Starting Over - What would you do?

[mikefamig]

I'm really surprised to hear that people suggesting the M1 as the controller. To be honest, I have never explored that - how do I tie that into a light switch or outlet to control it? I assume this is what you are talking about vs Insteon, and then I use something else for home automation? I also assume you are talking about the J16 programmable outputs? I only see a handful of those, but I am hoping to end up with ~55 devices that are controlled in the end. How does the M1 support that?

 
One way to control/automate lighting is called UPB or Universal Power Bus. It is a technology that uses existing AC wiring in your house to communicate between devices installed in that system. Start by googling Simply Automated UPB and Power Control Systems.
 
The UPB system operates as a lighting control system independent from the Elk to control AC loads. You simply replace your existing light switches and outlets with UPB switches and outlets and then program them using software on your computer. Any UPB switch can be programmed to control any one or more UPB outlets or switches in the system.
 
With the UPB devices installed your Elk can communicate with and control the UPB devices through an M1 serial port to a UPB adapter that is plugged into an AC outlet where it sends commands over the AC wires to the devices.
 
Mike.
 
 

What 3rd party HA do you recommend? I do like eKeypad for me, but just wish I could customize it more for the wife. I hate that it seems that I have to sacrifice functionality for design in the HA world.
 
Can any of this tie into Hue/LIFX/etc... ? I really like the idea of colored lights :0

 

[drvnbysound]

As far as I know there is no interface between Elk and Hue products...  which is why I would stay with something Elk supported natively (e.g. UPB, Zwave, etc) unless you plan on using a separate HA controller to handle HA control of them. Yes, eKeypad provides an interface for Hue, but it's really just a gloried remote if that's all you're going to do.
 
http://www.elkproducts.com/_literature_65457/M1_Integration_at_a_Glance

 

[Dean Roddey]

It's fairly typical to layer a software based automation system over a hardware substrate like the Elk, Omni or RadioRA2 systems. What the hardware system can't handle directly the automation system generally can. So, for instance, though you probably don't want to use Hue as your main lighting system, but it's definitely an option to use it for special purpose or mood lighting, and just let the higher level automation system handle that bit. The automation system will also typically provide the fancy touch screens, media management stuff, audio/video type control (which the embedded systems aren't really that into), text to speech, voice control and so forth. It can coordinate both those things managed by the hardware layer and those things it handles directly, bringing them together into a cohesive whole.

 

[bbrendon]

I hate to sound picky, but the WAF of that is completely crap. No icons, inconsistent button sizes, text that doesn't specify the action (F1, F2, F3???). I know I didn't specify above, and this is a great solution, so big props, but I doubt my wife would even use that. I've tried it before and it was so unintuitive on where to find things.

Use something that disarms by detecting her phone. All you have to do is wake up the phone.

 

[bbrendon]

It's fairly typical to layer a software based automation system over a hardware substrate like the Elk, Omni or RadioRA2 systems. What the hardware system can't handle directly the automation system generally can. So, for instance, though you probably don't want to use Hue as your main lighting system, but it's definitely an option to use it for special purpose or mood lighting, and just let the higher level automation system handle that bit. The automation system will also typically provide the fancy touch screens, media management stuff, audio/video type control (which the embedded systems aren't really that into), text to speech, voice control and so forth. It can coordinate both those things managed by the hardware layer and those things it handles directly, bringing them together into a cohesive whole.

+1
I agree with this. Get the cheapest crap alarm system you can and integrate it into a software system. Spend your money/time getting the software to do more automation.

 

[IVB]

My wife HATES using any Home Automation apps, despite her having 300+ on her iPhone for everything under the sun. She's very tech savvy (marketing person so not remotely a techie) but has no interest in it.
 
But...The Amazon Echo has changed all that. She doesn't need to use an app at all, she just uses her voice. Now things like arming the security system, turning heat up/down, lights on/off are all self-managed from wherever she is. Hence, if you want to focus on WAF, start with how *she* would prefer to interact. If its via voice, get whatever works with the Echo (or an intermediary like CQC, homeseer, whatever). I route everything through CQC to keep the interaction consistent, its always "Alexa, tell jarvis to ____". That way there's no confusion.
 
We have a 1700sqft house but it has 9 different rooms (>100 year old craftsman). I own 2 Echo's, and just bought 2 dots. I'll likely buy a 3rd echo, which will blanket the house with voice control & feedback capabilities.  
 
Here's my printed cheat sheet of commands. I print one out and put in each room with an Echo. We almost never look at it, just when I expand the system. Today was adding in the ability to have the Echo start up a playlist in any room (via the in-ceiling speakers & sonos connect). We have ethnic names, so CQC allows a remapping. IE, we can keep my Spotify playlist as "Viveks playlist" and have the echo command be "Alexa, tell jarvis to play vicks list in the kitchen".
 

 

[cobra]

My wife HATES using any Home Automation apps, despite her having 300+ on her iPhone for everything under the sun. She's very tech savvy (marketing person so not remotely a techie) but has no interest in it.
 
But...The Amazon Echo has changed all that. She doesn't need to use an app at all, she just uses her voice. Now things like arming the security system, turning heat up/down, lights on/off are all self-managed from wherever she is. Hence, if you want to focus on WAF, start with how *she* would prefer to interact. If its via voice, get whatever works with the Echo (or an intermediary like CQC, homeseer, whatever). I route everything through CQC to keep the interaction consistent, its always "Alexa, tell jarvis to ____". That way there's no confusion.
 
We have a 1700sqft house but it has 9 different rooms (>100 year old craftsman). I own 2 Echo's, and just bought 2 dots. I'll likely buy a 3rd echo, which will blanket the house with voice control & feedback capabilities.  

Sounds pretty cool.  Although it makes me wonder what happens if I break in to your house and say "Alexa, tell jarvis to disarm"...  I'm mixed on Alexa use for that reason, seems like it doesn't have any hooks for speaker dependence (although maybe that is coming?)  Apple has claimed that Siri will learn your voice and will only respond to you in some cases, although I haven't seen evidence that that actually works yet.  But because I can tie it to a secured device, I'm leaning toward using it for more sensitive commands like security and locks.

 

[IVB]

Sounds pretty cool.  Although it makes me wonder what happens if I break in to your house and say "Alexa, tell jarvis to disarm"...  I'm mixed on Alexa use for that reason, seems like it doesn't have any hooks for speaker dependence (although maybe that is coming?)  Apple has claimed that Siri will learn your voice and will only respond to you in some cases, although I haven't seen evidence that that actually works yet.  But because I can tie it to a secured device, I'm leaning toward using it for more sensitive commands like security and locks.

Disarm doesn't work, only arm. Benefit of using an intermediary like CQC. And honestly if you come near my house with the intention of breaking in, you're going to kick the door or Windows in.

 

[rayzor]

Disarm doesn't work, only arm. Benefit of using an intermediary like CQC. And honestly if you come near my house with the intention of breaking in, you're going to kick the door or Windows in.

 
This guy gets it. I like to discuss my home automation and security with friends, and they always come up with scenarios on how to defeat my system - i'd use a ladder and climb onto your deck 22 feet up because you don't have that door secure. I'd wear a ski mask and spray your cameras, and so on and so on.
 
If somebody wants to break in and steal stuff, go for it, I don't care. My homeowners insurance will reimburse me. I get a discount for having it secured. If somebody wants to break in and harm me, they are going to get in and do it quick and get away before anything can be done about it, and I am still harmed. Or if they will really want to harm me they will wait until I leave the house. 
 
All it is is a deterrent. A lock only keeps an honest man out.

 

[cobra]

Disarm doesn't work, only arm. Benefit of using an intermediary like CQC. And honestly if you come near my house with the intention of breaking in, you're going to kick the door or Windows in.

Haha, that's why I said "I wonder".  I noticed it wasn't on your command list.
 
I'm not sure why you'd equate breaking in with disarming though.  If someone disarms your alarm, the reason to rush drops dramatically in a theft or any other unwanted access.

 

[IVB]

I'm not sure why you'd equate breaking in with disarming though.  If someone disarms your alarm, the reason to rush drops dramatically in a theft or any other unwanted access.

 
Sorry, was just responding to this, thought you were equating it:
 

Although it makes me wonder what happens if I break in to your house and say "Alexa, tell jarvis to disarm"

 

[BaduFamily]

but doesn't this require a round trip to Amazon?

But...The Amazon Echo has changed all that. She doesn't need to use an app at all, she just uses her voice. Now things like arming the security system, turning heat up/down, lights on/off are all self-managed from wherever she is. Hence, if you want to focus on WAF, start with how *she* would prefer to interact. If its via voice, get whatever works with the Echo (or an intermediary like CQC, homeseer, whatever). I route everything through CQC to keep the interaction consistent, its always "Alexa, tell jarvis to ____". That way there's no confusion.

 

[IVB]

but doesn't this require a round trip to Amazon?

 
Yes, AmazonEcho->Cloud->House.  I have a video uploaded to my YouTube channel, its subsecond response time.
 
I'm not one of these "cloud durn bad yukkie" folks. If you think the NSA doesn't already know who you are, where you go, what do you do, who you talk to, and the contents of every single unecrypted item on your machine, you're living in the past. We lost our privacy after 9/11, I may as well get some convenience out of it.

 

[Del91574]

The only bad thing about the cloud is when the support or product goes away. It happens. Often. You only need to think about and be sure what you're investing in can be easily replaced or if your entire system depends on the cloud.

 

[cobra]

The only bad thing about the cloud is when the support or product goes away. It happens. Often. You only need to think about and be sure what you're investing in can be easily replaced or if your entire system depends on the cloud.

Yeah.  Or the network has an issue.  Or the provider has some latency...
 
Cloud can be really cool.  It's just not always there.