Possible solution to use existing interconnected smoke alarms to trigger event
- Thread starter pkarmouche
- Start date
ControlFreak
New Member
Just finishing up a new house build.
We fought and lost the code battle about using alarm-panel smoke/heat detectors INSTEAD of high voltage (HV) ones.
But:
1. I have (IN ADDITION to the HV smokes) installed some alarm-panel (AP) heat detectors in some areas where I don't have high-voltage smokes (kitchen, laundry rooms, mech room, where HV was not required).
2. My HV system is Kidde and I have installed their SM120X relay into the HV smoke which is closest to my alarm panel (I prewired from that smoke to my alarm panel). This allows a HV smoke alarm to close a relay as a zone input to my (HAI) alarm panel. This is not a "hack".
Nothing about my code says you can't add AP heat detectors AFTER you have met code requirements with HV smokes. Nothing in my code says I can't have the HV smokes talk trigger my alarm panel.
I haven't decided what to do with that trigger yet. I will probably send it to the central station (and to myself as a call). The suggestion for turning lights on in a bedroom or near an exit is fine, but what if no one is home?
I didn't realize, but have taken to heart the theme on this thread that HV smokes are prone to false alarms. For me I think I'll start with notifying the central station (who can notify fire department). If I have too many false alarms, I'll rethink.
I was also planning on closing my 23 motorized windows and skylights.
I like the idea and will add the action of turning off the HVAC (and HRV).
We fought and lost the code battle about using alarm-panel smoke/heat detectors INSTEAD of high voltage (HV) ones.
But:
1. I have (IN ADDITION to the HV smokes) installed some alarm-panel (AP) heat detectors in some areas where I don't have high-voltage smokes (kitchen, laundry rooms, mech room, where HV was not required).
2. My HV system is Kidde and I have installed their SM120X relay into the HV smoke which is closest to my alarm panel (I prewired from that smoke to my alarm panel). This allows a HV smoke alarm to close a relay as a zone input to my (HAI) alarm panel. This is not a "hack".
Nothing about my code says you can't add AP heat detectors AFTER you have met code requirements with HV smokes. Nothing in my code says I can't have the HV smokes talk trigger my alarm panel.
I haven't decided what to do with that trigger yet. I will probably send it to the central station (and to myself as a call). The suggestion for turning lights on in a bedroom or near an exit is fine, but what if no one is home?
I didn't realize, but have taken to heart the theme on this thread that HV smokes are prone to false alarms. For me I think I'll start with notifying the central station (who can notify fire department). If I have too many false alarms, I'll rethink.
I was also planning on closing my 23 motorized windows and skylights.
I like the idea and will add the action of turning off the HVAC (and HRV).
tmbrown97
Senior Member
Treo - yes - if you can modify that to trigger a relay, then yes you can hook it into a zone on the elk. It looks like it triggers multiple flashes, so you'll want to set up some rules so that you don't get an email for every time the lights would have flashed.
DEL - I think you misunderstood part of that - my point was that I *would* always use firewire, maintain proper separation of terminals, install outlets and adapters properly, etc... but that I *would not* stress over not using a UL bracket, etc. The rest of what you said might be valid if someone was altering a required Fire protection system, but that's not what anyone is asking about here. In fact, in this particular case, that's the furthest thing possible from what he's trying to do - he's keeping 100% total physical separation between his approved/installed smoke detectors and looking for a way to signal his automation panel... and as long as he doesn't trigger an emergency response, there's nothing in the world wrong with what he's asking to do.
You do bring up a point worth mentioning - about what happens to the house *after* - but I'd bet the vast majority of people here would rip out all the weirdness and just put their systems back to the very basics - a security system and maybe automated lighting, but would likely take out any weird rigged devices and any excess. If they didn't, they'd likely scare off any potential buyers. Nobody wants to buy a home full of weird automation that they don't understand and wouldn't know how to work on. When I sell this house, it'll have a basic alarm panel with no real add-ons, all clean and properly dressed; everything custom or not up to code will be removed (the only thing not up to code is my fireplace control); and I'll give the homebuyer the option of keeping the lighting or having it put back to original by a licensed electrician. I doubt many people here would be dumb enough to sell their house with anything left in that would create a liability.
DEL - I think you misunderstood part of that - my point was that I *would* always use firewire, maintain proper separation of terminals, install outlets and adapters properly, etc... but that I *would not* stress over not using a UL bracket, etc. The rest of what you said might be valid if someone was altering a required Fire protection system, but that's not what anyone is asking about here. In fact, in this particular case, that's the furthest thing possible from what he's trying to do - he's keeping 100% total physical separation between his approved/installed smoke detectors and looking for a way to signal his automation panel... and as long as he doesn't trigger an emergency response, there's nothing in the world wrong with what he's asking to do.
You do bring up a point worth mentioning - about what happens to the house *after* - but I'd bet the vast majority of people here would rip out all the weirdness and just put their systems back to the very basics - a security system and maybe automated lighting, but would likely take out any weird rigged devices and any excess. If they didn't, they'd likely scare off any potential buyers. Nobody wants to buy a home full of weird automation that they don't understand and wouldn't know how to work on. When I sell this house, it'll have a basic alarm panel with no real add-ons, all clean and properly dressed; everything custom or not up to code will be removed (the only thing not up to code is my fireplace control); and I'll give the homebuyer the option of keeping the lighting or having it put back to original by a licensed electrician. I doubt many people here would be dumb enough to sell their house with anything left in that would create a liability.
Not trying to fan the flames but" code" rarely lists things you can't do. It does require or specify what you must do. So in connecting HV smoke alarms to a fire alarm system via a relay, show me the listing(s) for type of use. I don't think you will find it.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
pkarmouche
New Member
To be clear, I'm talking about a "hack" to the "lightthatsaveslives" device. It does not connect in any way to the 120v smoke alarms. It is a stand-alone device that simply "listens" for the distinct sound of the alarm blaring. Certainly "code" would not consider a device to be "connected" to the smoke alarms simply because it hears the sound?
Paul
