Monitoring worth it??

[Jreigner]

Tell you what, for half of what everyone pays these half-ass internet based monitoring stations, ill call your house every day and tell you everything is alright so you can sleep better.

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

So you are an installer AND run an UL Rated Monitoring station. Wow - you really are like a God!

The fact is that NextAlarm uses UL Rated Monitoring stations. That UL Rating is extremely hard to get and provides lots of guidelines to prevent problems. While I'm sure you know the UL Rating requirements by heart, here is a brief overview of what the UL Rating means.

A "Listed central station" is an alarm monitoring facility that has demonstrated the ability to provide Standards-complying service. For monitoring stations, UL requirements cover building structure, receiving and monitoring equipment, and staffing issues in addition to installation and ongoing service. To be able to provide Standards-complying service, the building, equipment and staffing requirements have to be met at all times. However, the handling of specific signals from specific alarm systems is only audited by UL if a certificate is in effect for that alarm system.

Here is the preinspection checklist that must be turned in prior to the two day inspection from the UL inspectors.

The fact that NextAlarm doesn't actually run their own non-UL rated monitoring station says to me that they are serious about the service. Anyone can open a monitoring station in their basement if they wanted (just as you must be doing), but providing a service that is actually UL Rated is a huge selling point.

Your first statement is rude and uncalled for. You have no idea what i do or know. But know I have an idea of what you know.

I am not an installer and i do not run a UL c/s. I have built one before and continue to manage it on a daily basis from a UL/IT stand point. "That UL Rating is extremely hard to get and provides lots of guidelines to prevent problems", Uh, yeah. there are not guidelines there are standards, not recommendations. don't post quotes from UL to me.

By the way," Anyone can open a monitoring station in their basement if they wanted (just as you must be doing), but providing a service that is actually UL Rated is a huge selling point." The monitoring company I am associated with is one of the top 90 grossing alarm companies in the country, I guess we should expand the basement right?

"The fact that NextAlarm doesn't actually run their own non-UL rated monitoring station says to me that they are serious about the service" are you high? what does that even mean? what nexalarm is apparently doing is running a cyber monitoring company when they have no physical means to do it. they farm it out to someone else and profit. I dont really now what part of carolina your in, but i would like you to show me a monitoring station which you would use that is not UL or required to be UL.

I have stated the facts about monitoring and I was backed by several others-including ADT customers. thank you.

 

[Digger]

WOW. Yet more confusion about central station monitoring. Here's what is on their website:
"NexAlarm.com alarm monitoring service in the United States is provided through two contracted third-party UL listed dispatch centers." NOT EVEN OWNED BY NEXALARM.

Nexalarm doesnt exist! it is a company which pushes your account to another central station(might even be ADT's!)the intent with a central station is to make the phone call to the police and fire department on time everytime, for you. BTW, oops:"The primary center for your account depends on your location. The other center will function as a backup in the event that your primary center is unable to respond." Unable to respond means- our workload is so high we cant even process you in real time so we waste more time by pushing your account- again- to some one who might call for help. SO......what happens when "Plan B" central station doesn't respond? Tell you what, for half of what everyone pays these half-ass internet based monitoring stations, ill call your house every day and tell you everything is alright so you can sleep better.

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

Not sure why you think that NextAlarm and other Central Stations are not providing "real service" (can you clarify)? You yourself said they might even be providing ADT (who knows). So NextAlarm is reselling someone else's service whats wrong with that? ADT is selling someone else's hardware when you get an ADT alarm installed in your house (same with Brinks and so many others). Nothing wrong with that if the hardware is reliable, functions correctly, is installed correctly and UL Listed.

As long as the Central Station is reliable, responsive, and UL Listed does it really matter who NextAlarm is reselling?

I have used NextAlarm for a few years. I have not had any issues with them but probably someone somewhere has. I can think of a few that have issues with the big name central stations also. Its the nature of the industry. As far as a primary and secondary central station that is no different then any other Central Station. UL requires a hot backup redundancy anyway in case of natural disaster etc taking out a central station. The fact that NextAlarm may have company A for primary and company B as the backup and vice/versa depending on the premise location should not be an issue (perhaps better in this economy in case one goes under). If the central station was "overloaded" as you say they would not meet the UL requirements and lose their certificate from UL. With today's technologies (TCP/IP, VOIP etc) a central station can be anywhere in the world.

For the record I worked for UL for 12 years. Many of those years I worked in the Security and Signaling Categories (fire and burglary equipment) and worked closely at times with the auditors for the Central Station Listings. I currently work for a few alarm system hardware manufacturers handling their agency (UL, ETL etc) compliance. The requirements for the hardware and software are tough but are so for a reason. The same goes with the requirements for the Central Stations. Not saying I am an "expert" but I have a decent amount of experience, enough at least to get a very large commercial system through UL in less than 25% of the time as one of our competitors it seems (they are under evaluation since November 2005 and not quite done and we are a third done in about 3 months or so now and picking up momentum). Part of the reason is that we designed in the compliance rather than did the compliance after the design was finished.

The UL Standards are similar to the electrical and fire codes (each open to some interpretation) and while compliance to the electrical and fire codes is no absolute assurance of safety neither is a UL or ETL Listing. But the reverse is also true. Just because a product is not UL or ETL Listed (or in compliance with the electrical and fire codes) is also not an absolute determination that it will not function correctly to protect life and property or be a safety hazard.

If Central Station monitoring is within someones budget it is another tool to maintain the safety and protection of life and property.

 

[Jreigner]

WOW. Yet more confusion about central station monitoring. Here's what is on their website:
"NexAlarm.com alarm monitoring service in the United States is provided through two contracted third-party UL listed dispatch centers." NOT EVEN OWNED BY NEXALARM.

Nexalarm doesnt exist! it is a company which pushes your account to another central station(might even be ADT's!)the intent with a central station is to make the phone call to the police and fire department on time everytime, for you. BTW, oops:"The primary center for your account depends on your location. The other center will function as a backup in the event that your primary center is unable to respond." Unable to respond means- our workload is so high we cant even process you in real time so we waste more time by pushing your account- again- to some one who might call for help. SO......what happens when "Plan B" central station doesn't respond? Tell you what, for half of what everyone pays these half-ass internet based monitoring stations, ill call your house every day and tell you everything is alright so you can sleep better.

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

Not sure why you think that NextAlarm and other Central Stations are not providing "real service" (can you clarify)? You yourself said they might even be providing ADT (who knows). So NextAlarm is reselling someone else's service whats wrong with that? ADT is selling someone else's hardware when you get an ADT alarm installed in your house (same with Brinks and so many others). Nothing wrong with that if the hardware is reliable, functions correctly, is installed correctly and UL Listed.

As long as the Central Station is reliable, responsive, and UL Listed does it really matter who NextAlarm is reselling?

I have used NextAlarm for a few years. I have not had any issues with them but probably someone somewhere has. I can think of a few that have issues with the big name central stations also. Its the nature of the industry. As far as a primary and secondary central station that is no different then any other Central Station. UL requires a hot backup redundancy anyway in case of natural disaster etc taking out a central station. The fact that NextAlarm may have company A for primary and company B as the backup and vice/versa depending on the premise location should not be an issue (perhaps better in this economy in case one goes under). If the central station was "overloaded" as you say they would not meet the UL requirements and lose their certificate from UL. With today's technologies (TCP/IP, VOIP etc) a central station can be anywhere in the world.

For the record I worked for UL for 12 years. Many of those years I worked in the Security and Signaling Categories (fire and burglary equipment) and worked closely at times with the auditors for the Central Station Listings. I currently work for a few alarm system hardware manufacturers handling their agency (UL, ETL etc) compliance. The requirements for the hardware and software are tough but are so for a reason. The same goes with the requirements for the Central Stations. Not saying I am an "expert" but I have a decent amount of experience, enough at least to get a very large commercial system through UL in less than 25% of the time as one of our competitors it seems (they are under evaluation since November 2005 and not quite done and we are a third done in about 3 months or so now and picking up momentum). Part of the reason is that we designed in the compliance rather than did the compliance after the design was finished.

The UL Standards are similar to the electrical and fire codes (each open to some interpretation) and while compliance to the electrical and fire codes is no absolute assurance of safety neither is a UL or ETL Listing. But the reverse is also true. Just because a product is not UL or ETL Listed (or in compliance with the electrical and fire codes) is also not an absolute determination that it will not function correctly to protect life and property or be a safety hazard.

If Central Station monitoring is within someones budget it is another tool to maintain the safety and protection of life and property.

Thank you for your insight from the c/s world. The point of the matter was wether monitoring from nexalarm (or insert monitoring station)was any better than having it call a cell, neighbor or sms and email a message. I have dealt with the yearly visit from UL for almost ten years. You of all people should know the short comings of central stations and how overloaded they become.

 

[sic0048]

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

Since you don't consider NextAlarm as a real solution, do you mind sharing a couple of examples of "real monitoring solutions" that you are referring to?

 

[Jreigner]

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

Since you don't consider NextAlarm as a real solution, do you mind sharing a couple of examples of "real monitoring solutions" that you are referring to?

http://www.copsmonitoring.com/home.html

http://www.monitronics.com/

 

[Jreigner]

My suggestion, pay for a real monitoring solution or just do free messaging from your control panel and hope for the best. After all, its only life safety.

Since you don't consider NextAlarm as a real solution, do you mind sharing a couple of examples of "real monitoring solutions" that you are referring to?

http://www.copsmonitoring.com/home.html

http://www.monitronics.com/

I would also like to state,I will not replying to this thread any longer, its not that I don't have more to say, it has just come to my attention I am in the wrong place.

 

[sic0048]

I would also like to state,I will not replying to this thread any longer, its not that I don't have more to say, it has just come to my attention I am in the wrong place.

Well even though I have been one to call you out on a number of things, I certainly don't wish you to go storming off. I'd love to see a change of attitude, but perhaps that will come with time. In several posts, I've said that I believe you are a person with a lot of knowledge to offer, but simply a confrontational attitude.

I'm not trying to pick I fight with this line of questioning here - but what makes the two companies you linked to any different from NetAlarm?

According to Cops, as a third party central station, they do not own, install, or service any subscriber accounts directly, these steps are accomplished by the alarm dealers. So a person cannot deal directly with Cops. They have to go through another service to get to the Cops monitoring.

Monotronics similarly is where an independant local dealer will install a system and then turn over monitoring to Monotronics.

Both of these business models are not viable for the majority of users on this forum because we already have systems. The reason why people like NetAlarm is that they allow a person that already has an alarm system to get access to a professional monitoring station. With both Cops and Monotronics, you must use one of their local installers and the equipment they provide in order to get monitoring. For many of us on this forum, that isn't an option. We already have ELK or HAI automation systems installed and we are not going to replace them with another system simply to get monitoring.

So it's not that Cops or Monotronics is better or worse than an option like NetAlarm, but it's what is available to the majority of the users on this forum.

To be honest with you, if you had taken a little time to get a feel for the average person on this forum before jumping in and making all the strong statements you started out with, perhaps you would understand what the majority of users on this forum have system wise. That is why you've caused such a reaction to your initial posts. You haven't taken enough time to understand the users here before making sweeping recommendations that don't really even apply to many of us.

Again, I have nothing against you - I don't even know you. But in the same way you don't know us or our situation and therefore should step back and learn a little about us before charging in like a bull in a china shop.

 

[twilo123]

my brother and uncle do alarms for about 20 years now and they both use monitronics these days for their monitoring contracts. my uncle had several ADT dealerships in the 90's with about 40,000 accounts at the height of the business. we had no real problem with either for monitoring although we have seen some interesting issues come up on occasion.

 

[jmark71]

My own .02 on Monitronics...

I ended up with them after I moved into my previous house and my 3-year contract with the original firm got sold to them. I didn't have an issue with their performance (not that I ever had a cause for them to actually respond thankfully), but their customer service with respect to billing left a LOT to be desired. After promising to honor the contract they were still holding me too, which included a provision NOT to increase the monthly rate, they instead ignored that little provision and tried to raise the rate THREE times in one year. The first two times, I was able to convince them that they were breaking the contract and they backed down. The third time, they refused to back down. Since they broke the contract, I simply walked. Despite their protestations that I'd owe them an early-termination fee, I never did get a bill for one. Obviously, this firm left a sour taste in my mouth, so I'd certainly never use them again, and of course being (somewhat) more knowledgeable now I'd probably avoid them anyway and go with someone like NextAlarm.

 

[Kevin L]

I think the monitoring is worth it for the discount on my insurance

My discount for having an alarm system isn't that large, but maybe that is why my insurance company is still in business?

State Farm to Drop Discounts on Alarms in Florida on Nov. 1
Insurance company can no longer afford to offer discounts to homeowners with security systems.
http://www.cepro.com/article/state_farm_to...orida_on_nov_1/

I suspect this is probably just a financial trick to make more money without going through the legal hassle of a rate increase. Of course, it could be due to the high number of customers with security systems (or claiming to have one) such that it affects their statistics.

In Florida, State Farm has dropped all homeowner policy discounts that are not required by law. Wind mitigation discounts are still given, but multi-policy discounts, alarm discounts, renewal discounts, etc. are being removed as policy removes. State Farm of Florida has consistently been denied rate increases by Kevin McCarty, the insurance czar of Florida. They are negotiating an exit plan with McCarty and may end up cancelling all homeowners insurance in Florida. Florida's homeowners insurance market is a mess, primarily because of moves by Charlie Crist and Kevin McCarty that are more political than sensible.

With most companies, discounts for centrally-monitored burglar and fire alarms range from 5% to 20%.

Kevin

 

[Kevin L]

Since others are posting links, I'll add the alarm sevice I use. They are local to my home, but offer nationwide monitoring. I've been to their facility. They are UL certified and do all their own monitoring at the Port Charlotte location. I have an Elk M1G in my home and they do cellular monitoring of my system. My alarm has gone off a couple of times, and within 15 seconds my phone is ringing.

I don't know all their costs, but I believe POTS monitoring is $19.99/mo. I pay $26.95/mo for the cellular. Don't know what IP costs. This is probably higher than NexAlarm, but I've been very impressed with the service and don't mind paying a little more.
Here's the link:

Security Alarm Corp

Kevin

 

[AceCannon]

I'm replacing my ADT system with the Elk M1G -- love the automation capabilities. Since the M1g can call, text, and/or email me, my cell, my neighbors, and relatives, I'm wondering if I really need to pay AlarmRelay or NextAlarm the $18/ month to answer the phone when I'm not home. I've had ADT for 8 years, and no alarms yet.

Any thoughts on whether to self-monitor versus paying someone else to monitor as well?

M1G: I installed mine myself (except for window/door sensors) this summer and it has been great.

M1G calling, texting, emailing: Look into the M1EXP's emailing abilities carefully. There are only slots for 16 emails: that is, 16 addresses and an associated canned message for each address. So separate notifications for your email and SMS, for armed and disarmed, for instance, would eat up 4 slots. Furthermore, the setup for the M1XEP's emailing is not what I would consider straitforward. Most of the SMTP servers now need encryption, and it complicates things. Many here have got it working, but I am not one of them.

NextAlarm: I signed up and easily got everything configured without ever speaking to a person. Emails and SMS are straightforward and can be setup for many different events. All my test signals were reflected on their website in seconds. I had one false alarm when I was using the Java applet to browse my thermostats. Playing with the security section, I clicked F1 on the screen, thinking it would want me to "press" it a second time to confirm a fire alarm (as the keypads themselves do by default). Wrong. Instant fire alarm. Loud industrial klaxon sound at 1:00am while wife and baby slept. I entered my code within 5 seconds, thinking I would avert central monitoring notification. But the monitoring station called me within 15 seconds of the alarm, asked if there was a fire, asked for the password, etc. Very professional.

I have no complaints with the M1G or NextAlarm.