My post over on HST about new plugin prices..

jwilson56

Senior Member
Well smee welcome to the club.... I hope you now see why some of us are a bit ticked off as their attitude. Imagine how many man hours all of us have spent helping each other as well as newbies that HST never had to deal with. What gratitude!!!

John
 

smee

Senior Member
I still don't mind the price increase that much (although I'd rather it didn't happen, of course). People don't have to sell plugins through HST. I don't mind them not telling us why they increase the price - it's their business (literally).

But, I do think Rich needs to realize what a resource he has in the forum. I doubt HST would be around without the support provided by users for users. There's no way a small company could keep up with the demand.
 

justonemore

Active Member
Please notice my signature change on the HS board. Thinking of leaving their forum to the wayside. Lets let HST do their own support from now on.
 

sbessel

Active Member
I think his reply caused even more damage, it showed a FU attitude towards us users, users that have made the product better by additional software, free and otherwise, and users that have made the product better and more stable by beta testing new and existing code. I think there would not be an issue if they offered stellar support through their help desk, or over the phone, but they do not. I have had tickets that sit unsolved and unresponded for months. This is in the base system, not related to plug-ins. The current forum offers excellent support in most areas, and most of the support is from it's members and not the HS staff.

Now if they decided to increase prices for software they wrote that would be one thing, but it is software they had no involvement in.

I for one feel that if they felt it cost money for these people to put their plug-ins into the updater and put a spot in the forums, then they should directly charge the developer a one-time fee, I.E. $100 to put their plug-in into the system. Then the developer can then decide on their own price and when or if they will profit.

Now I am in no way saying HS does not offer support, but I feel they do not offer enough dedicated support to these non-HS plug-ins to justify locking their price to the consumers.

If HS wants to make money then I would have no issue paying a yearly subscription for a dedicated support section of the forum, but if that were the case I would expect some level of support directly from HS and not just the users. I for one like this method as I feel that seeing the problems and resolutions from HS posted may save everyone a lot of time and troubles. The regular board is great, but it is not always correct in it's solutions, many times I have been sent on a wild goose chase by a helpful forum user. I have no issues with this as it was free, and my option.

I for one have provided many free scripts, and as much support to these as I can. If I had the time I would do the same for plug-ins.

I am one of the few that is trying to make money with HS as a consultant/integrator. I can say that what I need is stability and support and if HS was doing this to provide better support and stability I would be 100% behind it. But that is not the case.
 

justonemore

Active Member
Here's my new generic reply to someone who posts for help on the HS forum:

"FILL OUT A TROUBLE TICKET"

Although that would only hurt the requestor. But maybe if HST got flooded with tickets for a few days. Nah....they prob wouldn't take care of them all anyways.

Just thinking out loud
 

BraveSirRobbin

Moderator
Guys, guys, guys:

Lets all take a deep breath and calm down a bit. I read Rich's response and I'm not getting this strong of an opinion as some of you.

Sometimes when people post a response you might not be "reading" the true meaning or tone they are trying to convey. I'm sure Rich and Rick are very appreciative of the help their membership gives on their forums. If not, why would they have bothered going through the trouble of providing a new forum (software)?

I believe they are sincere people and while we might not agree on their pricing structure, I feel that they are very supportive and recognize the contribution from their members/users. I also feel that Rich was a little "frustrated" in his response, maybe rightfully so, but that will always be the "kiss of death" whenever you post with this mindset.

(And no, I am not running for office) :D

I don't agree with all the decisions made by Homeseer, but I also do not doubt their genuine attitude towards us. Again, just my opinion here!!

BSR
 

Skibum

Senior Member
The forum is not provided for us, it is made available as a tool to HST's benefit! This is not a liability for HST, it is (or was) it's main strength.
 

justonemore

Active Member
And I think they started the new forum to save money. Remember that was their main bitch about what was posted and such?
 

Rauco

Member
I'd just hate to see this cause problems with the community itself. HS is a great program, but the community makes it worth owning.

Like BSR said, I think some posts, by both sides of the issue were made in haste and/or anger, but let's not let this ruin the way we help each other.
 

jlehnert

Active Member
I have to agree with BSR.

You guys need to cut down on the testoterone a bit and step back for a moment. Rich has NOT told everyone (or anyone) to go F*** themselves. It's obvious he is a little put out by all the criticism, but that is his perogative. (Besides, he's probably still hung over like the rest of us). :D As someone who has a VERY poison pen, I know how easy it is to dash off a terse message that is interpreted in completely different ways than intended. I took his message to mean something more along the lines of a fustrated "I can't keep everyone happy".

As for the HS BBS, it's funny how quickly everyone forgets all the complaints about InfoPop, and decide that HS moved the board "to save money". Tons of people (including many posters on this board), pushed HS to move the BBS in response to problems with Infopop (outages, slow response, forced upgrades to buggy software, etc). IIRC the actual move was forced by InfoPop when they refused to give the BBS any more space.

Yes, the way the price change was annouced and explained left a lot to be desired. And Ski is right when he complains about how the "sharing" on the board seems to have decreased remarkably. How many weeks went by before anyone realized the script archive had been lost during the board move? Not a good sign. But Rich and HSTech giving everyone the NY Taxi Salute? I don't think so.
 

JeffCharger

Active Member
Gee, I guess I am one of the guys that Smee is indicating his displeasure at my "old times" and "sharing" comments!

I simply think that the community used to be much more helpful when everyone seemed to enjoy helping others in getting their systems setup and working nicely. I benefited greatly from the help and advice of others. I've contributed where I can, but am frankly not good enough to help those other than the newbies.

I certainly agree that without the HS board and the assistance I received, I wouldn't be where I am today, and quite possibly would have given up or stagnated in my implementation. I think HST would be missing the boat if they lost the support of the community - it's the biggest sellling factor that they have. If you think about it, if they lost the support of maybe 10-15 key users on that BB they wouldn't have much support left.

I'm not opposed to paying for plug-ins, but I think they have lost a MAJOR benefit associated with the old script sharing. But then again - maybe I'm just a cranking oldtimer :D
 

Rupp

Senior Member
WOW! I just re-read this entire conversation and it amazes me what I read. I agree that Rich could have stated his remarks in a more "user friendly" way but guys try on his shoes for one moment. You simply try raising prices a bit to cover the cost of a new employee and a new PC or 2 for hosting a good BB and all of us start complaining to no end. We all complained for months about the old BB and they got us a new one. Are we never happy. I'm sure if all 9000 of us HS BB users had gotten together we could not have come up with a plan that would have suited users any better. They made a decision and it upset us. Simple as that. The plugin writers can always sell their wares on their own site if the new structure offends them.
The more I read the more I can totally understand Rich's comments. It's their business and they can run it exactly as they want. They do provide the BB for us and while we like to think we own it because we put so much work into it the BB still belongs to HST to do as they please. We need to remember who owns what and take this in stride.
How we handle our frustration is up to us but I would hope that we are all mature enough to roll with the changes and get back to having fun and sharing those ideas with one another.
 
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