Newbie Question: What's up with SmartHome prices?

[JeffVolp]

As stupid as I think this change is, and as annoying I found updating servers and fixing software, and as mad as I was at the legislature for doing it, I admin, they did it and the fixes had to be done. That's an obligation a company that deals with software or firmware has. Yes, it costs money. It's a cost of doing business.

I must disagree with you here. We design equipment based on the information we have available. Prices are set so the company can remain in business, and hopefully even make a profit. Competition in a capitalistic society makes that tough, especially when people are accustom to buying cheap stuff made in China.

So now the lawmakers come along and change the rules. Newly designed equipment should accommodate the change (and perhaps even allow for a rollback in case the lawmakers recognize the error they made). A simple change to a couple of equates in a program is one thing, but an update to hard-coded firmware is something else entirely. Why should the company eat the expense of updating equipment designed prior to the change?

Jeff

 

[Herdfan]

A simple change to a couple of equates in a program is one thing, but an update to hard-coded firmware is something else entirely. Why should the company eat the expense of updating equipment designed prior to the change?

I may be wrong here, but I think he was referring to SH Manager and its inability to handle the DST change. This is not firmware, but a software program and the change should have been an easy fix.

Why should a company do it? Goodwill pure and simple. How many customers did SH lose because they were unwilling to make a simple change? Will those lost customers cost the company more in the long run that the cost of the fix? I don't know and neither do you.

You refer to the $4000 cost for MS exchange. But MS also not only extended the warranty on my XBox, but they sent me a check for the cost of an out-of-warranty repair I had paid for.

 

[MikeB]

You refer to the $4000 cost for MS exchange. But MS also not only extended the warranty on my XBox, but they sent me a check for the cost of an out-of-warranty repair I had paid for.

I don't even know what the SmartHome Manager is, so I can't comment on that...

But I think comparing support for a current product (an Xbox/Xbox 360) to one years ago is apples and oranges. Microsoft had a relatively high percentage of failures initially with the Xbox 360, and extending the warranties and/or paying for repairs on those units was a smart decision to keep early adopters happy, and make consumers thinking of buying the same product feel OK about it.

Going back and writing a free patch for an outdated product no longer being supported is another thing. I don't think Microsoft charging $4000 for a patch was reasonable, but $200-$500 might not have been out of line.

Now I have no idea if SmartHome Manager is unsupported, old, or whatever... but assuming it's a current product it certainly would have been nice for them to write a patch.

If it's an old unsupported product, I'd expect to have to adjust my timers manually, or possibly pay for an update (if there was one).

 

[Digger]

A simple change to a couple of equates in a program is one thing, but an update to hard-coded firmware is something else entirely. Why should the company eat the expense of updating equipment designed prior to the change?

I may be wrong here, but I think he was referring to SH Manager and its inability to handle the DST change. This is not firmware, but a software program and the change should have been an easy fix.

Why should a company do it? Goodwill pure and simple. How many customers did SH lose because they were unwilling to make a simple change? Will those lost customers cost the company more in the long run that the cost of the fix? I don't know and neither do you.

You refer to the $4000 cost for MS exchange. But MS also not only extended the warranty on my XBox, but they sent me a check for the cost of an out-of-warranty repair I had paid for.

When a mfg stands behind their product they gain customer loyalty. Herdfans example above is exactly what builds a customer base rather than erode it. Sometimes doing the right thing costs you today but builds future profits. Of course there is a limit what a mfg can sometimes do.

In all fairness to SH they have eaten a small (or large) fortune in exchanging defective products when it comes to Insteon. Granted a lot of it is their fault but probably not all of it. Should they have fixed the software..... hell yes in my opinion.

Should a mfg change the design of a product once they know of an up and coming change such as DST? In my opinion yes and they should rework any existing stock. If its already out there and cant be updated then its a tough call. Two years notice is nothing for products with a life expectancy exceeding that.

 

[JeffVolp]

A simple change to a couple of equates in a program is one thing, but an update to hard-coded firmware is something else entirely. Why should the company eat the expense of updating equipment designed prior to the change?

I may be wrong here, but I think he was referring to SH Manager and its inability to handle the DST change. This is not firmware, but a software program and the change should have been an easy fix.

Since the manager software works through the SmartHome PowerLinc line interface, are you certain there is no aspect of the DST change hard-coded into the firmware? If only in software, and the original programmer is still available, then what you say is true.

You refer to the $4000 cost for MS exchange. But MS also not only extended the warranty on my XBox, but they sent me a check for the cost of an out-of-warranty repair I had paid for.

That was someone else who provided the info on MS exchange. I think we can agree that MS has more resources to handle this type of problem than SmartHome. And their model of forcing us to buy their new operating systems by discontinuing security support after a few years guarantees a continual revenue pipeline. I would bet that SmartHome would be much more responsive if you had to pay them an annual "maintenance" fee.

Jeff

 

[Herdfan]

I don't even know what the SmartHome Manager is, so I can't comment on that...

Now I have no idea if SmartHome Manager is unsupported, old, or whatever... but assuming it's a current product it certainly would have been nice for them to write a patch.

If it's an old unsupported product, I'd expect to have to adjust my timers manually, or possibly pay for an update (if there was one).

Smarthome Manager is the X10 version of Houselinc. It is a current product SH is selling today: http://www.smarthome.com/1132cdp.html It controls X10 devices which SH is also still selling.

There is a thread about this on SH Forum: http://www.techmall.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID...amp;whichpage=1

 

[Lagerhead]

Now I have no idea if SmartHome Manager is unsupported, old, or whatever...

It's still in the catalog. In fact, they will sell you a 7-year warranty on it if you buy it today.
http://www.smarthome.com/1132cu.html

The DST issue is documented here:
http://smarthome.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/smar...hp?p_faqid=1635

As for the 1132CU -- except that you have to be around during DST changes, and except that I am on my second unit (the first one failed in service), and except that another message board discussion suggests that its performance goes to hell long before reaching the 1,000-command limit -- it's a nifty little device.

 

[MikeB]

In my opinion, they should have a blurb about the DST issue right on the product page warning any new purchasers that it's a legacry product and that there's no update planned.

 

[Herdfan]

In my opinion, they should have a blurb about the DST issue right on the product page warning any new purchasers that it's a legacry product and that there's no update planned.

But then they wouldn't sell as many? :unsure:

 

[coppercox]

I finally got off the fence and decided on Insteon several months ago (I purchased about $500 worth of Insteon products.) I got their most recent catalog in the mail and noticed prices were back to where they were several months prior so I went back online to SH and put in my order using the catalog item numbers: I figured I was getting a discount...luckily I double checked the price and noticed that SH wasn't honoring their catalog prices... I left SH website without making a purchase...regardless why the prices weren't honored it left me with a bad vibe...I will get back on the fence and see where they go in the next few months. They have reached a price threshold that allows me to consider other lighting technologies.
Just my two cents worth as a newbie!

 

[Digger]

I finally got off the fence and decided on Insteon several months ago (I purchased about $500 worth of Insteon products.) I got their most recent catalog in the mail and noticed prices were back to where they were several months prior so I went back online to SH and put in my order using the catalog item numbers: I figured I was getting a discount...luckily I double checked the price and noticed that SH wasn't honoring their catalog prices... I left SH website without making a purchase...regardless why the prices weren't honored it left me with a bad vibe...I will get back on the fence and see where they go in the next few months. They have reached a price threshold that allows me to consider other lighting technologies.
Just my two cents worth as a newbie!

Thats what they dont get. They are starting to price themselves out of the market since they are at or near teh pricepoint of other mfg's that are more reliable and/or have more features.

 

[lazyone]

Thats what they dont get. They are starting to price themselves out of the market since they are at or near teh pricepoint of other mfg's that are more reliable and/or have more features.

That is exactly why I stopped purchasing Insteon. In my view, they no longer have any cost or technical advantages.