Elk wsv2

[bjl]

I'M sure this has been discussed several times before, but having trouble finding the information. I'm installing a wsv2, new construction and already flooded once (rat and pex don't mix), I have the m1 gold already hooked up but need some wireless sensors. Does elk have water sensors? If not, what sensor is good with the 2 way system.

Thanks in advance

 

[TurboSam]

I use the GRI water moccasin and 12 volt water sensors .

 

[RAL]

Elk doesn't offer a water sensor yet.  If you need a wireless connection to a water sensor, one way to do it would be with an Elk 6022 3-zone sensor, which provides a door/window contact, plus terminals for two external contacts.   You could connect the external terminals to a wired water sensor like the GRI sensors that TurboSam linked to above.  But you would need to also provide a 12V power supply to power the water sensor.  A 12 VDC wall wart would be fine for that if you don't require battery backup.

 

[drvnbysound]

Curious for those using the GRI 12V sensors: Are you using the normally closed or normally open?

 

[TurboSam]

I use the 4-wire closed loop sensors with the built-in energized relay (and Elk set to Water Sensor Normally Closed).
 
I chose that configuration because the sensors are under carpets, near tack strips, and otherwise in areas where the wires could be damaged, and I wanted the supervision.

 

[drvnbysound]

I use the 4-wire closed loop sensors with the built-in energized relay (and Elk set to Water Sensor Normally Closed).
 
I chose that configuration because the sensors are under carpets, near tack strips, and otherwise in areas where the wires could be damaged, and I wanted the supervision.

 
Thanks for the response. I was thinking the same. I don't have any right now, but looking to install some in our next home - mostly near water based appliances (water heater, washer, sinks, dishwasher, toilets, etc).

 

[TurboSam]

Yeah, I did those things and around the foundation of our carpeted basement after a disastrous experience with a plugged downspout in a Seattle monsoon.
 
I sent up alarms and text messages in both Elk and CQC, and have this insight to pass along.  
 
I set them up on separate zones to text me when they got wet (violated) or dried (secure), and we were overseas when the only other water event I have experienced (another monsoon) occurred.  A couple of hours (I think) following the initial alert from one zone, I was getting texts (and emails) every minute (or less), with dozens and dozens and dozens of texts over the next hour or so.  
 
This would all have been fine and dandy if I had been in the US with an unlimited text messaging plan, but these things were coming in at fifty cents a pop so I finally called VZ and had them shut off text messages (a real trick to do from overseas).  I surmise that as the sensor (most likely the water moccasin) dried, it never dried completely at once, so the moisture level somewhere along its length was high enough to re-trigger the sensor.  I could imagine the same thing might happen to the under carpet triggers too.
 
In any event, when I got home I revised my rules so that after an initial water alert from any zone, there is a swinger delay of x minutes on both the wet and dry triggers.  I also have a rule that checks every hour to see if any water zone is violated, and if so, I get a text that tells me which ones are still wet so I have an idea of what's going on.

 

[video321]

I also went with the 4-wire version for the added supervision.

 

[bjl]

Wow, that's has got to be an awful feeling. Knowing you are currently flooding out and powerless to do anything. Looking back on my project I do wish I would have went wired for everything. I do feel safe and secured with wireless, but equipment options really open up with wired. I also know there is always a way to run wires after the fact especially on interior walls, but time is not on my side. This has been a 2.5 year build almost entirely by myself the bank loan is burning or better yet has burned a hole in my wallet, and living at the inlaws is mentally draining. Was looking at the insteon wireless but I would need a recieved to talk to the m1 or get the isy to talk to the sensor, I think. I saw honeywell has a sensor that reads over a 4' cord that can be extended, instead of a spot, for like $20 a piece. Seems like a good price. I think they just chirp when detect water. Would anyone know if there is a chirp detector that I can mount on the ceiling, kind of like a glass break sensor. If I put it on the ceiling I can hard wire it in.

 

[Del91574]

Buy a GRI water moccasin and do it right instead of how you're intending.  You're going about the detection portion the wrong way.

 

[apostolakisl]

I put in the GRI 2-wire version while under construction.  I put in like 40 of them.  They are a normally open circuit as opposed to the 4 wire version.  I put groups of them together in parallel on 6 zones.  There is not a lot to go wrong with them as there are no moving parts, they simply "short" out when water is in contact with the 2 pins.  Certainly the 4 wire version adds additional peace of mind as it would pick up failed wires, you decide for yourself.  I was more concerned about covering everywhere there might be water.  It would seem rather unwieldy to do this large of a setup wirelessly.  I also have the original wsv.  The valve shuts off 45 minutes after system is armed away.  The devices already saved me hyouuuuuuge (as the Donald would say).  I had a leak where a pex crimp failed in a wall (5-year old house at the time) and was slow leaking under a hardwood floor.  Because I had sensors placed on the slab hidden in various locations where pipes were in the wall I found the leak before it ruined the hardwood floor.  I would never have found that leak until the entire floor buckled up.  As it was, I got some very very slight buckling right in that spot which over about 6 months flattened back out.  Still had to tear out a big hunk of sheetrock to find and fix it.  Now to be paranoid about all the other crimps.
 
EDIT:  If you've already closed up your walls and all and putting in wired sensors is a big deal, you might look at some of the flow type sensors. They install at the main water inlet to the house and use logic to determine patterns that are consistent with leaks versus true usage.  They are pretty good at finding small leaks.  I imagine my leak would have been found.  A sudden rupture of a toilet hookup or similar would still run a lot of water before being stopped, but at least it wouldn't run for 8 hours or something.  I have water detectors hidden behind all of my toilets so that would get shut off in just a few seconds at my house.  Perhaps you can create a blend where you put sensors where it is of higher risk or where retro fitting devices is not unreasonable.  Having the water automatically shut off when you aren't home can go a long way in preventing disasters without any sensors at all.  Should you put in water sensors, you do have to educate your cleaning people.  On a few occasions the cleaning people got them wet and triggered the alarms and shutting down the wsv.  You'll need to write a rule on elk that allows you to manually override a water alarm so you can get the water back on after a false event.  It isn't a big issue though.  We have only had 3 or 4 false triggers in 7 years.