ELK: UPB and Z-Wave

[drvnbysound]

I have installed a few alarms in the past, but purchased an ELK M1G a few months ago, with plans to also get into automation. I have been working on finishing up my structured wiring, and recently really started reading up on the ELK installation and watching some training videos. I currently have a number of Zwave dimmers and receptacles installed in various rooms of my house (purchased when RadioShack was selling off all of their Zwave devices); I also have Kwikset Zwave deadbolts (current not utilizing the Zwave function - waiting for ELK to be installed). I have found the dimmers (GE) to have 'glitches' in the sense that some lights will turn off if a fan on the circuit is turned on... I have read that others have also experienced this problem. I have not found any other Zwave dimmers that I actually care for (cosmetically), including the Vizia models. That said, I really like the HAI UPB dimmers and switches, and also like the idea of having a 'wired' protocol that could potentially be more reliable.

I was watching one of the ELK videos yesterday and it was repeated multiple times that they discourage using multiple lighting technologies in a single system. I want/need to keep a Zwave network (thinking of swapping a bunch of my receptacles) so that I can utilize the Kwikset locks, but really want to use UPS dimmers (incandescent) and relay switches (for florescent and fans). The issue seemed to be that when setting up various technologies on the same network, one could easily have lights from each technology entered as the same ID within ELK, which would cause issues.

I wanted to find out how many people are using both UPB and Zwave in a single installation? If so, do you have any issues?

The ELK technicians said that it was possible to do, but again... discouraged. Looking for opinions/comments/suggestions...

 

[ddennerline]

There shouldn’t be any problem with just Z-Wave locks along with UPD lights as Z-Wave locks are not a first-class citizen in ElkRP. Z-Wave locks are really only visible because special static strings are sent/received by M1XLZW.
You may have some communication problems if only using Z-Wave locks as the distance from M1XLZW may be too far. I had to add a lamp module to get reliable communication.
P.S.
You may want to just try a Vizia+ dimmer/switch in key location. It does take a few days to get use to the paddle action. I now actually prefer paddle over rocker (and flip) because when it’s dark you only have to feel for one position. The Vizia+ products come with a five year warranty and several different faceplates. Yes, they are much more expensive than GE Z-Wave.

 

[drvnbysound]

Yeah, as you stated the distance from my XSLZW and either of my locks is going to be a minimum of 20-ft or so, which is why I am planning to add a number of Z-Wave capable receptacles throughout the house... simply to increase the Z-Wave network to ensure the locks are as reliable as possible. Using the Leviton VRUSB-1US in conjunction with the VRCOP and XSLZW, I don't see any way to choose where the Z-Wave devices land, in terms of their given ID's. I have to assume that there is a way to modify or do so in the UPB setup so that they are not co-located on the same ELK ID. (Hopefully I am stating that somewhat correctly).

I'm not so much concerned with cost... sure, I don't want to spend more than I need to, but I'd certainly rather spend the money and get it right, than try to cut corners and end up with something that isn't reliable.

 

[ddennerline]

You may want to check the manufacture Z-Wave receptacle’s specification and ensure device supports beaming/security class. The plugin VRP03-1LW (latest +3 version) is only device that can route security packets.

You could include/exclude Z-Wave devices continuously until the Z-Wave deviceIDs reached your range threshold. Every time you include/exclude a device, the numeric identifier increases by one. The numeric identifiers are not reused. This would be painful, but is one solution.

 

[tmbrown97]

I can't help with the z-wave side, but it's extremely easy to renumber devices in upstart to get them out of the way. It won't even screw up any links; only direct device commands.

One note - if you really do mean you want to use UPB receptacles, as in the in-wall plug receptacles, one thing I want to point out is that they generally only accept up to 12A whereas your standard house wiring is for either 15 or 20a; Make sure you know that before plugging in anything big.

 

[drvnbysound]

You may want to check the manufacture Z-Wave receptacle’s specification and ensure device supports beaming/security class. The plugin VRP03-1LW (latest +3 version) is only device that can route security packets.

You could include/exclude Z-Wave devices continuously until the Z-Wave deviceIDs reached your range threshold. Every time you include/exclude a device, the numeric identifier increases by one. The numeric identifiers are not reused. This would be painful, but is one solution.

Understood... all of the GE devices I have now do support beaming, I just hate that they dont work WELL, which is part of why I want to use UPB dimmers and relay switches.

I already have the VRCOP-1LW (the +3 version), so I should have no problems working with the locks.

 

[drvnbysound]

I can't help with the z-wave side, but it's extremely easy to renumber devices in upstart to get them out of the way. It won't even screw up any links; only direct device commands.

One note - if you really do mean you want to use UPB receptacles, as in the in-wall plug receptacles, one thing I want to point out is that they generally only accept up to 12A whereas your standard house wiring is for either 15 or 20a; Make sure you know that before plugging in anything big.

This sounds exactly like what they were talking about, and this is very good to know. I dont think there is a good way to renumber the devices in the Leviton software, other than possibly adding/deleting/re-adding devices again as d.dennerline mentioned above... this would be a very painful process.

I think you may have read that wrong regarding the receptacles - I plan to use UPB dimmers and switches and Z-Wave receptacles (non-plug in type, but full replacement of existing receptacles), but I am glad you mentioned their rating, as I have never looked into that or noticed before.

 

[tmbrown97]

Sorry - typo, but you got the point - I just wanted to make sure you realized that they can't handle the same amperage as a normal household plug because I don't think a lot of people realize that. Granted, there aren't that many things we plug in our homes that consume more than 12A, but it's easy to go over when doing christmas lights or when using larger tools or portable air conditioners, etc.