[RAL]

Cable rated for direct burial is the right thing to use.  Even though the cable will be in the shade under the soffits, it will still be exposed to UV, and that will degrade the PVC jacket over time.   Regular cable will work fine for a while - probably several years.   But if you want to do this only once, I would use direct burial cable and then you won't have to worry.
 
My preference is to use solid copper cable rather than CCA.  I've read of problems with CCA and insulation displacement connectors, although many folks have found it works for them, at least initially.

 

[Linwood]

OK.  At that price I make make another couple attempts at pulling up through the attic.  The problem is that corner of the house has a very high ceiling, and no room (at least not for me) to crawl over it, so I was hoping to poke up through the eve, and hook it with a long pole.   But so far I can't get the rod to come out where I can see it from the other side, it's hitting rafters I think that join up to the corner rafter (or whatever you call the thing on a gable roof at the corner).   I drilled the hole in far enough to miss (I thought) the last rafter but even one over doesn't seem to give me room.  But it's worth a few more tries.
 
the ceilings are 2' lower on the side of the house so it is a lot easier to get to the edge. 
 
Sigh... you guys don't want to know all that.  Unless someone small with really long arms lives in SW Florida and wants a couple hours work helping.   ray:

 

[drvnbysound]

Where are the pictures?!?
 
I pulled cabling for 3 cameras this past weekend. Hopefully planning to do 3 more this coming weekend - these will have to be in conduit.

 

[Linwood]

Where are the pictures?!?

 
Pictures?   Of a sweaty fat guy running cable?  That belongs on some other site!!
 
Or if you mean of the cameras, right now there are just holes.  And some of those are ugly (took three tries to miss studs going through the stucco under the porch area -- finally had to come in from the attic).   So no pictures of mistakes like that!!!
 
Maybe when I get a couple mounted and painted.  

Right now I'm doing the interior conduit leading to the closet so I can more easily pull cable into where the switch will go, and refurbishing an old PC to be the VMS.

 

[pete_c]

But so far I can't get the rod to come out where I can see it from the other side, it's hitting rafters I think that join up to the corner rafter (or whatever you call the thing on a gable roof at the corner).   I drilled the hole in far enough to miss (I thought) the last rafter but even one over doesn't seem to give me room.  But it's worth a few more tries.

 
Relating to one soffit camera.  I drilled a small hole maybe 1" or less into the aluminum soffit. 
 
Here I could not crawl all the way to the soffit area in the attic.  I decided then to just use a fiberglass rod from the outside through a hole in the soffit.  I could get to the end of the fiberglass rod in the attic.  I just taped the end of the catXX cable to the end of the fiberglass rod and pulled it from the outside.  I had pushed the rod in along the line of the roof and I saw it in the attic between the rafters.  The difficult piece was being on a ladder outside two stories up.   Think one time also used a broomstick from the outside.

 

[drvnbysound]

Pictures?   Of a sweaty fat guy running cable?  That belongs on some other site!!
 
Or if you mean of the cameras, right now there are just holes.  And some of those are ugly (took three tries to miss studs going through the stucco under the porch area -- finally had to come in from the attic).   So no pictures of mistakes like that!!!
 
Maybe when I get a couple mounted and painted.  

Right now I'm doing the interior conduit leading to the closet so I can more easily pull cable into where the switch will go, and refurbishing an old PC to be the VMS.

 
Haha! No thanks!
 
Pictures of what you were describing above... attic, access, external, etc... anything that the rest of us could possible use to determine alternate installation methods.

 

[pete_c]

Here are some pictures from the CCTV forum.
 

 

 

[Linwood]

Relating to one soffit camera.  I drilled a small hole maybe 1" or less into the aluminum soffit. 
 
Here I could not crawl all the way to the soffit area in the attic.  I decided then to just use a fiberglass rod from the outside through a hole in the soffit.  I could get to the end of the fiberglass rod in the attic.  I just taped the end of the catXX cable to the end of the fiberglass rod and pulled it from the outside.  I had pushed the rod in along the line of the roof and I saw it in the attic between the rafters.  The difficult piece was being on a ladder outside two stories up.   Think one time also used a broomstick from the outside.

 
Exactly, Pete, that is what I have and am doing.   All was going according to plan, I had about 15' of glow-rod to push up, and it started going in and about 5' hits.   Everywhere I push it hits about the same distance in.  So hopeful I get to the vantage in the attic about 15' away and... nothing.   I think it's hitting wood below where the insulation is.  
 
My next try I may use some old #8 (+/-) wire I have, something I can put a bend in, and see if I can curve it over the wall but under the rafter and still come out above the insulation.   The fish rod is very springy and will curve but not stay curved.   One problem is the edges of newer block houses down here have solid concrete caps on the block, and the rafters and trusses are strapped down with a lot of hardware.  Makes for quite an obstacle course (and precludes any fix that involves drilling the wall to get a better angle -- not going through that much concrete).
 
So close... 
 

 

[pete_c]

Yeah here too thinking I hit insulation between the soffit area and the floor of the attic.  I did throw a small piece of plywood in the attic to be able to crawl some over to the soffit area.

 

[Linwood]

Relative to your photo, in my case there's no plywood (green line) above the aluminum soffit panel, and the L shaped piece (red) in my case is nailed in.   

The bigger problem is this is a gabled corner, so the roof descends on both sides of the corner, meaning the afters get shorter and shorter to where they attach to the ridge.  I came out to not be in the shortest rafter section, but I think I may need to go over another rafter (not sure if they are 24" or 16", I think 24") which moves the camera pretty far away from the corner and will compromise the view of one car's parking place.  Maybe.   Though I hate to drill a new hole anyway.
 
In my case (looking at the hand-drawn item) the black wall extends up about 12" and is very near the plywood, so the angle is high, with that styrofoam spacer to hold the insulation away.  I'm running the push rod above that styrofoam (which seems to work) but it hits something out of sight before it gets far enough in.

 

[Linwood]

Yeah here too thinking I hit insulation between the soffit area and the floor of the attic.  I did throw a small piece of plywood in the attic to be able to crawl some over to the soffit area.

 
Yeah, I'm actually OK walking on ceiling joists generally, even crouched, and even crawling for a couple feet maybe if I put on knee pads, but this area there's 15' or so that I am not sure I could even kneel-crawl.  And it's probably 90F up there even in the early morning (I just don't do anything up there in the afternoon).

 

[pete_c]

Personally I would wait until it cools off a bit.