First Phase Wiring and Sensors - What to buy?

[TheEther]

For reference see my first post in the Wiring Closet Section entitled, "Home Automation with a Touch of Security - Noob Help" Thanks!

I'm building a house and am going to have to do my wiring this weekend and next week (which is much earlier than I anticipated). I'm going to have to order the components and wire to do the job today or tomorrow. At this time I plan on home running as much as possible. I'm going to install magnetic door switches (5 Doors), window switches (12 windows or so), a couple wire runs for moisture sensors and a couple motion sensors.

At this time I plan on buying an Elk M1G with a ISY-99, but that purchase will come at a later date. I want to get the house wired up before the drywall.

I'm not sure what to buy though.

I was thinking 2 or 4 pair 20 guage wire to the sensors and switches, any certain kind?.

For the Door Switches I was wanting to do recessed contact switches (what brand is best?) and for the windows I'm not sure what to buy. I have a lot of windows some single and some double.

Your advice and what to buy and where to buy it is greatly appreciated.

As a side note, my windows are vinyl and tan in color. Not sure if I could get a close match on the switch or if that's even important.

Thanks for your help!

 

[Del91574]

I'd stick with a 4/22 as a single type of wire across the board for security. It'll be easier and more common for you to find, compared to what you specified (oddball type/awg). The main thing is that it is appropriately rated for inwall use. Homerunning the cabling is the way to go, and by running a single type of security wire will cut down what you need to order vs. the overall cost in a smaller project such as yours.

Since you're looking at the Elk, you can use Cat 5 for the keypad, put I personally use 8 or 10 conductor wire in my own installs. I'd also plan for 18/2 for interior speaker(s) for your install. I'll assume you're going for the M1G. I use Elk's flush mount single gang interior speakers on the M1G's I put in, usually putting in 4 for a typical install so I can drop the overall load to the M1 down to 8 ohms. Plan on an 18/2 to each speaker and personally, I'd run an 18/4 to any outdoor speaker to give me both the speaker and option for a strobe.

Colormatching a contact will be tough, the only manufacturer I know with a wider variety than the normal 3 colors is Nascom and they're tougher to find. I'm typically using Honeywell's contacts with the staggered T connections (screw terminals) 3/4" button, 3/4" recessed with a 3/8" mag and the PAL-T for surface since they all allow enough room for an EOLR.

 

[TheEther]

I'd stick with a 4/22 as a single type of wire across the board for security. It'll be easier and more common for you to find, compared to what you specified (oddball type/awg). The main thing is that it is appropriately rated for inwall use. Homerunning the cabling is the way to go, and by running a single type of security wire will cut down what you need to order vs. the overall cost in a smaller project such as yours.

Since you're looking at the Elk, you can use Cat 5 for the keypad, put I personally use 8 or 10 conductor wire in my own installs. I'd also plan for 18/2 for interior speaker(s) for your install. I'll assume you're going for the M1G. I use Elk's flush mount single gang interior speakers on the M1G's I put in, usually putting in 4 for a typical install so I can drop the overall load to the M1 down to 8 ohms. Plan on an 18/2 to each speaker and personally, I'd run an 18/4 to any outdoor speaker to give me both the speaker and option for a strobe.

Colormatching a contact will be tough, the only manufacturer I know with a wider variety than the normal 3 colors is Nascom and they're tougher to find. I'm typically using Honeywell's contacts with the staggered T connections (screw terminals) 3/4" button, 3/4" recessed with a 3/8" mag and the PAL-T for surface since they all allow enough room for an EOLR.

Awesome, is there a one stop shop to pick up all those items online?

 

[Del91574]

Unfortunately, I get all through my trade sources, so I don't know about the retail market, pricing, etc.

 

[mikejrc]

if you have vinyl windows before you recess anything call the window manufacturer most of them WILL VOID YOUR WARRANTY if you make any holes for recessed contacts. you won't want brand new windows with no warranty

 

[TheEther]

if you have vinyl windows before you recess anything call the window manufacturer most of them WILL VOID YOUR WARRANTY if you make any holes for recessed contacts. you won't want brand new windows with no warranty

Yeah, I'm just going to do external contacts for that reason..

Thanks!

 

[midrar]

When installing door contacts, I would recommend you also install them in all Walk in Closets, pantry's, and any type of closet with a light. These spaces are perfect examples where the light should only be on when the door is opened. Don't forget to prewire for the alarm motion sensor & the telephone. Its nice to have window contacts but if someone breakes the window, your alarm won't know. Glass Break sensors are also something to consider.

I also like to run a 1" PVC conduit from the basement to the attic on each side of the house. This way, if you ever need to add something in the future, your prepared.

Just remember, PVC, 22/4, cat5, contact sensors, are all very inexpensive to purchase & install during phase one before the dry wall is up. Wire as much as you can now and it will pay for itself.

 

[tmbrown97]

I think DEL's recommendation is spot on - one thing he didn't state is type of wire (solid vs. stranded) - I really prefer stranded - it's less fragile - but I've seen another member say he hates stranded because of the strays I believe.

For retail sites AutomatedOutlet.com is a CT favorite and if you contact them they'll give you a special CT Friends discount. HomeControls.com is another I've used and like (they have a great catalog too!).

If you think automation may be in your future, run lots of motions - they're the single most likely cause of false alarms, so having extra sensors covering close by areas and using cross zoning (where two have to trip in order for an alarm condition) can basically eliminate the falses they always cause.

Also as said above - consider glass-breaks. If someone breaks a window and doesn't open it, it'll never catch them - and if it's at night when your motions are off, you'll never know they're there until they're inside. It's always best to stop them before they even enter.

 

[TheEther]

Great point on closets for automation. I hadnt thought of that.

What glass break sensors and motion sensors should I consider for use with the Elk M1G?

I may need help on motion placement. What guidelines should I follow?

 

[Del91574]

I use DS/Bosch DS835I's and Visonic Gtech's personally, with as close to zero callbacks as you can get for falses. I've used Visonic Spy series devices if I need a PIR for automation purposes. I personally don't like the clutter of tons of motions when used for automation and security, so I've used SureAction puslors instead. YMMV.

I've found, at least in my own personal house, that I have no problem with RF (micra's) for the closet doors. Generally speaking, the largest item I have issues with on RF devices, especially with paying accounts, is battery life, which isn't too much of concern for a closet that isn't usually opened/closed as much.

If you have the budget, having the screens wired for the alarm is far better than a simple contact and glassbreak.

 

[TheEther]

Great point on the screens.. So, if screen sensors are out (cant drill the vinyl) would it make sense for me to do motions and glass break then just leave the window contact sensors out altogether? For the GB sensors, what size area will they cover? Are there any radius, obstruction, directional consideration for the GB sensors I should consider? I see a lot of comments on false positive coming from Motions Sensors also, are they a bad move? I think I've gone into full analysis paralysis and realize that while I have no issue with the cabling, and technical alarm system setup I'm not trained in proper placement of sensors.. I'm just looking to give a reliable layer or protection beyond a normal residential ADT type of security layout for my family. If I had more time, I could read and figure it all out but time is very short I'm a bit out of my element. (sorry folks) Great information so far though, and definitely helping me weed this list down.. If anyone would like to take a glance over my house layout to be sure I'm not making some bonehead move, I'd be happy email it..

Also, when running my sensor cables, are there any inductance issues in following the electrical wiring? I'm planning on home running most of it and it'd be nice to cut down on the drilling if possible.

Many Thanks again..

 

[tmbrown97]

Personally I would always keep the window contact sensors - Some thieves break windows, others just pry them open. Also, they help you remember not to leave windows open allowing totally opportunistic thieves to climb right in.

For motions - They seem to be a necessary evil in most situations. They're your last line of defense in protecting your home (they're already inside at that point, which is really not good!) - and they'll also cause more false alarms than anything else. But, if someone uses a glass cutter and climbs in a window and the glassbreaks don't get them, you generally want that last line of defense. They're handy for automation as well.

I've also seen a situation where a home was a little older and the owner didn't realize that a window contact wasn't working until he went to leave one day - with a window open, and the system didn't tell him... he was quite surprised when he returned to see his screen cut/tampered with and window wide open with the alarm not triggered (had his motions turned off because of cats). That's when he figured out the older contact was stuck.

 

[Del91574]

Without seeing the floorplan and layout, the best I can say is go look at the install directions for the devices I threw out there, Bosch and Visonic. 95% of the time, those devices will not need to be adjusted (visonic self-adjusts and the bosch....well they just work). The Bosch, for example, will ignore multiple cats and up to a 100# dog, or 2 60# dogs if installed properly.

The best way to approach security is to contact the full perimeter and then have interior protection as a redundancy. Motions, while not foolproof, when installed and adjusted properly don't false. Simple things like sealing the cable entry points down to using a quality detector come into play. When a detector costs (at trade distributors) $10 compared to a $40 detector, you tell me what's the difference between a marketing plan. Sometimes you even need to mask off sections of a motion, they don't need to see everything in a room, sometimes it's just a shot down each wall with windows/doors (if that makes sense)

As a pro, that has seen multiple intrusion attempts, successful or not, a glass cutter has never been a tool seen anywhere outside of the movies. I have, however, seen a chainsaw taken to the outside of a garage, as with shared interior walls and even the steel of a commercial warehouse type building removed to gain entry. Communications cut to a panel, yes, but someone taking all that time to defeat/disable an alarm is a rare occurance compared to a smash/grab.

 

[mikejrc]

also for perimeter (outside) protection i would recommend this 2.

http://www.optexamerica.com/productpage.aspx?l1=2&l2=9&id=252

http://www.optexamerica.com/productpage.aspx?l1=2&l2=9&id=10

dont worry so much about motions, Work2Play has an excellent point on that. Worry about stopping the bad guys as far as possible from the interior of your home.

 

[Del91574]

Ick.