HAI Omni Pro II with Onq ALC

charliebarns

Active Member
Well I'm finally getting around to this integration. We've been in the house 4 months now and I have a few switches I'd like to automate, get a feel for them and then put my huge switch order together (80 switches) and complete the job. I already have 4 enhanced branch hubs and the 4 branch HAI <-> ALC interface. On my Omni Pro I have 2 hardwired expanders in place where the ALC interface is supposed to go. If I've read it correctly I can add the ALC interface on top of the expanders and assign it Address 3, which I've done. Currently I only have one switch hooked up directly to the branch (no enhanced hub yet) and I've assigned expansion unit #3 to ALC, and Unit 1 to the switch (address set to 1). I have a flashing status on the ALC interface showing it's operating normally. The problem, however, is I can't control the switch. Sending an Off command to unit 1 does nothing, and the activity LED on the ALC interface does not flash as it is supposed to. The documentation on this integration is sparse (at least, I can't find any). Can anyone shed some light on this?


Thanks

CB

edit: the problem may lie in the definition of Unit type (House Code Format) in PC Access. There are many lighting technologies to choose from in this dropdown, however, ALC is not one of them..... strange....
 
Well I'm finally getting around to this integration. We've been in the house 4 months now and I have a few switches I'd like to automate, get a feel for them and then put my huge switch order together (80 switches) and complete the job. I already have 4 enhanced branch hubs and the 4 branch HAI <-> ALC interface. On my Omni Pro I have 2 hardwired expanders in place where the ALC interface is supposed to go. If I've read it correctly I can add the ALC interface on top of the expanders and assign it Address 3, which I've done. Currently I only have one switch hooked up directly to the branch (no enhanced hub yet) and I've assigned expansion unit #3 to ALC, and Unit 1 to the switch (address set to 1). I have a flashing status on the ALC interface showing it's operating normally. The problem, however, is I can't control the switch. Sending an Off command to unit 1 does nothing, and the activity LED on the ALC interface does not flash as it is supposed to. The documentation on this integration is sparse (at least, I can't find any). Can anyone shed some light on this?


Thanks

CB

edit: the problem may lie in the definition of Unit type (House Code Format) in PC Access. There are many lighting technologies to choose from in this dropdown, however, ALC is not one of them..... strange....


Make sure you Omni is not configured for UPB lighting (which is the default for units).
Next you must set the Expansion boards jumber. Any unused of the four available will work, just use one not in use with your expansion boards already..
Next go to the keypad (not PCaccess) and from installer access select expansion and make the ALC scene interface match the jumper in the step above (and save your change).
Next make Pcacess match, then test.

If still not working, read the polling loop. It should be between 3 and 4.2 volts. If it's lower you have wires crossed.

Good Luck.

TS
 
Well I'm finally getting around to this integration. We've been in the house 4 months now and I have a few switches I'd like to automate, get a feel for them and then put my huge switch order together (80 switches) and complete the job. I already have 4 enhanced branch hubs and the 4 branch HAI <-> ALC interface. On my Omni Pro I have 2 hardwired expanders in place where the ALC interface is supposed to go. If I've read it correctly I can add the ALC interface on top of the expanders and assign it Address 3, which I've done. Currently I only have one switch hooked up directly to the branch (no enhanced hub yet) and I've assigned expansion unit #3 to ALC, and Unit 1 to the switch (address set to 1). I have a flashing status on the ALC interface showing it's operating normally. The problem, however, is I can't control the switch. Sending an Off command to unit 1 does nothing, and the activity LED on the ALC interface does not flash as it is supposed to. The documentation on this integration is sparse (at least, I can't find any). Can anyone shed some light on this?


Thanks

CB

edit: the problem may lie in the definition of Unit type (House Code Format) in PC Access. There are many lighting technologies to choose from in this dropdown, however, ALC is not one of them..... strange....


Make sure you Omni is not configured for UPB lighting (which is the default for units).
Next you must set the Expansion boards jumber. Any unused of the four available will work, just use one not in use with your expansion boards already..
Next go to the keypad (not PCaccess) and from installer access select expansion and make the ALC scene interface match the jumper in the step above (and save your change).
Next make Pcacess match, then test.

If still not working, read the polling loop. It should be between 3 and 4.2 volts. If it's lower you have wires crossed.

Good Luck.

TS


Hi Tony,

Thanks for the reply. The units (House Code Format) was set to HLC, but in the drop down there is no option for ALC. Expansion board jumper set to 3, set to 3 from console, and verified it is set to 3 under PC Access. Firmware 3.2, PCAccess 3.2.

I'm not sure what to set the units to if ALC isn't an option....

CB
 
Well I'm finally getting around to this integration. We've been in the house 4 months now and I have a few switches I'd like to automate, get a feel for them and then put my huge switch order together (80 switches) and complete the job. I already have 4 enhanced branch hubs and the 4 branch HAI <-> ALC interface. On my Omni Pro I have 2 hardwired expanders in place where the ALC interface is supposed to go. If I've read it correctly I can add the ALC interface on top of the expanders and assign it Address 3, which I've done. Currently I only have one switch hooked up directly to the branch (no enhanced hub yet) and I've assigned expansion unit #3 to ALC, and Unit 1 to the switch (address set to 1). I have a flashing status on the ALC interface showing it's operating normally. The problem, however, is I can't control the switch. Sending an Off command to unit 1 does nothing, and the activity LED on the ALC interface does not flash as it is supposed to. The documentation on this integration is sparse (at least, I can't find any). Can anyone shed some light on this?


Thanks

CB

edit: the problem may lie in the definition of Unit type (House Code Format) in PC Access. There are many lighting technologies to choose from in this dropdown, however, ALC is not one of them..... strange....


Make sure you Omni is not configured for UPB lighting (which is the default for units).
Next you must set the Expansion boards jumber. Any unused of the four available will work, just use one not in use with your expansion boards already..
Next go to the keypad (not PCaccess) and from installer access select expansion and make the ALC scene interface match the jumper in the step above (and save your change).
Next make Pcacess match, then test.

If still not working, read the polling loop. It should be between 3 and 4.2 volts. If it's lower you have wires crossed.

Good Luck.

TS


Hi Tony,

Thanks for the reply. The units (House Code Format) was set to HLC, but in the drop down there is no option for ALC. Expansion board jumper set to 3, set to 3 from console, and verified it is set to 3 under PC Access. Firmware 3.2, PCAccess 3.2.

I'm not sure what to set the units to if ALC isn't an option....

CB

When using ALC, select "Extended" from the list of available lighting types.

Also note that any unused address can then be used by X-10 devices if you desire. Don't be confused and think that ALC has anything to do with X-10. It does not, but the same setting of "Extended" will work for both types.

Hope this helps - God Bless
TS
 
Ok so after messing around with settings I found I am able to control the switch Assigned as Unit1 by setting the House Code Format to standard. In PC Access under lighting scenes is it possible to define lighting scenes here for ALC switches? If so then the ability to control the switches would be available in snaplink. The only options, however, under Scenes are:

Leviton DHC
RadioRA
UPB
Centralite
HLC
Z-Wave.


CB
 
Ok so after messing around with settings I found I am able to control the switch Assigned as Unit1 by setting the House Code Format to standard. In PC Access under lighting scenes is it possible to define lighting scenes here for ALC switches? If so then the ability to control the switches would be available in snaplink. The only options, however, under Scenes are:

Leviton DHC
RadioRA
UPB
Centralite
HLC
Z-Wave.


CB


Standard or Extended will both work. Select Extended if you will ever use the top line of PLC switches like those from OnQ called PLC (best line of X-10). As for as PLC, I am able to make this level of switches work 100% of the time (despite what people say about X-10). In addition to ALC, I have 55 of these OnQ PLC switches in my own home with zero problems. I am slowly changing out PLC locations for ALC in places where I want two way communication (for example, to know when a light has been manually turned on). But I have no plans to change locations that I will not use for occupancy sensing (based on the on/off status of a light). PLC works great when a two way switch is not needed and can be blended into my program nicely.

As for scenes, you get to the ALC scenes in a different way. In your program select as a trigger "When ALC" and then choose on/off, 1,2,3, or 4. 1-4 are ALC scenes for that particular 4 button scene switch.

Understand that the ALC 4 button scene switches require NO programming in the OMNI to do scenes. You simply hold in the desrired button for 15 seconds and when it begins to flash it is ready to learn any ALC settings from any switch you set On/OFF/Dim/Bright). When done selecting light settings press the button again and that scene will run anytime you press that button. This is great for setting up a scene quickly and making changes on the fly. However, these type scenes are not learned by the Omni.

If you want to run the same scenes from program flow, you must create lines of code that do the same thing.

Another tool to have on hand is Branchtech software and the ALC Branchtech serial interface. I use this combination of hardware and software to test every install as I make connections. Once I am sure everything is wired right and working, I move that ALC branch over to the 4 branch interface.

God Bless
TS
 
I don't see the polling loop #s under status control, just what's in this image:

View attachment 2821

You should read the polling loop with a DC voltmeter at the branch interface in question (which branch of the 4). If it's low, remove the wiring and start tracing which switch(s) has the two wire polling loop wired backwards. This is when the enhanced branch hub really comes in handy.

TS
 
How are you Tony,

So when you stated
As for scenes, you get to the ALC scenes in a different way. In your program select as a trigger "When ALC" and then choose on/off, 1,2,3, or 4. 1-4 are ALC scenes for that particular 4 button scene switch.

and

However, these type scenes are not learned by the Omni. If you want to run the same scenes from program flow, you must create lines of code that do the same thing.

So to be clear, one goes and programs their scenes via a ALC 4 button Scene switch, by placing the ALC 4 button Scene switch on a BRANCH (as it will not see or control switches on other branches correct?) they wish to create up to 4 scenes with any combination of 30 lights on this branch as the scene switch takes up one address itself (31 addresses on a branch) but when you go to the OPII programming and you have a line like "WHEN ALC SW1 PRESSED", the controller knows this becasue it polled that it was pressed (ON) and then you can have it do something additional like close curtains, but it will not set the lighting, it is the Scene Switch itself that set the lighting scene. Also to run the same scene from program flow (if you programmed one to do the same at the scene button), it would be executed by a TRIGGER other than the scene switch correct? as if you applyed the programming as the SW1 pressed, it would be a waste of line code, because both the scene button and the program would call on the same lighting commands, is this correct?

And to add to this you must have a 1 or 4 ALC branch interface in order to be able to
You simply hold in the desrired button for 15 seconds and when it begins to flash it is ready to learn any ALC settings from any switch you set On/OFF/Dim/Bright). When done selecting light settings press the button again and that scene will run anytime you press that button. This is great for setting up a scene quickly and making changes on the fly. However, these type scenes are not learned by the Omni.
as it is not the scene switch itself that learns the scene, but the ALC branch interface and assigns the scene to that scene switch button. Is this statement correct?

In the "Extended" House Code Format, you have the following Unit Commands:
Off
On
Toggle
Dim
Brighten
Light Level
Ramp

Are these all ALC compliant Commands? Some behave weird, for a lack of better words. Like if you send a control manually to set Light Level 40% you get 39% after exection. Via programming block you get 40%? Just wanted to know your experiences/knowledge.

I am learning HA, and knowledge is key, I want to make sure I am understanding ALC correctly as well. And ALC integration with HAI.
 
SEE ANSWERS BELOW.........

How are you Tony,

So when you stated
As for scenes, you get to the ALC scenes in a different way. In your program select as a trigger "When ALC" and then choose on/off, 1,2,3, or 4. 1-4 are ALC scenes for that particular 4 button scene switch.

and

However, these type scenes are not learned by the Omni. If you want to run the same scenes from program flow, you must create lines of code that do the same thing.

So to be clear, one goes and programs their scenes via a ALC 4 button Scene switch, by placing the ALC 4 button Scene switch on a BRANCH (as it will not see or control switches on other branches correct?) they wish to create up to 4 scenes with any combination of 30 lights on this branch as the scene switch takes up one address itself (31 addresses on a branch)
YOU CAN ACTUALLY ADD ANY ALC SWITCH, NOT JUST THE ONES ON THE SAME BRANCH. THE 248 LIMIT ON THE OMNI PRO II IS 2 EACH 4 BRANCH CONTROLLERS FOR A TOTAL OF 248 TOTAL ALC DEVICES.

but when you go to the OPII programming and you have a line like "WHEN ALC SW1 PRESSED", the controller knows this becasue it polled that it was pressed (ON) and then you can have it do something additional like close curtains, but it will not set the lighting, it is the Scene Switch itself that set the lighting scene.
NOT EXACTLY. THE LOCAL PROGRAMMING OF SCENES DOES NOT REQUIRE ANY LINES OF PROGRAMMING IN THE OPII, BUT YOU CAN ALSO WRITE RULES THAT TRIGGER LIGHTS AND CLOSE CURTAINS. JUST BE CAUTIOUS OF CONFLICTS WITH LIGHTING WHEN DOING BOTH TYPES OF PROGRAMMING....

Also to run the same scene from program flow (if you programmed one to do the same at the scene button), it would be executed by a TRIGGER other than the scene switch correct? as if you applyed the programming as the SW1 pressed, it would be a waste of line code, because both the scene button and the program would call on the same lighting commands, is this correct?
TRUE. THE BEST USE OF LOCAL SCENE PROGRAMMING IS FOR USE BY THE HOMEOWNER TO PROGRAM SCENES WITHOUT ANY PC PROGRAMMING REQUIRED. AGAIN, IF BE CAUTIOUS OF CONFLICTS WITH RULES YOU WRITE.

And to add to this you must have a 1 or 4 ALC branch interface in order to be able to
You simply hold in the desrired button for 15 seconds and when it begins to flash it is ready to learn any ALC settings from any switch you set On/OFF/Dim/Bright). When done selecting light settings press the button again and that scene will run anytime you press that button. This is great for setting up a scene quickly and making changes on the fly. However, these type scenes are not learned by the Omni.
as it is not the scene switch itself that learns the scene, but the ALC branch interface and assigns the scene to that scene switch button. Is this statement correct?
TRUE. ALSO NOTE THAT THE ALC BRANCH INTERFACE WE MAKE IS CALLED THE "SCENE LEARNING INTERFACE" AND WILL BEHAVE AS DESCRIBED ABOVE. THERE IS ALSO ANOTHER ONE THAT WAS MADE BY HAI (AND OLDER ONES MADE BY OnQ) THAT DO NOT LEARN SCENES.

TO TELL THEM APART LOOK AT THE COLOR OF THE PRINTED CIRCUIT BOARD ITSELF. A BLACK BOARD IS A SCENE LEARNING INTERFACE A GREEN ONE IS NOT.


In the "Extended" House Code Format, you have the following Unit Commands:
Off
On
Toggle
Dim
Brighten
Light Level
Ramp

Are these all ALC compliant Commands? Some behave weird, for a lack of better words. Like if you send a control manually to set Light Level 40% you get 39% after exection. Via programming block you get 40%? Just wanted to know your experiences/knowledge.

YES THESE ARE ALL USED. AND WE ALSO HAVE A "RAMP" FEATURE THAT CAN BE USED TO LINEARLY AND VERY GRADUALLY RAISE OR LOWER THE DIMMING LEVEL.

I am learning HA, and knowledge is key, I want to make sure I am understanding ALC correctly as well. And ALC integration with HAI.


GOD BLESS
TS
 
Many thanks for you wisdom :D

I understood everything but this one:
So to be clear, one goes and programs their scenes via a ALC 4 button Scene switch, by placing the ALC 4 button Scene switch on a BRANCH (as it will not see or control switches on other branches correct?) they wish to create up to 4 scenes with any combination of 30 lights on this branch as the scene switch takes up one address itself (31 addresses on a branch)
YOU CAN ACTUALLY ADD ANY ALC SWITCH, NOT JUST THE ONES ON THE SAME BRANCH. THE 248 LIMIT ON THE OMNI PRO II IS 2 EACH 4 BRANCH CONTROLLERS FOR A TOTAL OF 248 TOTAL ALC DEVICES.

So for my understanding, If you have only one 4 Branch Controller on a OPII and you are using lighting on all four branches. And you have a 4 Button Scene switch on Branch #1, and you place it into learning mode (a button on that switch to be exact) and you set light levels manually on ALC Dimmer switches that vary from Branch #1 through #4, that Scene switch CAN see all the Lighting Scenes you just manually set on 4 branches???. If that is the case that would be really great!!! I have not installed the scene switches yet, to have answered this question myself ;)

And if the answer is yes, and you had (2) 4 Branch Controllers on a OPII can the 1 Scene switch be programed to to see any switches on any of the 8 Branches, or is this where its per controller the Scene switch is on?

Also, before I forget, are the IR codes to the IR Scene switches available?
 
If all firmware is latest, then you should have no trouble talking across all branches.
As for IR codes, when we purchased the product line from OnQ they had no IR remotes in stock and no plans to remanufacture them. In addition the last engineer to knwo specifics had left the company resulting in a NO answer to your question. However...... I have learned that some users have searched through the library of all codes and located the correct one. I think it was in the group of codes called home automation but I can't say for sure. Let me know if you figure it out.

Thanks
TS
 
Thanks for the reply and info Number20

My ALC switches are all ver. 1.7, no issues with talking across all branches?

Does the OnQ AU1060 remote contain the IR codes for the ALC Scene Switches, as I can find much detial about it (The On-Q Remote features whole house commands which control all keypads from one location. It controls the lyriQ Audio System, as well as other On-Q systems.)

Or is the 364820-01 remote the only one with the IR codes programmed in it.

I dont really need the remote, would be great if someone can share the codes, but if I have to pick up a remote in order to obtain, I have no problem with that. If anyone has either remote and can chime in that would be great.

Nubmer20, do you have any recommendations (web links) to IR databases I can search. I try Logitech at http://myremotesetup.com/EasyZapper/New/Main.asp dont see anything under Legrand/OnQ/ALC ;)
 
1.7 IS THE LATEST. What about the firmware on your OPII?

Can't advise on the IR codes but can say that there is no dedicated OnQ legrand IR code. Instead it is a generic code that is probably used by dozens of people and products covering a wide range of IR remotes. For example the IR code for the ALC scene switches may also be the same as the IR code for a TV or a DVD player etc.

In addition, if you have the patience you can search through ALL IR codes until you find the one that will work. I would start in the grouping of codes specially used for Home Automation and then try other groups of codes next (like the one for the X-10 remote control).

One day, I will dig into this deeper and come up with the exact answer, but today I can't seem to find enough hours in the day.

Good Luck
TS
 
Thanks Tony!

My OPII currently at 3.3a

Thank you for the suggestions. I will let you know if I discover the 4 codes, have a feeling you will before me. I agree a bit time consuming. :)
 
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