Which is a better integrated package? HAI Omni IIe vs ELK M1 Gold

nethed

Member
Hello all,  
 
Forgive if this has been discussed before, but I've been a lurker for a while.
 
I did as much research as I could. But I would love to start a new thread and hopefully contribute with my questions. 
I've read many threads often lump the two controllers into one category. Similarly, I've studied the Google Doc comparison of controllers. 
 
After all that, I still have some seemingly simple questions, but first some background.
I've got an existing Brinks system that has some sensors installed, and two control panels around the house. I don't want to activate it with ADT, but instead want to reuse as much as possible with either a ELK M1 or a HAI Omni system.
Incidentally, I'm more familiar with HAI, as my parents house has a OnQ system recently updated to a HAI system. 
 
Now the questions. I realize I might start a flame war, but I'm just looking for knowledgeable opinions. 
 
Which system will give a more unified experience between Home Automation and Security? 
 
What signalling technology (Zigbee, Zwave, Insteon) is most LIKELY to be futureproof and expandable?
 
What apps do you use for remote control on your Android phone? 
 
Any chance to reuse the existing control panels from the Brinks system?
 
Instead of buying/wiring additional control panels, I want to just wall mount cheap Android Tablets. Any suggestions on possible problems?
 
Thanks for any help!
 
Forgive the lack of links, I don't have the clout to do so yet!!
 
 
This question comes up a lot and the answer depends on what are the user's goals. The two systems are very similar at the core and differ by a few features, so the choice will ultimately converge to what of those features are preferred. For example, your choice of lighting technology can tip the scale one way or another. HAI is a best choice for RadioRA, Centralite and HLC and it does not support Insteon. Elk supports Insteon, and both do X10, UPB and Z-wave. HAI is best integrated with iOS devices via Haiku, it also provides Android support, but it is very primitive. Elk has a better android app, but it is not as good as Haiku without push notifications. HAI supports digital humidity sensors, Elk has a "fast" zone for pulse counters and has more pure security features, etc.
 
Thank you Picta for the very helpful reply.
 
Because my family has migrated to Android devices at this time, I think I'll end up going with the Elk. 
 
Do you have any opinions on impending obsolescence? I can practically HEAR the home automation revolution coming down the pike, and I'd prefer to have a signalling technology (Zwave, Insteon, etc) that won't be outmoded.  
 
Also, Belkin WeMo looks interesting, but I gather it is very incompatible with existing hardware. 
 
Personally, I don't see either technology going anywhere anytime soon. Having said that, if I had to make a consideration I would look at how many people manufacture Zwave devices and how many make Insteon devices and I think the answer would be pretty clear for me.
 
I'm no fan of WeMo and would not install it in my home. I believe there are some threads here on the forum if you would like to read some responses from other members as well.
 
Here's one: http://cocoontech.com/forums/topic/23026-major-security-flaw-found-in-belkin-wemo-deathtrap/
 
Thanks for your reply drvnbysound,
 
I've read a few articles about both Zwave and Insteon, and I assume you mean that Zwave has a better future. 
 
Can you tell me about your setup? 
 
Also, after reading a bit about WeMo, I think that relying on a third party to stay around for your device to work is frankly stupid. The likelihood that in 10 years, Belkin still supports WeMo is NIL. I plan to still have my outlets in 10 years. 
 
I have installed both and they each and their pros and cons but they are more alike then different.
 
One nice thing about the ELK M1G system is the greater "granularity" of expansion.
 
When you expand the HAI (unless it's changed recently) you can add 1 or 2 daughter boards to the main board, each adding 16 inputs. Or you can add 1 to 3 (if memory serves me) external expansion boards adding 16 inputs and 16 outputs each.
 
With the ELK the expansion boards are smaller and you can choose between input only (16) or output only (16). For the output units you can choose between 16 voltage outputs or 8 voltage outputs and 8 relays.
 
The connections for the HAI boards are screw terminals whereas the ELK use plug-in connectors so if you have to replace a unit, its quick and easy.
 
Using one of the large ELK enclousures you can implement a very extensive system.
 
Thanks Frederick for the input,
 
Regarding M1G expansion, what are my options for having multiple serial devices? 
 
For instance, if I want to connect a Elk M1XEP M1 ethernet port expander and a M1XSLZW M1 to Leviton Z-Wave Interface, what happens?  I tried to find a serial port expander, but when I read the instructions for the ELK-M1XSP Lighting Interface, Thermostat Interface, and Serial Port Expander, I can't understand how it will work. 

As far as I know, RS-232 is not daisy-chainable. 
 
ELK has a serial expansion board, the M1XSP which is used for thermostats, lighting control and general serial port expansion. You can install 7 of these.
 
You can only have one of the M1XEP units as it must connect to the main serial port on the M1G.
 
The M1XSLZW is, in essence, a specialized M1XSP and connects to the data bus in the same way and also counts toward your 7 device limit.
 
I see, so the M1XSP connects to the RS485 bus and gives you a RS232. 

Makes so much more sense! 
 
So to have a network interface with webserver I need the M1XEP connected to the main serial port, then connect a M1XSLSW to the RS485.
 
Awesome. This information is much appreciated!
 
Yes the one and only M1XEP to the main serial port, no more then seven M1XSPs or M1XSLZWs to the data bus.
 
Glad to help.
 
I've got an Elk m1G and Insteon and and ISY994ir Pro.  Since ISY came out with the Elk module I have gotten away from using the Elk as the HA platform and have mostly moved everything to the ISY.  Elk is a great security platform and a rock solid I/O interface.  Putting these two things (ISY/Elk) together is very powerful.  Elk is a not a platform that seems to be doing much evolving when it comes to new technologies and features.  ISY on the other hand adds new feature every couple months.  ISY is also wrapping up their beta testing with zwave.  Presumably, we will be able to do both zwave and Insteon on the same platform soon.  
 
It is true that Insteon is Smartlabs only.  But I don't have much fear of it going under any time soon.  They keep coming out with new devices and are quite engaged with the R and D.  This is not the sign of a company that is dying.  Furthermore, if they did go bankrupt, the Insteon patents would no doubt be sold to someone else who would continue the product line.  There are too many customers out there and the technology not that expensive.  If Smartlabs can't make a profit, someone can. 
 
nethed said:
Thanks for the opinion Lou. How seamless is the ISY to Elk integration? 
 
If I buy the smarthome Elk M1 Gold + ISY bundle, what else do I need?
 
 
That bundle does not include the $99 license that ISY sells to activate the Elk integration.  You might also consider the 994ir pro model of the ISY if you want the IR controllable ISY and if you want to be able to write a huge number of programs and have a few other "pro" level conveniences.  You can always upgrade to the IR version later if you want for $45.  I am not sure if you can upgrade to the pro or if it requires a whole different box.
 
The integration between Elk and ISY is almost 100%.  There really isn't anything you can't connect.  There are a couple things that require a work-around.  Like ISY can't directly trigger an alarm, it requires that you do a "virtual" keypad button press.  But, that is actually better than Elk's built-in programming which can not activate an alarm at all (only zone violations can activate an alarm or actual keypad presses).  There are actually several things that ISY programs can do to Elk that Elk's own programs can't do.  My only notable complaint is that ISY can not directly activate an Elk "task", but there is a work-around.
 
Also, for $49 you can activate the ISY network module license which can extend your Elk/ISY integration to virtually any device that accepts network commands.  With this, ISY can send a myriad of GET, PUT, POST, etc type commands to almost anything that understands such language.  ISY comes with a REST interface as a standard feature if you want other devices to send commands to it.  The network module also activate the ISY's built-in webserver.
 
Back
Top