Wiring ? UPB Light Switch

[slowmo]

I would like to replace a light switch with a SA UPB switch (US2-40) to control a light. The existing light switch has one 14/2 wire coming in the box. The SA instructions show power to the switch with the brown wire out to the light. Do I need to pull another 14/2 line to the box or is the wiring as simple as wire black-to-black and white-to-white?
Thanks,
Scott

 

[nexus99]

Here are some pics from when I replaced a single switch with a HAI dimmer. Hope it helps.

http://www.cocoontech.com/blog/nexusblog/i...hp?showentry=73

 

[fcwilt]

I would like to replace a light switch with a SA UPB switch (US2-40) to control a light. The existing light switch has one 14/2 wire coming in the box. The SA instructions show power to the switch with the brown wire out to the light. Do I need to pull another 14/2 line to the box or is the wiring as simple as wire black-to-black and white-to-white?
Thanks,
Scott

So the switch has both the black and the white wire connected to it?

Typically (at least in my experience) you would have a pair of 14/2 with both blacks connected to the switch and both neutrals connected together.

 

[123]

... The existing light switch has one 14/2 wire coming in the box. ... Do I need to pull another 14/2 line to the box ...

Yes. A PLC switch (i.e. UPB, Insteon, X10, Zwave) has onboard electronics that must be powered in order to receive commands via the power line. There are some variants that can operate without a dedicated power feed (described as "no neutral line required"). They do this trick by allowing a trickle current through the load ... but that can cause CFL lamps to flicker.

One pair supplies power to the switch and the other pair goes to the load.
POWER ====> SWITCH ====> LOAD

What you have is probably this:
POWER ====> LOAD ====> SWITCH

I encountered this situation with several ceiling lights in my home. I terminated the POWER line at the LOAD and ran a new one to the SWITCH:
POWER ====X LOAD ====> SWITCH <==== POWER
Easier said than done.

 

[WayneW]

I would like to replace a light switch with a SA UPB switch (US2-40) to control a light. The existing light switch has one 14/2 wire coming in the box. The SA instructions show power to the switch with the brown wire out to the light. Do I need to pull another 14/2 line to the box or is the wiring as simple as wire black-to-black and white-to-white?

If you only have a single 14/2 in the switch box, then you basically have an input, an output to the lamp and a ground wire. I believe all UPB switches need a neutral wire, which you don't have. So you can either get a neutral wire added to that switchbox or try option B.

Option B would be to find the other end of your switch wires, probably at the lamp. Then you could convert the exist 14/2 into a hot, a neutral and a ground wire to power the UPB switch. The UPB switch would not directly control a load. Then you would add an inline UPB module at the light and use UPstart to have the switch control the inline module.

 

[slowmo]

Sounds like I need to bring a power source to the switch then back to the overhead light.

Last question: on SA US2-40 instruction sheet it states 'DO NOT WIRE HOT!' Here where I show my naïve’, what does that mean? From my point of view the US2-40 always has a load to it.

Thanks,

 

[Monk]

Sounds like I need to bring a power source to the switch then back to the overhead light.

Last question: on SA US2-40 instruction sheet it states 'DO NOT WIRE HOT!' Here where I show my naïve’, what does that mean? From my point of view the US2-40 always has a load to it.

Thanks,

I'm no electrician, but it could mean remove power before wiring the unit. Some people who are more experienced will actually wire switches with the power still on. There is potential to damage these switches when wiring hot.

 

[123]

... remove power before wiring the unit ...

Bingo.

Generally speaking, a DIYer shouldn't perform electrical work with live circuits. Bad things can happen; personal injury or death, damaging your investment in PLC devices, electrical fires, black soot on the walls, etc.

 

[slowmo]

duh... I was looking at the statement as a wiring configuration rather than a statement of caution.

 

[maknoll]

Sounds like I need to bring a power source to the switch then back to the overhead light.

That is correct. I have the same wiring configuration throughout my 2-story. Wiring to the switches consists of a single 12/2 wire w/ground ("switched hot" wire). Almost all of these either come up from the (unfinished) basement or down from the attic. I have found that it is not too difficult to attach a 12/3 w/ground (or 14/3) wire to the existing wire and pull it back up or down to the fixture where I can pick up my neutral.

 

[slowmo]

Is there any problems with picking up a neutral from another eletrical gang box? I did so by pulling a neutral from an adjecent light switch. Or do I need to make sure the neutral is on the same line back to the panel?

Scott

 

[upbphile]

Is there any problems with picking up a neutral from another eletrical gang box? I did so by pulling a neutral from an adjecent light switch. Or do I need to make sure the neutral is on the same line back to the panel?

Scott

Scott,

I have the exact same problem with at least three switches that I attempted to replace recently, and was thinking the same thing: borrowing a neutral from somewhere else. I just don't have enough electrical knowhow to dare try it yet.

I hope there is an easy solution (ie. not having to rewire from the switch to the ceiling lamp), or else I'll end up with lots of UPB switches on Ebay.

Michael

 

[Steve]

DO NOT pull a neutral from someplace else, like another circuit! I'm not an electrician and can't quote code or anything but doing so can cause a shock hazard and is almost certainly against code. If there is a neutral you can grab nearby from the same circuit/breaker then you should be ok but check with a licensed electrician.

 

[Steve]

I hope there is an easy solution (ie. not having to rewire from the switch to the ceiling lamp), or else I'll end up with lots of UPB switches on Ebay.

Just research your options first as there are not alot of good choices that do not require neutrals.

 

[123]

Is there any problems with picking up a neutral from another eletrical gang box? I did so by pulling a neutral from an adjecent light switch. Or do I need to make sure the neutral is on the same line back to the panel?
Scott

Here's the thing, Scott, there's more than one way to do everything. The problem is that some of those variations fall into the category of "Redneck" solutions ... something that works but is clearly jury-rigged and is definitely not "by the book". You'd be hard pressed to find an example of "borrowed neutral lines" in a new home. Maybe you'd find it in an old home, especially if it was owned by a Redneck.

The acceptable solution is to use the same technique an electrician would use if the circuit was being built from scratch: run a power feed directly to the switch. The key is to follow existing practices and not to improvise so as to cause confusion for the next person who services the circuit (or worse, cause a dormant electrical fault that wreaks havoc during the next power surge or ground-fault incident). My motto is clear and simple: never f* with electricity.

Some walls may need surgery to get the job done. If you can't "do the right thing", call in the pros. If the cost is too high, I'm first in line for your UPB gear.