how should I wire for lighting and HA, to keep options open
- Thread starter capall
- Start date
picta said:
That's so true, however wireless is only better than wired for portable devices, anything that does not have to move is better wired.
I ran a 60" LCD on wifi for a while and it streamed smoothly but I'm betting that the image lost a lot of quality due to data compression. It is wired now.
Mike.
pete_c
Guru
Have used Direct TV here for over 20 years in the Midwest with no issues relating to snow. Compression on satellite has always been an issue where the picture was never that good in the SD and today in the HD days.
Best HD picture source for television is OTA.
Today ISP only provides internet and VOIP.
I have never used wireless anything in this home for media except for Amazon stuff. (there are NO dependencies though on Amazon).
Here too purchased a new 4K LCD TV with Roku recently and it works fine.
Using an AVR for the KODI box and Direct TV box (DVR). Blue Ray player is connected to AVR but mostly off mode.
Antenna is plugged in to the TV for OTA which works fine. (antenna today goes to LCD TVs and HDHomerun tuners).
All Gb wired with no issues today. (phones and tablets are mostly in off mode and still use my floating laptops connected to the wire (put network connections everywhere here)).
Relating to automation, security, media I have no dependencies here on anything wireless (whatever medium or topology) or the Internet or the cloud or wireless remote control (smartphones or tablets). I am though not tethered to my cell phones or tablets and these devices are mostly in the off state unless I am out of the house.
Relating to light switches here have evolved from X10 (1970's) to Insteon to UPB today.
Best HD picture source for television is OTA.
Today ISP only provides internet and VOIP.
I have never used wireless anything in this home for media except for Amazon stuff. (there are NO dependencies though on Amazon).
Here too purchased a new 4K LCD TV with Roku recently and it works fine.
Using an AVR for the KODI box and Direct TV box (DVR). Blue Ray player is connected to AVR but mostly off mode.
Antenna is plugged in to the TV for OTA which works fine. (antenna today goes to LCD TVs and HDHomerun tuners).
All Gb wired with no issues today. (phones and tablets are mostly in off mode and still use my floating laptops connected to the wire (put network connections everywhere here)).
Relating to automation, security, media I have no dependencies here on anything wireless (whatever medium or topology) or the Internet or the cloud or wireless remote control (smartphones or tablets). I am though not tethered to my cell phones or tablets and these devices are mostly in the off state unless I am out of the house.
Relating to light switches here have evolved from X10 (1970's) to Insteon to UPB today.
A 1080P signal uses about 5Mbps and 4K uses around 20-25Mbps. 802.11ac can, in theory run at 866 Mbps, but even if is 300 or 400Mbps, your not going to have any problem.
I pay for 20 Mbps Internet, and have never had the slightest problem steaming 4K material on my Roku over Wi-Fi.
There is a new Wi-Fi standard now, 802.11ad that can run speeds of up to 4.6Gbps. If your wired Ethernet can provide a speed of 4.6Gbps, please provide us with the details.
I pay for 20 Mbps Internet, and have never had the slightest problem steaming 4K material on my Roku over Wi-Fi.
There is a new Wi-Fi standard now, 802.11ad that can run speeds of up to 4.6Gbps. If your wired Ethernet can provide a speed of 4.6Gbps, please provide us with the details.
pete_c
Guru
The issue with wireless is propagation and that is the same when first introduced. It is better today than it was.
Specifications for wireless are typically what it can do but seldom seen in real environments.
With the introduction of the Roku TV it is the first time I have connected my television to the internet and I am not sure if I like this. The Roku OS does manage the TV though. I can shut it off whenever.
10Gb managed switches are around the corner and will work fine with Cat6. (and short runs of Cat5e ~ 100 feet).
Wireless here is two worlds...tinkering (whatever) and production (Ubiquiti).
HA here is also in two worlds...tinkering (multiple HA boxes - hubs) and production - sure bet automation that always works.
Audio and visual media is the same with tinkering and production sure bet stuff that works 100% of the time.
Security and CCTV is the also the same with tinkering and production that works 100% of the time.
It is the same with automation using X10, UPB, ZWave and Zigbee (and Insteon at one time).
Specifications for wireless are typically what it can do but seldom seen in real environments.
With the introduction of the Roku TV it is the first time I have connected my television to the internet and I am not sure if I like this. The Roku OS does manage the TV though. I can shut it off whenever.
10Gb managed switches are around the corner and will work fine with Cat6. (and short runs of Cat5e ~ 100 feet).
Wireless here is two worlds...tinkering (whatever) and production (Ubiquiti).
HA here is also in two worlds...tinkering (multiple HA boxes - hubs) and production - sure bet automation that always works.
Audio and visual media is the same with tinkering and production sure bet stuff that works 100% of the time.
Security and CCTV is the also the same with tinkering and production that works 100% of the time.
It is the same with automation using X10, UPB, ZWave and Zigbee (and Insteon at one time).
I pre-wired my house in the boonies with miles of cabling. Two RG6 and two Cat5 to each drop, 64 drops total in a 4000sf house. Phones in the bathroom? Check. Never used those drops. Printer in a closet? Check. I used one of ten. The only uses I found for Coax was to the front door camera, satellite dish for TV, and satellite dish for internet - and the internet dish didn't work out because the receiver needed to be much closer to the dish to maximize signal quality and it used Cat5 from there. I worked from home and had a bunch of computers in my office but nowhere else. Had some floor drops in the living room we used for laptops, and a couple in the basement for the automation system. So most of my pre-wire work was wasted. Used ALC for lighting with a twisted pair to each wall switch.
We're building another house now. UPB lighting so no hard wires there. I won't run anywhere near as many drops, maybe 12 in the entire 4000sf house and 2000sf shop and almost no RG6 - a little for a satellite dish prewire but I doubt if we'll ever install one. We're now using a mesh WiFi router (Linksys Velop) with outstanding results and will rely on WiFi for most functions. If a device needs hard wired ethernet, and is located away from a drop, a WiFi access point will work fine, no need to drag a cable to a switch across the room. Printers are all WiFi. TVs are WiFi (but I will put a hard drop by those anyway). With Sonos audio I don't even need much in the way of A/V and speaker wires anymore. Mesh router nodes are WiFi, they just need AC power. Most of my pre-wire effort will be for security and PoE surveillance cams rather than for computers and entertainment. Heck, with Sonos speakers I don't even need speaker wires anymore.
We're building another house now. UPB lighting so no hard wires there. I won't run anywhere near as many drops, maybe 12 in the entire 4000sf house and 2000sf shop and almost no RG6 - a little for a satellite dish prewire but I doubt if we'll ever install one. We're now using a mesh WiFi router (Linksys Velop) with outstanding results and will rely on WiFi for most functions. If a device needs hard wired ethernet, and is located away from a drop, a WiFi access point will work fine, no need to drag a cable to a switch across the room. Printers are all WiFi. TVs are WiFi (but I will put a hard drop by those anyway). With Sonos audio I don't even need much in the way of A/V and speaker wires anymore. Mesh router nodes are WiFi, they just need AC power. Most of my pre-wire effort will be for security and PoE surveillance cams rather than for computers and entertainment. Heck, with Sonos speakers I don't even need speaker wires anymore.
spinjockey
New Member
I'm most the way through rewiring a small 1939 rancher (1200 sqft also in Bay Area). We didn't go down to the studs but replaced all the switches and most of the electrical outlets (getting rid of knob and tube). No insulation in the walls but fire block/cross bracing and lath and plaster everywhere.
For electrical I put deep plastic boxes with neutrals (e.g. nothing special). I have a bunch of left of insteon switches and an ISY-994 from my prior house. I wired a few switches 3 way so when I sell I can pull the switches out and replace with standard switches.
Additionally I set everything up for 1 gang per switch so I don't have to put wire-in remotes (I think only UPB has a dual switch). Note that I'll pull everything out and put normal switches back in before I sell (as most buyers don't want automated switches).
I've overdone the ethernet drops (3 spots per room) but every drop was 2 or 4 runs to a central closet. I have a bunch of wired devices (a few printers, solar gateway, microcell, a few desktops, tivo extenders, etc) also prepping for 802.11ad (60ghz) which will probably require one room per super fast router.
Cat 6a was 4x the price of Cat 5e so that's all I ran. Most HDMI video blams I checked will transmit 1080p over one cat 6a or two cat 5e runs. If it's digital then ethernet or wireless is fine. If I have to rip it all out in a few years there's only a few places that might be tough to get to but with a crawlspace and attic I'm not too worried.
Only ran RG6 quad shield to wiring closet and a AV center. If needed I can fish it to a few other places but not planning on it as I'm using cable and tivo extenders (ethernet)
The biggest issue was getting the old switch boxes out and had a cut a 3 extra holes for fishing in the whole house. The point is unless it's a flat roof on a slab you'll probably be able to rewire w/o too many holes so don't worry about it too much.
For electrical I put deep plastic boxes with neutrals (e.g. nothing special). I have a bunch of left of insteon switches and an ISY-994 from my prior house. I wired a few switches 3 way so when I sell I can pull the switches out and replace with standard switches.
Additionally I set everything up for 1 gang per switch so I don't have to put wire-in remotes (I think only UPB has a dual switch). Note that I'll pull everything out and put normal switches back in before I sell (as most buyers don't want automated switches).
I've overdone the ethernet drops (3 spots per room) but every drop was 2 or 4 runs to a central closet. I have a bunch of wired devices (a few printers, solar gateway, microcell, a few desktops, tivo extenders, etc) also prepping for 802.11ad (60ghz) which will probably require one room per super fast router.
Cat 6a was 4x the price of Cat 5e so that's all I ran. Most HDMI video blams I checked will transmit 1080p over one cat 6a or two cat 5e runs. If it's digital then ethernet or wireless is fine. If I have to rip it all out in a few years there's only a few places that might be tough to get to but with a crawlspace and attic I'm not too worried.
Only ran RG6 quad shield to wiring closet and a AV center. If needed I can fish it to a few other places but not planning on it as I'm using cable and tivo extenders (ethernet)
The biggest issue was getting the old switch boxes out and had a cut a 3 extra holes for fishing in the whole house. The point is unless it's a flat roof on a slab you'll probably be able to rewire w/o too many holes so don't worry about it too much.