Which product for lighting control?

alternety said:
RE: Virtual 3 way switch. If that is for me I don't think that is what I am trying to do. I need to do this - existing conventional 5 way lighting circuit. Remove one and only one switch and replace it with a controlled switch for UPB or whatever. Everything works as before but now sixth unrelated remote control can participate in the circuit switching by controlling the one electronic switch in the circuit.

This ought to be simple to make with a relay that simply duplicates the innards of a mechanical 4 way switch.

I noted one thing really useful about the UPB switch - it can be programmed not to dim. It appears to use the neutral so if the TRIAC can survive the inductive loads this solves the problem with using fluorescent lights without risking someone trying to dim them. That is very interesting to me.
I do not think anybody makes an automation switch designed to work with standard mechanical switches in multi-way circuits. What would be the reason for doing that? It can't save any money because a specialized device like that would be very low demand and high cost. Certainly more than the price of 5 $20 Icon switches.

As for your concern about dimming... the safest thing is to just use relay switches. I think a Triac can still have load type issues even if it is set to act as an on/off switch instead of a dimmer.
 
I beleive that non of the UPB manufactures currently build a relay switch, You only have to buy one type of switch and you decice if it is a dimmer or a relay using UPstart.

alternety,

If you did put an automated switch in a circuit as you suggest it would not function if any of the other switches were used, as the power would be cut to the switch.

On the other hand, if there was a switch like that: that revirsed it's state as a 3 way switch does, it might just work, but no one makes such a thing.
 
Event5 said:
I beleive that non of the UPB manufactures currently build a relay switch, You only have to buy one type of switch and you decice if it is a dimmer or a relay using UPstart.
Actually, HAI does make a 15A relay switch. This is a true relay instead of triac based.
 
I understand the strong bias against using X10 due to previous problems, but it can work with virtually 100% reliability. When we built this house almost 4 years ago, we designed the electrical system to be "X10 friendly". That paid big benefits, as there was only one module powering a CF bulb that missed its OFF command a few times a year. Everything else just worked.

I did several things to achieve this reliability. First, I installed that big blocking filter at the main electrical panel to isolate our house from others on the street. Then I arranged the panel so that every circuit that could possibly need X10 control was on the same phase. That's easy to do because adjacent breakers alternate phases, and it just took some wire swaps. The third and most important thing was to run a special circuit throughout the house for loads known to be unfriendly to X10. That powers computers, and most other electronic equipment. That circuit is fed through one of those big 20A filters to isolate it from all other circuits. Then I installed those small Leviton 5-amp in-line filters on every lighting circuit that could use CF bulbs. So those potential problem sources are isolated. Lastly, I installed the older Leviton "red line" X10 switches with gated AGC, and they have worked flawlessly ever since.

We have a large house. One central circuit with 9 X10 devices, including 3 transmitters, read a fairly low .1Vpp, as measured on a ESM1. While still totally reliable at that level, I installed the XTB to boost signal levels throughout the house. Even that one cranky module has been 100% since installing the XTB.

This has provided a very reliable and cost-effective installation.

Jeff
 
Event5 said:
upstatemike,

PCS was forthcoming to me when I asked about the tap delay. They can not set the time any shorter due to the way you enter setup mode. The switch has to wait to see if there are multiple taps coming. (5 taps for setup mode) It is adjusted as tight as they feel they can put it and still go into setup correctly.
I wonder if the next generation of switches will use a separate setup button (similiar to PCS X-10 switches) to get around the issue of identifying a 5 tap setup mode?
 
Hey Jeff,

I like the way that you setup your home to be "X-10 friendly"!

I will be buying a new home in the coming year and I hope that I can work with the builder to integrate some if not all your suggestions.

I had originally thought that I would at least install an X-10 signal trap at the input to the breaker box, a phase to phase X-10 coupler incase I cannot put all of my X-10 modules on the same phase, and a whole house surge protector.

Your way of isolating circuits that can cause X-10 interference and putting your X-10 devices on one breaker where possible is very interesting and is something that I would like to persue when I build my new place.

By the way, the XTB kit that I bought from you is still working fine and I recommend it to anyone who is having X-10 signal strenth problems!

Regards,
TCIII
 
I've also done some circuit optimization for good X-10 operation and signal reliability has been close to %100 ever since. I continue to believe that X-10 has the best bang for the buck and available multivendor support among the available choices. Optimizing just requires a bit of time and planning. An Elk ESM-1 is invaluable for doing this and is a very good investment for anyone who wants to do X-10 right.
 
I too did a similar optimization when I rewired my home last year. I guess I have been one of the few lucky ones with x10, I can't remember when a module last missed a command, and I've been using the same cm11a for the last 7ish years with never a lockup. This is also the fist time I bragged about it's reliability so I'm sure I just killed it... :lol:
 
I forgot about that surge protector. Yes, I installed the Leviton 51110 here.

That special circuit serves a dual purpose. In addition to isolating electronic equipment from the X10 circuits, that special circuit can be fed from a huge UPS if power reliability become a problem.

Jeff
 
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