Help getting started with UPB

[Steve]

Ok, I think we are in agreement you just need to read my posts a little more carefully.

I said "And some of the things mentioned like "Motion can turn up lighting if they are dimmed then go back down after a certain amount of time." is not possible without a PIR and controller, the timer module alone can't react to motion."

You replied "Steve, you may be talking about the feature set with the Simply Automated Timer. I am using the timer from Web Mtn and it definitely can do what I have mentioned, if you use wireless devices that communicate back to a receiver with contact closures. The I/O ties in there and events can happen."

I am talking about the TIM-01-A. So my point was using the timer by itself. You are talking about using the DXT-54 PIR with either the CM-01 I/O module or DXR-702 receiver. We are saying the same thing. You are simply pointing out a less expensive solution to do some very simple stuff which is fine. But even with the CM01 or DX wireless you are still very limited compared to something like an Elk. For somebody that doesn't need or want more sophisticated automation and simply needs some motion or simple limited I/O, yes, your solution works fine, but still doesn't support enough functionality that the OP (and many other) would want.

I am not sure where the 99.9% failure comes from, UPB is much more reliable than that

Again, I never said that, read my post more carefully <_<

I said "Sure, unless the switches downright fail, its usually not a crisis if a light does not respond to automation but you sure get used to it and will cuss alot when it doesn't work 99.9% of the time." I did not say UPB has a 99.9% failure rate, any product with a failure rate like that would not last a month in the market. The point was if your system/lighting does not work 99.9% of the time, you will be frustrated, therefore IMHO you may be better served by a hardware panel solution (or pure UPB products as you have mentioned).

So, lets return this to the original point, we have gone back and forth enough essentially agreeing

 

[EST]

Thanks for all the input. That's why I like this forum...each has their own way to skin a cat. I have the Elk and everything I have done is toward using that as my primary HA controller. Steve, I do plan to use the Elk and the M1XSP with UPB. My rules will be applied to Mission Critical events like Security, HVAC and some lighting. I will use CQC as an interface to the Elk and also to do some other logic events (non mission critical).

Steve, back to an earlier comment...I did not order a PCS switch to test b/c of the expense. Knowing they are better of the bunch, I would want them and not give the others a shot. For the amount I need it would be an extra $1000 to go with the PCS switches (as compared to SA prices). If I find I like Web Mtn better (if I can tell a difference b/t them and SA without a CIM as of yet) I may try out a PCS b/c there was only a $200 difference b/t those two. I completely missed your comment about the SA and Web Mtn switches. I will see if there is a difference in feel b/t the two. Web Mountain cancelled my order today (go an email from UPS) w/o an explanation...will have to check in on that. I want to get a feel for each and see. Since I did not order a PCS...is it's feel like SA or HAI? I prefer the traditional click of a switch as opposed to the mushy feel of HAI.

Thanks

 

[Steve]

The PCS switch is more of a click like SAI than HAI. The web mountain hardware is IDENTICAL to SAI. Web Mountain takes the SAI switches and loads their own firmware, so the feel will be exactly the same.

 

[kwilcox]

My $.02: The SAI serial PIM has a noticeably faster response time than the PCS USB pim. It wasn't caused by the interface either as I convert serial to USB in my installation. I've not had a need for Gen II features. Gen I was designed to be very immune to noise and I have good signal strength everywhere in the house. I have had zero reliability issues with SAI switches which feel and look great. I toasted one when I wired it in hot in defiance of the installation instructions. I know better now. Plug-in modules have been a different story though. I've had 2 UMI-32 failures and two lamp module failures so far.

 

[Steve]

I have not seen any difference that I can remember between a serial SAI or PCS PIM, I'll have to look more carefully, but they are both serial. My install is living proof that noise CAN change. When I first started I had 0 noise and things were beautiful - no coupler or anything and life was good. Then we got this stupid cooktop which spews alot of noise. Thankfully its not on often when there is UPB traffic. Then I got this fancy variable speed pool pump without thinking and that always produces quite a bit of noise at times. Configured properly, Gen II does work better at higher noise levels, but there are tradeoffs. Also, I may be in the vast minority but I've had SAI switches die on me twice. Of course everyone thinks it was some sort of 'event' on the powerline, but the switches were scattered on many circuits and nothing else in the house was affected at all. So personally, I am a little gun shy of SAI at this point and am doing mostly PCS with new stuff. When you really look at the switch they are better made (also US vs China) and they are more easily configurable IMHO. My circumstances may be unique and I am not criticizing SAI at all, its just I feel PCS is worth the shot for me at this point. But yes, there is a $30 premium per switch, but I don't have dozens of them and they do have a 5 year vs 2 year warranty which given my history, may make all the difference.

 

[LightenUP]

Steve, I appreciate the time you spent clearing up the differences between our posts. I conceed that the experience you have is much more broad than mine. I was sharing how things can be done with minimal expense.

I need to get into these panel systems that most of you use. I haven't had the pleasure yet. It seems like they offer alot of flexibility for instace the "Mission Critical". Conditional logic I would assume that means.

Anyway, thanks for your comments.